Working parents thread

[LJo]

I'm glad to hear that others like the family atmosphere of their childminders because when we leave London I'm thinking it'll be much easier to set myself up as a childminder than to find a part time job in the NHS that allows me to work weekends only. I don't really want to have to do agency. I was worried, though, that people may not like that I was also looking after my own child, but it seems not everyone has a problem with this? Not sure how this would work out if we decide to have another though

?

My CM had two mad boisterous teenage boys and it was brilliant. They were fantastic with Mini and I think it was so good for him having them around. I'd never regard a CM having their own child as a bad thing, quite the opposite.

 

[ATOMIC SUPLEX]

AS you might be able to find a childminder who would look after Hanano on an ad hoc basis. Mine looks after one little girl on that basis. Worth an ask ...

Maybe, but I looked at loads of child-minders before I decided on the nursery and not only were they all terrible, they were all pretty much booked up all the time.
I will just have to suck my new life and see if it sucks. I'm going to try and keep her in the nursery two days a week for a while and hope it works as a bit of a place holder.

 

[zenie]

I'm glad to hear that others like the family atmosphere of their childminders because when we leave London I'm thinking it'll be much easier to set myself up as a childminder than to find a part time job in the NHS that allows me to work weekends only. I don't really want to have to do agency. I was worried, though, that people may not like that I was also looking after my own child, but it seems not everyone has a problem with this? Not sure how this would work out if we decide to have another though

All the childminders I've ever kown have kids of their own, shoudn't be a problem. If you've got a house and want to be at home in the day with kids, childminding can actually be very financially rewarding, it's surprising!!!

 

[Cloo]

Yeah, AFAIK most childminders have their own at home and it probably makes the atmosphere nicer!

I didn't see the one I was gonna see today, as when I rang her to fix a time, she said she'd just found out she had a job offer starting next year for the three days a week I'd be needing. I guess that sort of thing is one problem with minders! My brother sounded a note of caution saying most people he'd known with minders had had problems like them emigrating or in one case turning out to be a bit of an alkie (!)

I still have a lady to see tomorrow, and the last nursery we want to look at is having an open day on Weds, and after that it's making our mind up time.

 

[Homeless Mal]

.

 

[Red Cat]

All the childminders I've ever kown have kids of their own, shoudn't be a problem. If you've got a house and want to be at home in the day with kids, childminding can actually be very financially rewarding, it's surprising!!!

Cool. I guess I was thinking that many may have older kids but less with young'uns. One less thing to worry about then

I don't have a house and reading the Ofsted reports for childminders in London hardly any childminders here do either. Most are in flats. But I wouldn't be doing it until next year anyway, if and when we move, and I'd hope that by then we'd be renting a house.

 

[Thora]

Cool. I guess I was thinking that many may have older kids but less with young'uns. One less thing to worry about then

I don't have a house and reading the Ofsted reports for childminders in London hardly any childminders here do either. Most are in flats. But I wouldn't be doing it until next year anyway, if and when we move, and I'd hope that by then we'd be renting a house.

I've known a lot of childminders with their own kids, but you do need to bear in mind your own child would count in your numbers so would cut down on your earnings - you can have up to 5 children under 8, of which only 3 can be under 5 and 1 under 1 at any one time. There's also a lot of paperwork and planning involved in childminding these days - seems like with the new Early Years curriculum childminders have to do the same about of planning as nurseries!

I must admit, baby rooms in nurseries always make me feel a bit sad for the little blighters, however good and caring the nursery is.

 

[scifisam]

Cool. I guess I was thinking that many may have older kids but less with young'uns. One less thing to worry about then

I don't have a house and reading the Ofsted reports for childminders in London hardly any childminders here do either. Most are in flats. But I wouldn't be doing it until next year anyway, if and when we move, and I'd hope that by then we'd be renting a house.

The only thing that would make an impact would be regulations regarding the age of the children - yours and the ones you're looking after. [Edit: I see Thora's explained this in full]. But I think many people, when looking for a childminder, are looking for a family setting, and would view an extra child as a plus, especially so if they were of similar ages so could be playmates.

 

[LJo]

Yeah, AFAIK most childminders have their own at home and it probably makes the atmosphere nicer!

I didn't see the one I was gonna see today, as when I rang her to fix a time, she said she'd just found out she had a job offer starting next year for the three days a week I'd be needing. I guess that sort of thing is one problem with minders! My brother sounded a note of caution saying most people he'd known with minders had had problems like them emigrating or in one case turning out to be a bit of an alkie (!)

