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Who are the fuel protesters?

'Campaigners Complain Of Special Branch Dirty Tricks'

Last night's London Evening Standard had a piece by Andrew Gilligan who had interviewed someone purporting to be the "London and South East liaison officer" for the fuel protests. He also claimed to be "Captain Gatso".

He complained about infiltration of meetings called to discuss fuel protests during the election, including a meeting where new blokes turned up in "clean lorries" who argued against taking action and spent the meetings spreading doubts amongst the others. "They were saying things like: 'Think of the hospitals, what happens if it goes like 2000?"

He also complained of being followed and of having his house secretly entered and his paperwork and computer looked through.

Gilligan went on to say:

"If these claims are true, the work is likely to have been done by local Special Branches and a secretive, Scotland Yard-based Public Order Intelligence Unit (NPOIU). Few have heard of it, but it's role in controlling dissent is central.

Established by the Blair Government in 1998 to monitor "politically motivated disorder", in the words of the Inspectorate of Constabulary, the NPOIU says the Home Office, "provides critical support to forces accross the UK in maintaining a strategic overview of public order issues".

MI5's website describes the unit as dealing with "Right and Left-wing extremists, animal rights extremists and other militant single-issue protestors". In its seven-year history, according to the Metropolitan Police Authority accounts, its buget has steadily grown."
 
redsquirrel said:
Nonsense, plenty of people on here supported the fact that people were willing to try direct action in the 2000 protests even if they didn't support the actual protests and had some worries about just who was organising the protests.
I meant a *specific* direct action or a *specific* protest, rather than the general right to protest etc.

I don't see why people should be automatically supporting fuel protestors just because they support the general right to protest.

Just to remind you that I was responding to this comment:
layabout said:
Where's all these people that are always defending and praising direct action?

No where to be seen when the masses decide to take direction action that's percived as right wing!
 
Oh dear. This threads not really working out that well.




I'm still thinking about these haulage companies. I find it hard to imagine if the bosses organise it, do they just instruct their workers to take part in the blokade? Do the drivers then get paid normal wages whilst they're blockading? Or even a bonus?

See it doesn't seem to work like 'normal' protest (whatever that might be).
 
aurora green said:
Oh dear. This threads not really working out that well.




I'm still thinking about these haulage companies. I find it hard to imagine if the bosses organise it, do they just instruct their workers to take part in the blokade? Do the drivers then get paid normal wages whilst they're blockading? Or even a bonus?

See it doesn't seem to work like 'normal' protest (whatever that might be).
Are truck drivers unionised at all, I wonder? If not, why not?

One thing that puzzles me is why it's the drivers themselves involved, not the companies on the whole. It's not they who pay for the fuel in their lorries, it's the companies. Have any haulage companies hinted to their at wage freezes/cuts as a result of fuel price rises?
 
a lot of 'haulage companies' are one bloke who owns one lorry
i dont really know who's organising the protests, but some people like this could be involved
 
parallelepipete said:
One thing that puzzles me is why it's the drivers themselves involved, not the companies on the whole.

There are in fact very few large road haulage companies in Britain, it is mainly one man bands or very small 5-10 truck companies. With diesel at the current price many will go bust within the next few weeks.
The situtation was exacerbated a few years ago when the laws on Cabotage were repealed. (Cabotage laws used to prevent foreign truckers from doing anything other than deliver a load to Britain and taking a load out. They were not allowed to work within Britain)
 
tobyjug said:
There are in fact very few large road haulage companies in Britain, it is mainly one man bands or very small 5-10 truck companies. With diesel at the current price many will go bust within the next few weeks.
The situtation was exacerbated a few years ago when the laws on Cabotage were repealed. (Cabotage laws used to prevent foreign truckers from doing anything other than deliver a load to Britain and taking a load out. They were not allowed to work within Britain)

How was the situation 'exacerbated' and what else would the 'foreign truckers' be doing apart from delivering a load and taking one out?
 
