Leafster
.
I would agree with this. I'd like to think I'm constantly vigilant when driving but there is always the smallest possibility that I haven't spotted something so to be on the safe side I would always indicate.
Why do people often not indicate when turning into side roads?
- Thread starter scifisam
- Start date
newme
Giant in Pastyland now
Personally Im on a Motorbike, so I signal early and unless im on a backroad with no one around for miles, almost always signal if theres a chance someone could have come into view in the time since I checked my mirrors, mainly out of self preservation due to the huge number of inept morons that appear to inhabit the roads and regularily attempt to kill me in new and interesting ways.
But with people being taught they dont have to always signal, its unsurprising that not always people do. People in general are lazy at the best of times, more so with encouragement.
Problem with instinctually indicating everytime is it doesnt promote the same awareness as forcing people to look and make a judgement call on whether they need to, even if they decide its better to indicate anyway just incase, theres still been more than likely a lot more looking involved than the quick glance and immediate indicating that seems to happen so often
But with people being taught they dont have to always signal, its unsurprising that not always people do. People in general are lazy at the best of times, more so with encouragement.
Problem with instinctually indicating everytime is it doesnt promote the same awareness as forcing people to look and make a judgement call on whether they need to, even if they decide its better to indicate anyway just incase, theres still been more than likely a lot more looking involved than the quick glance and immediate indicating that seems to happen so often
gentlegreen
I hummus, therefore I am ...
Was obliged to drive the dear old jalope earlier - after several months of only cycling, and I have to say I still couldn't stop myself indicating to imaginary people - and when exiting mini roundabouts.
As Crispy pointed out, the road was only empty behind at the point when I stopped focussing on that and returned to looking out ahead and to the sides of me for imaginary pedestrians doing unpredictable things in the suburbs I was driving through ... and the flashing indicators may have been useful to them ... it may have had something to do with the right hand signal I often give as a cyclist as if to say "if you cut me up as I pass that parked car (20 yards before you have to stop at the lights and I overtake you) , you'll have to take my arm off" ...
As newme illustrates, those of us who learned on motorcycles have a different perspective when it comes to observation.
As per usual there was at least one driver up my towbar who didn't understand the generous gap I was leaving from the car in front and slowing down to allow old ladies across ...
Ah well, I would have failed the test, but I don't think I killed anyone.
As Crispy pointed out, the road was only empty behind at the point when I stopped focussing on that and returned to looking out ahead and to the sides of me for imaginary pedestrians doing unpredictable things in the suburbs I was driving through ... and the flashing indicators may have been useful to them ... it may have had something to do with the right hand signal I often give as a cyclist as if to say "if you cut me up as I pass that parked car (20 yards before you have to stop at the lights and I overtake you) , you'll have to take my arm off" ...
As newme illustrates, those of us who learned on motorcycles have a different perspective when it comes to observation.
As per usual there was at least one driver up my towbar who didn't understand the generous gap I was leaving from the car in front and slowing down to allow old ladies across ...
Ah well, I would have failed the test, but I don't think I killed anyone.
Not a law as such. But the advice in the Highway Code is to indicate where it provides information to other road users. (That includes pedestrians).
Rule 170 says that motor vehicles turning into a road should give way to pedestrians who have already started to cross. (Though many, many drivers have no idea about this).
Failure to indicate and failure to give way to pedestrians as above may amount to an offence of driving without due care and attention or without reasonable consideration for other road users.
It may not be apparent to oncoming traffic or to pedestrians crossing the side road.
Advanced driving instructors would argue with this - you shoud ALWAYS engage in working out who is around, what you are doing, etc. and MAKE A SPECIFIC JUDGMENT on the actual facts (including any potential for blind spots, etc.). To simply always indicate come what may encourages mindless automaton driving which is dangerous.therefore, always indicate, just in case
Please link to the relevant section.
scifisam
deleted
@db: I thought that'd probably be the case. Guess that's why people don't bother, then, since they're very unlikely to ever get into trouble for it unless there's an accident.