I still have a lady to see tomorrow, and the last nursery we want to look at is having an open day on Weds, and after that it's making our mind up time.

You'll always hear horror stories about whatever kind of childcare you choose - I am a big believer in following your instincts when it comes to making your mind up. I'm one person who never had any problems whatsoever with her childminder! I felt that we clicked as soon as I saw her.

And remember, if something doesn't work out, you can always continue to follow your instincts and simply take your baby away and try somewhere else.

 

[Cloo]

Exactly.

Saw the CM today - she was nice, but I'd prefer the two good nurseries we've seen so far, I think they have more to offer her.

 

[LJo]

We got invited to our first ever nursery friends birthday party last week. It was brilliant watching Mini with all his little mates.

 

[Cloo]

oooohhh! Tension! Saw a really good and not expensive nursery I want her to go to... but they only have one place left on one of the days. gsv's agreed to sign up for it, but I can't get through to them on the phone, as they're having an open day. I'm worried someone's gonna nab that last place there and then before I get through to them!!!

Worst case scenario I guess we can take two days and we'll likely be able to find a minder for the one other day, but we'll see.

 

[Red Cat]

I've known a lot of childminders with their own kids, but you do need to bear in mind your own child would count in your numbers so would cut down on your earnings - you can have up to 5 children under 8, of which only 3 can be under 5 and 1 under 1 at any one time. There's also a lot of paperwork and planning involved in childminding these days - seems like with the new Early Years curriculum childminders have to do the same about of planning as nurseries!

I've known a lot of childminders with their own kids, but you do need to bear in mind your own child would count in your numbers so would cut down on your earnings - you can have up to 5 children under 8, of which only 3 can be under 5 and 1 under 1 at any one time. There's also a lot of paperwork and planning involved in childminding these days - seems like with the new Early Years curriculum childminders have to do the same about of planning as nurseries!

I wouldn't want to care for a baby younger than Rosa, so 2 under 5 and some after school stuff would suit me fine. I think

Early Years stuff is bonkers. It makes me really angry reading about it. This government's micromanagement of education and childcare is verging on the psychotic. But I don't actually see how it can be implemented. And it'll cut down on those registering as childminders, which is contrary to their stated policy aims. And I think they've got a fucking cheek expecting low paid women, to pay for their own training, and take on the role of educators, for what, £5 a fucking hour? I've seen adverts in Birmingham where childminders are charging £3 an hour

I hope you get to develop critiques of this kind of bonkersness on your course Thora. On the one hand the govt state that they understand the need for child-led activities, the child's competence, and the development of his/her autonomy, and yet in practice, all their uber-controlling regulations mean that even the adults have no autonomy and are conceived as incompetent, never mind the children. The only one doing any 'leading' in this situation is the government.

 

[zenie]

I've seen adverts in Birmingham where childminders are charging £3 an hour

How much are CM's in London then?

 

[Thora]

How much are CM's in London then?

Anything from £3 to £6 per child an hour, depending on the area etc.

 

[Thora]

I hope you get to develop critiques of this kind of bonkersness on your course Thora. On the one hand the govt state that they understand the need for child-led activities, the child's competence, and the development of his/her autonomy, and yet in practice, all their uber-controlling regulations mean that even the adults have no autonomy and are conceived as incompetent, never mind the children. The only one doing any 'leading' in this situation is the government.

I'm working in a nursery at the moment, and the amount of planning is proving very difficult even there. The workers are (quite rightly) refusing to take paperwork home after a 9 hour day, so when are you supposed to do it? Individual plans have to be written and updated for each child. With the older children it means having to ignore them while they're eating or playing so it can be done, but in a baby room with 9 under 1's, where each carer always has at least one child on their lap and charts have to be filled in for every feed, change and sleep, there is literally no time to write detailed plans of the child's interests, aptitudes, next stages of learning etc. It's a load of bollocks afaics

 

[_angel_]

I'm working in a nursery at the moment, and the amount of planning is proving very difficult even there. The workers are (quite rightly) refusing to take paperwork home after a 9 hour day, so when are you supposed to do it? Individual plans have to be written and updated for each child. With the older children it means having to ignore them while they're eating or playing so it can be done, but in a baby room with 9 under 1's, where each carer always has at least one child on their lap and charts have to be filled in for every feed, change and sleep, there is literally no time to write detailed plans of the child's interests, aptitudes, next stages of learning etc. It's a load of bollocks afaics

Yep they were always chart filling and box ticking at my sons nursery. Whereas it's nice for a parent to have a record of what the kids up to all day the levels it's going into is bordering on the psychotic!

 

[Red Cat]

How much are CM's in London then?