MC5 said:
How was the situation 'exacerbated' and what else would the 'foreign truckers' be doing apart from delivering a load and taking one out?

Foreign truckers are now coming into Britain with fuel tanks full to the brim with very cheap diesel and undercutting British hauliers. The removal of the Cabotage laws means the foreign trucks can now act in direct competition with British truckers and undercut them within Britain.
 
tobyjug said:
Foreign truckers are now coming into Britain with fuel tanks full to the brim with very cheap diesel and undercutting British hauliers. The removal of the Cabotage laws means the foreign trucks can now act in direct competition with British truckers and undercut them within Britain.

Surley they have to refuel at some point wandering around our roads?
 
tobyjug said:
Foreign truckers are now coming into Britain with fuel tanks full to the brim with very cheap diesel and undercutting British hauliers. The removal of the Cabotage laws means the foreign trucks can now act in direct competition with British truckers and undercut them within Britain.

Very cheap is how much? If it's low enough, I'll have a few gallons.
 
scott_forester said:
Surley they have to refuel at some point wandering around our roads?


Not with long range tanks, around 1800 miles worth. They can come over with a load deliver it, work within Britain for a few days pick up a load to take back to Europe and go back to fuel up.
 
tobyjug said:
Not with long range tanks, around 1800 miles worth. They can come over with a load deliver it, work within Britain for a few days pick up a load to take back to Europe and go back to fuel up.

Must be a big tank to hold it all and think of all the fuel it uses to move it about?
 
TeeJay said:
People usually support or oppose direct action and protests based on what the actions are trying to achieve.

Re. fuel prices: why don't haulage compnaies simply pass on the fuel costs to their customers? If someone needs a lorry loaf of stuff taken from A to B and petrol prices go up how are they going to find anyone to take it for cheaper? Surely everyone will put their prices up in line with petrol prices.

Because our haulage companies are in competition with European haulage companies. Straight away, they are handicapped by their own government. We are an oil producing country, yet we have to pay more than the continent.

Typical of the left. They can't see why Britain shouldn't pay over the odds to be in the European club, then after that, they demand that we pay over the odds in fuel taxes to obliterate any remaining chance we have left of competing - but then, empowering our home industries to compete with the outside world has always been alien to the left.

What's the point of paying a kings ransom, to trade with Europe, if our government is going to stifle trade with Europe afterwards?
 
let hope our dear chancellor is crapping himself in a few days - like last time. Funny how he tries to convince everyone else to fight the problem in their backyards rather than looking at the outrageous amount of duty that is collected on fuel.
 
Just to provide some information:

Mid-August diesel prices (pence per litre):

UK 94.7
Austria 69.85
Belgium 78.38
Czech Republic 71.75
Denmark 80.94
Finland 69.22
France 73.87
Germany 77.54
Greece 64.85
Netherlands 77.11
Hungary 79.79
Ireland 74.01
Italy 79.44
Luxembourg 63.79
Estonia 62.05
Norway 88.83
Latvia 59.46
Lithuania 61.23
Poland 72.18
Slovakia 73.28
Slovenia 66.18
Portugal 69.22
Spain 66.47
Sweden 82.11
Switzerland 77.10

USA 38.47

http://www.theaa.com/onlinenews/allaboutcars/fuel/2005/August2005.doc

Looks like Luxembourg would be a good place to fill up if you were heading to the UK although France and Ireland wouldn't be too bad either.
 
MC5 said:
Must be a big tank to hold it all and think of all the fuel it uses to move it about?


Two tanks on the tractor unit and one or two on the trailor is quite normal on an international truck.
 
laptop said:
Meanwhile...

I'd be interested on any info on the "Association of British Drivers".

Some have linked them to the Spiked / Institute of Ideas / Living Marxism / ex-RCP crowd - e.g. http://www.gmwatch.org/archive2.asp?arcid=3272 - and they quote each other approvingly - but is it substantiated?