Plus, no matter how vigilant you are, you don't know if a pedestrian's going to come out of a house or cafe or round another corner a second after you decide to turn. Even the best driver can't see into the future.
So the driving test fails you for doing something that actually makes life safer for other road users. Huh.
Plus, no matter how vigilant you are, you don't know if a pedestrian's going to come out of a house or cafe or round another corner a second after you decide to turn. Even the best driver can't see into the future.
So the driving test fails you for doing something that actually makes life safer for other road users. Huh.
weltweit
Well-Known Member
That would be nothing new, when I took my car test yonks ago I was not allowed to turn my head to check my blind spot something I always used to do as a motorcyclist and something I do as a car driver (post test) also.
suzee blue cheese
Well-Known Member
We had a guy at work once who seriously tried to argue it was the pedestrian's fault for being on the zebra crossing when he knocked her down.
GarfieldLeChat
fucking awesome but wrong
quite the opposite it's lazy and unthinking.
there shouldn't be automatic responses baring muscle memeory for clutch biting point gear box shape and other such things.
indeed relying on such things as a default action will lead to you killing yourself and propably others too...
GarfieldLeChat
fucking awesome but wrong
would do if i could find anything other than the bastardised verison of it which is the direct gov site... you know of a decent link to the whole thing or has HMO decided that they need to make cash out of it again and therefore torn down the old decent site which used to have it in favour of the light verison on DG...
gentlegreen
I hummus, therefore I am ...
The thing is, young Sterling, speaking as someone who was quite serious about 2 wheels once, day to day driving in a relatively modern vehicle is a different kettle of fish. I hope I don't pay any less attention, than I did on 2 wheels, but if you stay within your ability zone, it simply isn't as challenging - or many fewer people would be driving.
(I taught myself in half an hour in a Reliant - after 7 years never really getting the hang of motorcycles)
I was amazed last year when I realised after several hundred miles with 2/3 inflated tyres.
, that my reliable Peugeot Diesel sticks to the road pretty reliably and I can even risk using the brakes occaisionally.Only an ex-motorcyclist could have done that, merely cursing to myself that I would have to fork out for some new suspension.
GarfieldLeChat
fucking awesome but wrong
Do you drive?
It seems that you are speculating from a theroetical rather than an actual standpoint that's all
the basic technique for reading the road conditions is you look as far ahead as possible and then track back to where you are now so for arguments sake 500 meters in front then 400 then 300 then 200 then 100 then 50 then 20 then 500 and repeat this way along with sufficent use of the mirrors you should always be able to read the road conditions and be making the mental adjustments accordingly.
indeed this should be instintual to the point that you should given enough practice at vocalising it be able to give a running commentary of the hazards approaching you from all directions. this is considered an advanced technique these days however in the advanced test if you cannot do this (for police i think it used to be for 1 continuous hour via hendon at least) then you will not pass your test, if you do it and fail to spot a hazard however insignificant you will not pass.
It would go something like:
travelling along the high street at 30 mph ahead 800 meter pedestrain crossing with people waiting but not crossing one man looking ready to cross before lights change as we continue the path way narrows on the near hand side and there are children playing football behing a mid height fence with recess gate which is ajar. on the off side pavement the man in his front garden is watering his flowers and has sprayed the pavement and created a small puddle on the road of inderterminate depth. the oncoming car has cross the white line to aviod the puddle and entered my lane; braking now and changing to 4th from 5th in order to prepare for avoidance action if required as the lights ahead at the crossing change to amber and man makes dash for it.
etc etc etc
now that looks like a lot of detail when typed out but if you read it out at a reasonable pace then you will find that it's under 20 seconds of info about reading the road.
the point being is that you should be being that observant at all times when using the road. if you aren't then you are in fact as you rightly say not being aware of the road 100% and are in fact not fully in control of your vehicle.
you might argue and i'd agree that there are many many road users who aren't that competant on the roads, however debasing your road craft to their poor habits makes for worse not better road conditions.
it isn't defensive road craft to pick up bad habits any more than it's defensive cycling to carry a crow bar...