One round the corner from my work charges £8, but this is unusual. I think £5 is more common, but charging less than £5 is shocking IMO. I know you can look after more than one child (in which case its not £5 an hour) but I don't really believe that £5 an hour is enough to look after someone's child. Its not even the minimum wage. You get paid more than that in McDonalds. Obviously if I do become a childminder, I'm not going to price myself out, but I'll be very pissed off if I have to accept less than a fiver an hour.

 

[Cloo]

Early Years stuff is bonkers. It makes me really angry reading about it. This government's micromanagement of education and childcare is verging on the psychotic. But I don't actually see how it can be implemented. And it'll cut down on those registering as childminders, which is contrary to their stated policy aims. And I think they've got a fucking cheek expecting low paid women, to pay for their own training, and take on the role of educators, for what, £5 a fucking hour? I've seen adverts in Birmingham where childminders are charging £3 an hour

I hope you get to develop critiques of this kind of bonkersness on your course Thora. On the one hand the govt state that they understand the need for child-led activities, the child's competence, and the development of his/her autonomy, and yet in practice, all their uber-controlling regulations mean that even the adults have no autonomy and are conceived as incompetent, never mind the children. The only one doing any 'leading' in this situation is the government.

I quite agree - I read about this stuff at work a lot. I don't actually think this 'Early years foundation stage' stuff harms the kiddies (despite media horror at it, it's not about pinning toddlers down and teaching them to read and write), but it does ask an absurd amount of paperwork and reporting on the part of the childcarers.

Another silly thing about it is that now middle class parents are going to get themselves all in a stress about how little Jocasta won't be an A-grade student if she doesn't go to a nursery with a super-duper EYFS curriculum, when that's not what it's for - it's supposed to be (and it remains to be seen if it's effective) a means of levelling the playing field between little Jocasta and less privileged children.

One local nursery I just refused to look at - its publicity was very jargon-heavy and I could just tell it's modus operandi was to charge a premium to anxious middle-class parents worried that their child won't succeed without an EYFS curriculum.

 

[Choc]

hey this is all supernuts.

if i needed childcare now i would want a warm and caring enviornment with no paperwork and no learning. despite maybe some singing and other activities. and despite that £600/month for part time nursery care....? i have made my mind up i rather stay home with my child than working 2 weeks of the month only for childcare.

 

[Cloo]

TBH, I'm only working cos I'm just not stay-at-home material - I'll barely make enough money to pay for the child care.

 

[Choc]

TBH, I'm only working cos I'm just not stay-at-home material - I'll barely make enough money to pay for the child care.

but this is crazy! to go to work only to pay the childminder. but i am thinking i can actually grow into a bit of a stay home mother (with 2-3 shifts a month of working only). although it also shatters me out but like previously said i still feel its a holiday from my work. in enjoy the relative freedom to decide what we will do in a day. most of it quite fun activities like walking or drinking coffee!

 

[Cloo]

Ah, I just need the structure. I haven't settled very naturally into this mum thing... it's like how gsv's aunt from the States put it the other day - she did stuff when she had kids because she 'wasn't the going out for lunch type', which perhaps describes me as well!

gsv's sis-in-law is in a similar position, but she's really enjoying combining the two, and I think I will as well. I want to maintain things so that our daughter is with me/us more of the time than she is in childcare, though.

 

[Thora]

Yep they were always chart filling and box ticking at my sons nursery. Whereas it's nice for a parent to have a record of what the kids up to all day the levels it's going into is bordering on the psychotic!

To an extent you have to do some box ticking and record keeping - otherwise it's too difficult to keep track of nappy changes/feeds/sleeps etc. It's all the "planning for learning" as if a nursery (or childminder) is a secondary school that does my nut.

I quite agree - I read about this stuff at work a lot. I don't actually think this 'Early years foundation stage' stuff harms the kiddies (despite media horror at it, it's not about pinning toddlers down and teaching them to read and write), but it does ask an absurd amount of paperwork and reporting on the part of the childcarers.

I think it absolutely does harm children, in that instead of talking, cuddling or playing with them their carers are sitting at the table in the corner doing planning. Most of the EYFS stuff is things good childcarers will do intuitively -if a couple of the kids you care for are about to have a new sibling maybe you would read a story about a new baby, or initiate a game of bathing and feeding dolls in the home corner, or go downstairs to the baby room to see them being fed etc. But now all this has to be written in a plan, discussed with parents, demonstrating how learning objectives are to be met. Instead of being able to sit with children at snacktime and actually talk with them, the carer has to take the opportunity of a few quiet minutes to do paperwork.

