When do the new Routemasters arrive?

[Crispy]

Ban the tube!
with its dangerous leading edge. Live electrics too you say?

Which is one reason why the jubilee extension has platform edge doors. Any new tube lines would have the same feature (or much wider platforms)

 

[Gixxer1000]

Which is one reason why the jubilee extension has platform edge doors. Any new tube lines would have the same feature (or much wider platforms)

Not being retrofitted though are they.

 

[gabi]

Not being retrofitted though are they.

Given how long it takes them to replace a single escalator the mind boggles at how long that process could take.

 

[Badgers]

Not a fan of the bendy-bus myself, they just seem too big and too erratic for London streets.
Guess that the option to just ditch them is not good though, they were not cheap and a new fleet of routemasters will cost more.

Meh..

 

[Gixxer1000]

The benefit of the R/masters was that you could jump on jump off- hit traffic? just get off, now you have to push the emergency button to do that.

 

[London_Calling]

Er, except Boris insists that the new Routemasters will be fully accessible. And don't you think most of the people you've just described prefer to have a conductor on board to help them - and even have a little chat with - instead of having a bus driver resolutely stuck behind a shield of plastic screens?

I admire your faith in the honesty of politicians on the hustings. I think.

And don't you think most of the people you've just described prefer to have a conductor on board to help them - and even have a little chat with - instead of having a bus driver resolutely stuck behind a shield of plastic screens?

They don't want anyone to help them, they want to be independent - you don't seem to get this at all: You want to make independent people dependent again.

Forget the crass sentimentality, and just deal with progess.

 

[Crispy]

Not being retrofitted though are they.

Nope. Far too expensive and impractical. The stations need all-new signalling equipment to stop the train in the same place each time, and the platforms would need rebuilding.

Similarly, the routemasters weren't retrofitted with automoatic barriers to prevent people falling off moving buses. Instead, they were replaced when it made economic sense (eg. they were too costly to run and maintain)

Even though the congestion charge gouges Londoners from their hard-won, TFL is not made of money.

 

[Orang Utan]

I should think it would be difficult to recruit conductors now - who'd want the job?

 

[Gixxer1000]

(eg. they were too costly to run and maintain)
.

Where did that come from?

 

[Gixxer1000]

Even though the congestion charge gouges Londoners from their hard-won, TFL is not made of money.

Congestion charge has only made £14m profit (and 30 % of that was from exhorbitant fines) since its so labour intensive and inefficient.

 

[Gixxer1000]

Not a fan of the bendy-bus myself, they just seem too big and too erratic for London streets.
Guess that the option to just ditch them is not good though, they were not cheap and a new fleet of routemasters will cost more.

Meh..

The bendies require an awful lot of junction redesigns to accomodate them (currently these safe buses are mounting the pavements on many junctions) this money will be saved. I expect the buses will be sold rather than scrapped anyway

 

[editor]

I bet people will be doing the same for Bendys, as well

Frankly, I doubt that very much.

 

[Crispy]

Where did that come from?

My arse

Apologies. I'm trying to track down comparative running costs for the different types of bus, care to help?

 

[Kanda]

Ah. So it's the cyclists fault!

No, not neccesarily. But if you cycle down the side of one when it's turning you're asking for trouble.

I guess cyclists are more likely to get squashed trying to go down the side of artic lorries too??

As Orang says.. stay behind till it's safe. It's not that difficult is it??

 

[Gixxer1000]

My arse

Apologies. I'm trying to track down comparative running costs for the different types of bus, care to help?

Not easy TBH.

 

[citydreams]

Congestion charge has only made £14m profit (and 30 % of that was from exhorbitant fines) since its so labour intensive and inefficient.

That looks like the adding up of an Evading Standards journalist. Coincidence?

 

[Gixxer1000]

Frankly, I doubt that very much.

Me too.

 

[Gixxer1000]

That looks like the adding up of an Evading Standards journalist. Coincidence?

Er actually TfLs own figures Ill post a link in a minute

 

[Crispy]

No, not neccesarily. But if you cycle down the side of one when it's turning you're asking for trouble.

I guess cyclists are more likely to get squashed trying to go down the side of artic lorries too??

