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Matthew Goodwin.....

cantsin

cantsin

Well-Known Member
Can never quite make my mind up with him - like Glenn Greenwald, I get the logic of constantly attacking the hypocrisy of the liberal left, and their obsession with Trump, Farage, Brexit etc, whilst ignoring the shortcomings of HRC / Obomber / New Lab and many more...but does anyone else wonder about his actual politics ( which I don't with GG - possibly mistakenly ) - am sure there's answers out there, but wld be interested to hear opinions.
 
killer b said:
His research is often very useful, but he's a bit of a bellend and seems increasingly ideologically committed to the things he documents. He's made a good living off documenting them, so I guess it's not difficult to understand why... but it's best to read his work with this in mind.
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exactly what it feels like - his politics are starting to go native, the lines between the (essentially right wing ) populism he researches and his politics getting blurrier
 
On TV he doesn’t offer much nuance. He was blabbing on today again about how ‘the left’ won’t ‘allow’ ordinary people to raise fears about immigration, as if the UK has talked about much else this decade.

How could anyone on the left not object to the terms of the asylum/immigration debate as proposed by the right and the media? There has always been a precarcity debate the left would have, but that’s not been the one on offer.
 
cantsin said:
Can never quite make my mind up with him - like Glenn Greenwald, I get the logic of constantly attacking the hypocrisy of the liberal left, and their obsession with Trump, Farage, Brexit etc, whilst ignoring the shortcomings of HRC / Obomber / New Lab and many more...but does anyone else wonder about his actual politics ( which I don't with GG - possibly mistakenly ) - am sure there's answers out there, but wld be interested to hear opinions.
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Huge large scale protests are happening all over the UK this week, yet one could ask where are the similar large scale events for the decimation of communites that is happening with universal credit, the crisis in social care, benefit sanctions, but they are not, a more self aware left/progressive movement would ask the question why they are not, if the fact they aren't happening has a bearing on the popularity of brexit, in poorer areas, and many feeling abandoned. Matthew Goodwin has been saying this in a wider context for sometime, in many ways echoing the more pro working class perspectives/analysis on here
 
Mr Moose said:
On TV he doesn’t offer much nuance. He was blabbing on today again about how ‘the left’ won’t ‘allow’ ordinary people to raise fears about immigration, as if the UK has talked about much else this decade.

How could anyone on the left not object to the terms of the asylum/immigration debate as proposed by the right and the media? There has always been a precarcity debate the left would have, but that’s not been the one on offer.
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Try raising issues like that in an actual left wing meeting.
 
I've seen him speak at quite a few seminars. His data stuff is very good especially on the far right and poplulists and his books are worth a read. One of the things he picked up on was that Corbyn's economic policies are very popular but he also points out that his 'social' policies aren't as popular with many areas of w/class voters . In my opinion there's the rub as it raises issues about immigration, multiculturalism , gender issues etc etc that many on the left take as part and parcel of their territory. There's been a tendency by some on the left not to debate those issues but to try and dismiss by labelling him. He's not an activist ( apart from actively trying to get on the media) he's an academic who probably leans slightly to Labour . Probably he'd be quite happy to have a Denham type role advising Labour . To point out that large sections of the w/class are for receptive to 'left' economic policies whilst at the same time being a little more conservative on 'social ' issues isn't the crime of the century. Yes he's attention seeking but that's the nature of his business world but rather than dismiss him as 'blue Labour' he's stuff is worth a critical read imo even if it challenges liberal left orthodoxy .
 