Now this is interesting.
(is that link broken though, or is just my machine?)


from ABDs' site it seems hard to believe its affiliated to any left thinking groups (although I must admit I know nothing about some of the groups listed)

What we do is - we all agree that unless 'they' stop wasting our tax money on that month's fashionable, politically correct 'scheme' and manage our nation/ national budget more successfully in order to bring down the requirement for excessive fuel duty (as well as everything else) - we will pledge to vote. Hmmm, surely we mean NOT vote. No, we choose to vote - ESPECIALLY those who don't normally bother! At the next General Election and at each By-Election, we - you, the folks supporting this campaign for a sustainable policy to cheap, readily available fuel- will opt en-masse to get rid of the lackies and sycophants who currently reside in our Parliament/ Councils and replace them for people with vision and ability.

er... Are they thinking of UKIP, I wonder.
 
aurora green said:
Now this is interesting.
(is that link broken though, or is just my machine?)

from ABDs' site it seems hard to believe its affiliated to any left thinking groups (although I must admit I know nothing about some of the groups listed)

er... Are they thinking of UKIP, I wonder.

A few comments - I haven't read the whole thread so apologies if I repeat what others may have said.

1. ABD are a nasty right wing reactionary bunch who believe that they have the right to drive as fast as they want on the roads. They also believe fuel and car taxes are too high. If asked where the money should come from if these taxes were lowered their view is that we are all taxed too much. They are neo con nutters who want the freedom to drive at whatever speed they deem fit.

2. The core of the fuel tax protesters are farmers and road hauliers, who are not known for being left wing or liberally minded.

3. So what if our fuel tax is higher than in other European countries - our income tax is much lower than most European countries. It is not comparing like for like.

4. Those protesters from the business community should shut up. The reason for the current hike in prices is due to their precious market economic forces that they revere - it's just supply and demand. It'd be great if the high fuel prices made businesses question the validity of free market economics but I doubt it. Blame the government for taxing fuel to provide public services for those in need - it's much easier. Actually you could say if it wasn't for poor and needy people we wouldn't need Fuel and other taxes to provide public services for them. Yeah - high fuel taxes are the fault of the poor
 
Soul On Ice said:
A few comments - I haven't read the whole thread so apologies if I repeat what others may have said.

1. ABD are a nasty right wing reactionary bunch who believe that they have the right to drive as fast as they want on the roads. They also believe fuel and car taxes are too high. If asked where the money should come from if these taxes were lowered their view is that we are all taxed too much. They are neo con nutters who want the freedom to drive at whatever speed they deem fit.

2. The core of the fuel tax protesters are farmers and road hauliers, who are not known for being left wing or liberally minded.

3. So what if our fuel tax is higher than in other European countries - our income tax is much lower than most European countries. It is not comparing like for like.

4. Those protesters from the business community should shut up. The reason for the current hike in prices is due to their precious market economic forces that they revere - it's just supply and demand. It'd be great if the high fuel prices made businesses question the validity of free market economics but I doubt it. Blame the government for taxing fuel to provide public services for those in need - it's much easier. Actually you could say if it wasn't for poor and needy people we wouldn't need Fuel and other taxes to provide public services for them. Yeah - high fuel taxes are the fault of the poor

Our income taxes are lower? I think you'll find that with all the so called invisible taxes that have been added on since 1997, they're stacking up nicely.

Where did you work out that they want to drive as fast as they can? Have you some evidence for this?

Fuel duties are too high - period!

Don't forget to toot your horn if you see the protesters!
 
gunneradt said:
Where did you work out that they want to drive as fast as they can? Have you some evidence for this?


From their own site;

Think about what your mobility means to you, for your standard of living and that of your family.
Think about having no alternative to your car - forced to have a car and forced to pay through the nose to run it.
Think what would happen if you lost your licence for exceeding any of the ever lower and ever more inappropriate speed limits.
Think about what you will have to cut back on in order to pay £5+ for a gallon of petrol.
Think about paying tolls to use the roads on your way to work or to enter the centre of your own town.
Think about paying again to park your car when you get to work.
 
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