Zionists usurped the holocaust

[JimW]

the "hollowcaust"

What a prize cunt.

 

[butchersapron]

How many semi-submeged racists are there floating in the shallow water on these boards right now? Name them here:

ajdown
harrison
wararwsa
scott forester
diego
?

 

[FridgeMagnet]

 

[Jeff Robinson]

...and whilst we're at it, there's been an awful whiff off you for months. I may have commeneted on it before.

The filth are really crawling out of the woodwork on both "sides" now. Seems to be the golden rule of Israel/Palestine online "debates".

FM - kill "HarrisonSlade". Cleanse this place of him. Make him no more - it makes me feel dirty just reading his shit.

 

[agricola]

Poignant. I mean that sincerely. If anybody questions the "official" version of events (Like the earth is not flat it's a sphere) they are condemned to that kind of kneejerk behaviour. Which is why there has been no proper investigation into the "hollowcaust"

There is a really good book called "IBM and the Holocaust" by Edwin Black that details the relationship between IBM, its German subsidiary Dehomag and the Third Reich.

Quite a lot of the end of the book details the scale of the operation in the death camps and the meticulous way in which they were able to count, gather up and execute Jews - and record all of the above - on punchcards, quite a lot of which survived the war (as did Dehomag's records).

 

[untethered]

How many semi-submeged racists are there floating in the shallow water on these boards right now? Name them here:

ajdown
harrison
wararwsa
scott forester
diego
?

Perhaps you could organise a purge.

 

[butchersapron]

I'm trying to. Name names.

 

[HarrisonSlade]

What do you mean by 'hollow' Harrioson?

As has been pointed out, the figure of 10 - 12 million has not been properly substantiated. And as for the Human skin lamp shades and Human bone soap - no proof whatsoever, just a few reports from the Allied Victors not unreputed for their own intense propaganda.

I do not deny the mass slaughters, and brutal tortures. I do not deny that humans were experimented on (many of the results were been used by US scientists straight after the 1940s). I just wish that the word "holocaust" was not used.

 

[ViolentPanda]

I haven't arrived at an opinion. On the contrary. I have only ever seen the 10 - 12 million figure through the media and school. I haven't said that it's right or wrong (although the figure does seem to be a little far fetched), I am just saying "Give me the proof"

Given that I was replying to another poster, why are you assuming that I was referring to you?
get over yourself, or you'll end up with an ego as big as phildwyers'.

 

[butchersapron]

As has been pointed out, the figure of 10 - 12 million has not been properly substantiated. And as for the Human skin lamp shades and Human bone soap - no proof whatsoever, just a few reports from the Allied Victors not unreputed for their own intense propaganda.

I do not deny the mass slaughters, and brutal tortures. I do not deny that humans were experimented on (many of the results were been used by US scientists straight after the 1940s). I just wish that the word "holocaust" was not used.

Which is not an argument that you make by using negationist and holocaust deniers terms that suggest that the holocaust is an empty claim. You're the fraud.

 

[ViolentPanda]

I haven't arrived at an opinion. On the contrary. I have only ever seen the 10 - 12 million figure through the media and school. I haven't said that it's right or wrong (although the figure does seem to be a little far fetched), I am just saying "Give me the proof"

Buy or borrow a copy of the book I mentioned earlier if you want references to substantive evidence.

You won't, though.

 

[JimW]

You know, when considering an unprecedented cold, bureaucratic state-organised attempt to murder en masse not just political opponents, but targeted ethnic groups and others deemed less than human by pseudo-science, the first thing I want to do is quibble about numbers. Oh no, hang on, I'm not a prize cunt.

 

[ViolentPanda]

Yes there was a Israeli on the radio couple of nights ago talking about the brutality of hamas.
And yes she brought up the holocaust and she was nearly crying.
I thought what utter bollocks . Palistinians are going through genocide.And she wanted to talk about the holocaust.
Maybe she should talk about the holocaust that is happening now.

What pisses me off is when you get WW2-vintage Sabras talking about the holocaust, when it barely affected them.

 

[HarrisonSlade]

I hope that's not at me. A troll or a Nazi would sympathise or support Nazism. I am merely questioning figures, and certain other things we are told.