He's just been banging the same beat on the same drum for seven years or whatever, sometimes he's right and sometimes he's wrong. But at least he doesn't share the same reheated blairism of his mate rob ford
 
The39thStep said:
I've seen him speak at quite a few seminars. His data stuff is very good especially on the far right and poplulists and his books are worth a read. One of the things he picked up on was that Corbyn's economic policies are very popular but he also points out that his 'social' policies aren't as popular with many areas of w/class voters . In my opinion there's the rub as it raises issues about immigration, multiculturalism , gender issues etc etc that many on the left take as part and parcel of their territory. There's been a tendency by some on the left not to debate those issues but to try and dismiss by labelling him. He's not an activist ( apart from actively trying to get on the media) he's an academic who probably leans slightly to Labour . Probably he'd be quite happy to have a Denham type role advising Labour . To point out that large sections of the w/class are for receptive to 'left' economic policies whilst at the same time being a little more conservative on 'social ' issues isn't the crime of the century. Yes he's attention seeking but that's the nature of his business world but rather than dismiss him as 'blue Labour' he's stuff is worth a critical read imo even if it challenges liberal left orthodoxy .
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When he is on TV it seems to be him doing the labelling.
 
The39thStep said:
They shout the loudest tbh
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All our values sound like shouting to someone. People feel hectored by advice about healthy eating. The bar isn’t high. Can’t throw it all in the bin. Have to defend some of it.

No doubt he would say it about Corbyn today.
 
I'm vaguely familiar with his name but couldn't say I was familiar with what he was saying. Just looked up his Twitter feed and he's an active proponent of the whole "dismissing justified concerns about immigration just makes people vote for fascists" / "identity politics" nonsense so he can fuck off. Don't really care if he was sound at one point.
 
Goodwin's essential position is that working class people want economically left (eg downward wealth distribution) but socially conservative political representation. Which is true in some instances but not in others, obviously. So sometimes he's right (and good at pricking the liberal left bubble) and other times he's wrong (and is a dick)
 
The39thStep said:
I've seen him speak at quite a few seminars. His data stuff is very good especially on the far right and poplulists and his books are worth a read. One of the things he picked up on was that Corbyn's economic policies are very popular but he also points out that his 'social' policies aren't as popular with many areas of w/class voters . In my opinion there's the rub as it raises issues about immigration, multiculturalism , gender issues etc etc that many on the left take as part and parcel of their territory. There's been a tendency by some on the left not to debate those issues but to try and dismiss by labelling him. He's not an activist ( apart from actively trying to get on the media) he's an academic who probably leans slightly to Labour . Probably he'd be quite happy to have a Denham type role advising Labour . To point out that large sections of the w/class are for receptive to 'left' economic policies whilst at the same time being a little more conservative on 'social ' issues isn't the crime of the century. Yes he's attention seeking but that's the nature of his business world but rather than dismiss him as 'blue Labour' he's stuff is worth a critical read imo even if it challenges liberal left orthodoxy .
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It's not crime of the century and I fully support his economic message as far as it goes for inequality, however if you read his book UKIP 2015 and National Populism 2018 and look at how he describes things, you get the sense that he also considers migration must be less. His italics for the word destruction in National Populism 2018

Immigration and hyper ethnic change are cultivating strong fears about the possible destruction of the national group's historic identity and established ways of life. These fears are wrapped up in a belief that culturally liberal politicians, transnational organisations and global finance are eroding the nation by encouraging further mass immigration, while 'politically correct' agendas seek to silence any opposition.
 
sihhi said:
It's not crime of the century and I fully support his economic message as far as it goes for inequality, however if you read his book UKIP 2015 and National Populism 2018 and look at how he describes things, you get the sense that he also considers migration must be less. His italics for the word destruction in National Populism 2018

Immigration and hyper ethnic change are cultivating strong fears about the possible destruction of the national group's historic identity and established ways of life. These fears are wrapped up in a belief that culturally liberal politicians, transnational organisations and global finance are eroding the nation by encouraging further mass immigration, while 'politically correct' agendas seek to silence any opposition.
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Thats a useful summary and much of that has been central to his writing for some years since he used data, sampling and opinion polls to look at the BNP victory in Burnley.
 
Could also have gone in the by-election thread...Matthew at his most native:

 
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