 

[Cloo]

I think it absolutely does harm children, in that instead of talking, cuddling or playing with them their carers are sitting at the table in the corner doing planning.

You're probably right, actually. One thing I liked about the nursery we've chosen is that they seem to handle these things in a fairly fluid way that doesn't get in the way of the caring stuff.

It is stupid though - I really don't need that much feedback, I do trust them to get on with it. The government is trying more and more to get carers and teachers to report back to parents about every little thing, and it will just erode trust between adults as parents start to just expect to have everything fed back to them.

 

[Choc]

Ah, I just need the structure. I haven't settled very naturally into this mum thing... it's like how gsv's aunt from the States put it the other day - she did stuff when she had kids because she 'wasn't the going out for lunch type', which perhaps describes me as well!

gsv's sis-in-law is in a similar position, but she's really enjoying combining the two, and I think I will as well. I want to maintain things so that our daughter is with me/us more of the time than she is in childcare, though.

absolutely fair enough. it's good you know about yourself as well. cause then its easier to plan around everyones needs. nothing worse than have a frustrated mother at home who since years had gone rather to work (one of my close family member is in such a situation cause there is no work where she lives).

i am just such a luncher somehow. i really could do it every day. but like previously said i will go back to work too...at some point

 

[Red Cat]

I think it absolutely does harm children, in that instead of talking, cuddling or playing with them their carers are sitting at the table in the corner doing planning.

Supernuts indeed!

I agree with that. I think it does harm them. And everything we know about children tells us that it is harmful. Given that we're all supposed to be doing evidence-based practice these days, maybe we can use the evidence to undermine this policy?

yeah, right

 

[trashpony]

Who exactly is EYFS supposed to benefit? I'm sick of all the testing and assessing we do with children in this country.

 

[Red Cat]

Ah, I just need the structure. I haven't settled very naturally into this mum thing....

I think its hard if you need that. There's a certain letting go that you need to do I think. I managed that quite easily but I know it makes many women feel like shit, especially if their identity is very much tied up with work. I'm enough of a hippie (despite having been quite driven and conscientious in my work) to have found slowing down and getting in touch with the essentials of life a really good thing.

Thing is though, it changes all the time. The first 3 months I was totally hormonal and blissed out. And after 6 months, once Rosa became mobile, I've really enjoyed watching and facilitating her physical exploration of the world and just hanging out. From 4-6 months, I found it quite difficult though..the tiredness got to me and it was frustrating for Rosa, trying to push herself up to crawl and not being able to, for example. Its much more fun now. But I also find it really interesting just watching how she learns, watching her growing sense of agency and autonomy. I find it fascinating how competent she is, how unlike the mainstream view of babies she is. If I had to make puree and spoonfeed and change nappies all day I think I'd find it more difficult, but she's fed herself since 6 months and frequently goes on the potty. Its opened up a whole new world for me, thinking about how we conceptualise infancy and childhood, the difference between the dominant view and the reality, sociology of childhood etc. Fascinating stuff. Am quite envious of you doing your Early Years course Thora!

As for the doing lunch! Well, its not that easy once your baby is mobile unless they're still happy to sit in a buggy. Rosa was in a sling and I'm sure she wouldn't have been. I used to let her crawl on the floor, but you obviously have to pick a relaxed venue for that where people don't mind your LO going into their shopping bags and potentially tripping up the waitress. My days are much more child-centred now and after a year we've got certain things we do most days and weeks. It wasn't like this even 6 weeks ago, so things change. And it takes time to find out about groups where you can meet like-minded people, especially if you're after something less mainstream.

 

[Cloo]

Yeah, it does change. Between about 3-4 months I got a little bored because Ez didn't seem to develop much in that time, but lately she's been changing more again. I think I've mentioned on this thread that I do want to keep it so that she's with me/us for more of the week than she's in someone else's care until she goes to school.

I do find the developmental stuff fascinating - I've read at work about the Reggio Emilia child care concept that a baby is 'strong, powerful, and competent' and I remember thinking (while I was preggers) that people who find babies boring in general do so because they think of babies and tiny kids as stupid and that the things they do are boring or pointless.

But the amazing thing is that everything they do does have a point, and thus is hugely interesting. If a toddler, say, bashes a variety of objects against another one, it's not because they're 'stupid', but because they're finding out about shit, and when you start viewing them that way, it all becomes more fascinating.

I mean, ultimately any decision I make isn't irrevocable, and if I change how I feel then I can change the arrangement. At the moment it's quite good knowing that if were to, say, not work at all, it wouldn't greatly affect our income.