As Orang says.. stay behind till it's safe. It's not that difficult is it??

No, but I have seen the same almost-accident happen twice - the bendy bus overtakes a cyclist, then starts pulling back in before the rear of the bus has cleared the cylcist. The cyclist gets trapped by the swingin-in rear portion.

One of these incidents was on London Bridge, up against the railing. The cyclist was VERY lucky not to have been crushe/run over. His bike was wrecked.

 

[Gixxer1000]

http://philtaylor.org.uk/?p=726

 

[Kanda]

No, but I have seen the same almost-accident happen twice - the bendy bus overtakes a cyclist, then starts pulling back in before the rear of the bus has cleared the cylcist. The cyclist gets trapped by the swingin-in rear portion.

One of these incidents was on London Bridge, up against the railing. The cyclist was VERY lucky not to have been crushe/run over. His bike was wrecked.

Ouch!!! They need to educate the drivers somewhat!!

 

[London_Calling]

Congestion charge has only made £14m profit (and 30 % of that was from exhorbitant fines) since its so labour intensive and inefficient.

I didn't realise it was supposed to make a profit, I was under the impression the idea was to use the money to increase the bus fleet, fund bus lane camera's, etc. Oh, and reduce congestion.

Who do you think this 'profit' goes to? And where does this figure come from?

 

[Roadkill]

They're not going to start employing conductors again, because they're too expensive and with Oyster there's less need for them. Nor could a bus with an open platform be introduced now, so what's the point of a new-generation Routemaster? Besides, the original one was a product of London Transport in the 1950s, an organisation that did everything in-house and was prepared to spend millions to design a purpose-built London bus to serve for several decades. Tfl doesn't work that way, and anyway, there are far more and more satisfactory double-deckers available to buy straight from the manufacturer now than there were in the 1950s. IMO a 'new Routemaster' is a nice idea and it was probably a good election pitch, but it's never going to happen. Nor could the original ones ever be brought back, since they'll soon be illegal under the DDA, and most of them have been sold off anyway. And tbh, much as the original was an icon, its time had passed. It'd be nice to see some more running on 'heritage routes,' but it's not coming back into everyday use.

 

[Crispy]

http://philtaylor.org.uk/?p=726

This is the critical bit. Figures in green supplied by Kevin Austin. Capital Spending. On what?

However, regardless of that, those figures are pretty damning. Not that I personally mind pricing cars off central streets, though. That doesn't have to be a profitable exercise. Nice if it was though.

 

[citydreams]

http://philtaylor.org.uk/?p=726

Lol.. you've really got your knickers in a twist.

TfL just invested £100 million on the Western Extension.

Had that not had happened there would have been a huge surplus.

If Boris takes the WEZ away you can blame him for the loss of revenue.

If it stays, it will add an extra £80million a year revenue on top of the CCZs £100+million.

 

[Gixxer1000]

Apparently the camera technolgy isnt advanced enough to issue fines- so all pics have to be checked manually= expensive. Anyway sorry for the derail

 

[editor]

They don't want anyone to help them, they want to be independent - you don't seem to get this at all: You want to make independent people dependent again..

Can't you read? The proposed new Routemasters would be fully accessible for disabled people*. But are you really arguing that old people would prefer not to have a conductor onboard?

(*that's what we were told, so we have to run with that for now)

Forget the crass sentimentality, and just deal with progess.

Right. So 'progress' involves producing a bus that is more dangerous to pedestrians and cyclists, prone to catching fire and easy for fare evaders?

 

[Gixxer1000]

Lol.. you've really got your knickers in a twist.

TfL just invested £100 million on the Western Extension.

Had that not had happened there would have been a huge surplus.

If Boris takes the WEZ away you can blame him for the loss of revenue.

If it stays, it will add an extra £80million a year revenue on top of the CCZs £100+million.

What about the £300m startup? The money given to crapita to fix THEIR computers.
Its an embarressment.

 

[citydreams]

Apparently the camera technolgy isnt advanced enough to issue fines- so all pics have to be checked manually= expensive. Anyway sorry for the derail

you're misinformed.

 

[Gixxer1000]

"If Boris takes the WEZ away you can blame him for the loss of revenue."

The same WEZ that the voters dont want?