Many records concerning the "holocaust" have not been brought to the public eye. Namely the Gas Chambers. Yes, the Gas Chambers existed, and people were murdered by using them. But who supplied the Chemicals, the buildings, and what happened to them afterwards.

The foundations of "Human Soap" are extremelly flimsy. Why was something so based on speculation later taught in schools?

I am not questioning the photos of the dead or many of the eye witness accounts.

 

[ViolentPanda]

...and whilst we're at it, there's been an awful whiff off you for months. I may have commeneted on it before.

You may have.
Several times.

 

[HarrisonSlade]

Buy or borrow a copy of the book I mentioned earlier if you want references to substantive evidence.

You won't, though.

You presume too much. If it's cheap enough I just might.

 

[JimW]

...I am merely questioning figures, and certain other things we are told...

Is there some lower number or absence of some specific atrocity that would change the essence of what it was? Why have you focussed on the least significant aspect?

 

[agricola]

I hope that's not at me. A troll or a Nazi would sympathise or support Nazism. I am merely questioning figures, and certain other things we are told.

Many records concerning the "holocaust" have not been brought to the public eye. Namely the Gas Chambers. Yes, the Gas Chambers existed, and people were murdered by using them. But who supplied the Chemicals, the buildings, and what happened to them afterwards.

The foundations of "Human Soap" are extremelly flimsy. Why was something so based on speculation later taught in schools?

I am not questioning the photos of the dead or many of the eye witness accounts.

At the risk of indulging you:

i) the chemical was called Zyklon-B. It was manufactured by firms under licence to IG Farben. The crematoria were dynamited to try and cover up the atrocities, but were (and are) still visible as ruins in places.
ii) Human Soap is probably a myth, though the use of human hair from the dead, and the removal of gold teeth from the dead, is not.

 

[ViolentPanda]

As has been pointed out, the figure of 10 - 12 million has not been properly substantiated. And as for the Human skin lamp shades and Human bone soap - no proof whatsoever, just a few reports from the Allied Victors not unreputed for their own intense propaganda.

The human skin parchment lamp-shades were always contentious. Inmates who survived Maidanek made the claims, but unsurprisingly no artefacts survived the razing of the camp.
As for "human bone soap", if you've been looking for evidence of it, you won't find it, as it was soap made from human body fats, not bones, and it was only done as an experiment to find uses for as many derivatives of the processing of human bodies as possible. Bones or bone ash would have been used for soil improvement, if anything.
This is all stuff easily checkable against even basic texts, so people who go on about "human soap" etc get short shrift from me whatever their ideology or religion. It doesn't take much effort of scholarship to sort the myth from the fact to a degree where one can weigh the balance of probabilities clearly.

I do not deny the mass slaughters, and brutal tortures. I do not deny that humans were experimented on (many of the results were been used by US scientists straight after the 1940s). I just wish that the word "holocaust" was not used.

It's an apt word, if only because of the method used in some cases to dispose of remains.

 

[HarrisonSlade]

At the risk of indulging you:

i) the chemical was called Zyklon-B. It was manufactured by firms under licence to IG Farben. The crematoria were dynamited to try and cover up the atrocities, but were (and are) still visible as ruins in places.

Is that the same IG Farben who was involved with intense business deals with the Rockefellas in the late 30s, early 40s?

ii) Human Soap is probably a myth, though the use of human hair from the dead, and the removal of gold teeth from the dead, is not.

I did not say that the removal of gold teeth and human hair was a myth. I know for a fact it isn't. But the problem we have here is that Human Soap probably was, and was therefore made up.

 

[ViolentPanda]

There is a really good book called "IBM and the Holocaust" by Edwin Black that details the relationship between IBM, its German subsidiary Dehomag and the Third Reich.

Quite a lot of the end of the book details the scale of the operation in the death camps and the meticulous way in which they were able to count, gather up and execute Jews - and record all of the above - on punchcards, quite a lot of which survived the war (as did Dehomag's records).

I agree that it's a good book.

I'd also mention to anyone looking into the subject that it's best to look into editions of books that post-date the fall of the Soviet Union, as many more records than survived in the Allied sectors were secured, and info that still hasn't made it into school-books can be found.