GarfieldLeChat
fucking awesome but wrong
The thing is, young Sterling, speaking as someone who was quite serious about 2 wheels once, day to day driving in a relatively modern vehicle is a different kettle of fish. I hope I don't pay any less attention, than I did on 2 wheels, but if you stay within your ability zone, it simply isn't as challenging - or many fewer people would be driving.
(I taught myself in half an hour in a Reliant - after 7 years never really getting the hang of motorcycles)
I was amazed last year when I realised after several hundred miles with 2/3 inflated tyres.
Only an ex-motorcyclist could have done that, merely cursing to myself that I would have to fork out for some new suspension.
i thnk you are habouring delusions as we all do about your abilites equally drivign on the public road shouldn't ever be challenging it's not a race it's a method of transport, there will be sufficent events in your road use life which will present challenges without going looking for them by complacency...
I'm all for a much hard more skilled test myself and using an unroad worthy vehicle to my mind is one thing which should have an automatic 10 year prison sentence, along with no licence, no/invalid insurance. with the transport being remvoed and crushed at point of conviction. ( infact i'm pretty much sure that this would also aleviate congestion and solve alot of the enviromental concerns of transport to by providing if the recent figures are anything to go by around a 25% drop in road use instantly...)
gentlegreen
I hummus, therefore I am ...
Zieg.Fucking.Heil.
I bet you drive a BMW ....
I bet you drive a BMW ....
GarfieldLeChat
fucking awesome but wrong
no for many reasons but largely they are drivers cars but not passengers cars which means that they have to be one of the few invented which you could reasonable say you don't have passengers in because it would too fucking uncomfortable for them to be in...much like their pillions on their bikes too... a common appraoch to passenger comfort...
funny isn't it how people are all for enviromental changes which would benifit us all until it affects them....
the proposed change above would make roads safer, have less pollution and be one of the cheapest to introduce...
GarfieldLeChat
fucking awesome but wrong
you are they weren't....
and as i said in town this is adifferent matter to rural roads... but taking that point on board wouldn't allow people to vent their own prejudices about certain road users now would it
cept it isn't there used to be on the DVLA verison the written specifcs of signal use rather than the illustration version of the 1 page PDF... unless the HWC has gotten a lot more vauge in the last year... which i somehow doubt, s'alight though i'll get a current copy and then scan it in if need be...
WouldBe
Dislicksick
If you're paying attention to what you're doing you don't leave indicators on anyway.Because of that I stripped the indicators off my motorcycle so I could not be taken in the same sort of accident. I used hand signals since then, its pretty hard to leave a hand signal on
Sweaty Betty
Hemo rising!
Its not just drivers that need to see other motorists indicators- bloody pedsestrians rely on them when crossing the road as well..
In answer to the OP...because they are cunts!!!!
In answer to the OP...because they are cunts!!!!
GarfieldLeChat
fucking awesome but wrong
Sweaty Betty
Hemo rising!
i take it you've read the thread then have you
Interpretation innit...
Its in context with the OP's question at least
Sweaty Betty
Hemo rising!
Just read the whole of the OP, instead of just answering the title!!!
Yes im a plank garf!
Yes im a plank garf!
Yes it is.
http://www.direct.gov.uk/en/TravelAndTransport/Highwaycode/DG_070289 is probably the bit you were thinking of.
Perhaps you should concentrate on your research skills instead of just assuming the worst of everything put in front of you?
(You won't find a bit about it being a breach of the Code to signal every time, regardless of whether you perceive a need or not though. It's not there and, so far as I am aware, never has been)
GarfieldLeChat
fucking awesome but wrong
i'll bow to your superiour knowledge then though i'm sure you are in fact wrong... i can't be arsed with your particlar brand of passive aggressive confrontation this evening
You're the aggressive, in-your-face one. And sadly the accuracy of the facts you base your confrontational approach is often sadly lacking ...i can't be arsed with your particlar brand of passive aggressive confrontation this evening