 

[HarrisonSlade]

It's an apt word, if only because of the method used in some cases to dispose of remains.

I just find that it undermines othe attrocities and genocides, especially ones we have in the present.

 

[agricola]

I did not say that the removal of gold teeth and human hair was a myth. I know for a fact it isn't. But the problem we have here is that Human Soap probably was, and was therefore made up.

Its not a problem unless you are an absolutist when it comes to historical truth, and while it may have been made up it does not fundamentally challenge what happened. After all, they did gas people to death by the million.

 

[butchersapron]

I just find that it undermines othe attrocities and genocides, especially ones we have in the present.

Only if you're a mad literalist.

 

[ViolentPanda]

At the risk of indulging you:

i) the chemical was called Zyklon-B. It was manufactured by firms under licence to IG Farben. The crematoria were dynamited to try and cover up the atrocities, but were (and are) still visible as ruins in places.

Zyklon B was the brand-name for a pellet formulation of hydrogen cyanide bonded into a carrier, and activated by contact with air, originally used in low concentrations to delouse clothing.
Crematoria were separate from the gas chambers.

 

[ViolentPanda]

I just find that it undermines othe attrocities and genocides, especially ones we have in the present.

Well, I'd call the slaughter of the Cathars at Montsegur a "holocaust" too, because immolation was involved.
If you're going to object to anything, object to the fact that some Zionists attempt to appropriate the term "holocaust" to specifically refer to what happened under the Nazis, rather than it being a term appropriate to a particular end.

 

[CUMBRIANDRAGON]

...and whilst we're at it, there's been an awful whiff off you for months. I may have commeneted on it before.

Have I offended you?

 

[Dimitris]

If it was 6 or 5 or even 4 million does it make a hudge difference? IT IS a holocaust, it was an attempt of the Nazis to exterminate any jew that existed.

To be honest I will be more than happy if it will ever be proven that the number is less than more... This will mean that more people survived from this horror. But I doubt it... Nearly 1 million greeks were killed during the WWII (counting deaths in concentration camps and in Greece) and it is commonly true that jews were targeted much more than anyone else.... Even 6 million is a small number I believe

 

[Gmart]

I don't think anyone (sane) would claim that Israel had already plumbed the same depths as Nazi Germany in their treatment of the Palestinians, but it's hard to escape the echoes of events prior to 1942.

This is from An Open Letter to American Jews, written by an Israeli reservist refusenik, Assaf Oron.

Here's a thoughtful piece on the emotional reaction of one hard right Israeli politician to a scene which took him right back to his childhood.

Tommy's Granny

These things should not be overstated, of course, but the glib, ignorant, inhumanity of Israel and its supporters can be a little hard to swallow at times.

Except that Gaza isn't "on the level" that the Nazi's final solution was, and historically we have no other recorded instance of an industrial-scale policy of murder that removed 10-12 civilian million lives (6 million Jews, 6 million assorted Gypsies, queers, Poles, Freemasons, Jehovah's Witnesses, disabled people and other "enemies of the state") through a methodical process.

State murder is state murder, in terms of being an equivalently disgusting crime whichever state carries it out, but scale does make a difference, if only in how much knowledge can be garnered about events. "the holocaust" is a holocaust among holocausts, but it is unique (fortunately) in scale and in execution.

It could easily be compared with Stalin's reign in the USSR. Twenty million is in excess of this and we talk less about it!

Death is death and is condemned by all - there is no need to argue over which genocide is better than which - ALL should be condemned.

Still the Nazi one was one of the first to be documented to the degree it has, and is rightly studied - though I think to restrict the freedom of speech is going too far.

Learn your lessons and move on! Israel should not be flirting with nazi tactics even to protect their precious Israel. If such tactics become necessary then it should be taken as a signal of the need to compromise.

Israel don't want a 2-state solution nor a 1-state - so they hope to cow people with enough violence to get their own way in the short term only. But violence begets violence and there will be no peace until Israel works towards a 1-state solution.

 

[butchersapron]

No, death is not death. That's the most facile and uselss way to approach this. Adding deaths up means nothing. Examining at the social dynamics of diff states in diff contexts ad placing them within real material settings might be more useful.

The homily, jesus.