whats the maddest BNP policy?

[el-ahrairah]

If it's not written down, it clearly doesn't exist.

 

[Riklet]

That one about "sending 'em back where they came from"

 

[Citizen66]

If it's not written down, it clearly doesn't exist.

If it's not in the manifesto then they've changed. Like when abusers of women or children change their spots. The liberals love it.

 

[Greenfish]

Just replace "jews" with "asians"

this is a good point.

 

[King Biscuit Time]

this is a good point.

Why has no-one taken NG to task on the fact that his views (or the public views of the BNP at least) on Jews have softened a great deal in the last 20 years. From mouth-foaming hatred (or the type they now dish out to Muslims) to the point of allowing Jewish people to stand for the party.

Someone need to ask NG if his can ever imagine his views on Islam softening the same way. If not why not.

 

[TAE]

Nope, a joke about Nazi rhetoric, actually!

Very well, carry on.

 

[upsidedownwalrus]

I did look at their London manifesto which said that they would make cash fares the same as oyster fares. About the only sane thing they did say. The whole 'you're saving money by using oyster' is one of the biggest scams in the history of transport. You're not saving money, you're just paying the normal fare.

 

[upsidedownwalrus]

They seem to be using a trick which other fascist parties have used throughout history - throw in some things which will appeal to normal people, like the oyster card thing, or the Iraq war opposition, for sheer populist reasons.

 

[butchersapron]

I'm quite annoyed with otherwise inteligent posters on here giving the BNP the benefit of the democracy doubt.

"Where does it say all these nasty things in their policies, though?"

Ah! yeah. They're ok nowadays because their website says so.

No one has said any such thing though. I think people are pointing out that if you attack them for stuff they don't say, atrribute stuff they reject (for whatever reason) to them then you're handing them a victory on a plate - they only need point out that you're wrong on this and your whole case against them is undermined. It's the exact same trap the lliberal pro-status quo anti-fascists (snigger) have been caught out on time after time over the last ten years. Build up an image of what far-righters are supposed to think, act and even look like and then attack that whilst they walk straight past you without you ever coming near to landing a blow on them.

Since when has being informed about what a party is actually saying a failing anyway? If you want to get to the heart of its appeal to an increasing number of voters and to set public agendas you really need to know what they're saying and how this interacts with those concerns - not simply say yeah clascial fascists, don't need to know anymore and conjure up an image of them marching down whitehell.

 

[Awesome Wells]

Does British jobs mean that places like Honda and Nissan plants will be closed down?

 

[TAE]

I wonder what they think of the brits who go to work in mainland europe and/or who go on holiday in spain.

 

[ViolentPanda]

If it's not in the manifesto then they've changed. Like when abusers of women or children change their spots. The liberals love it.

Manifestos are little more than puffed press releases nowadays, so expecting to find the BNP setting out their full stall of ideas in one would be daft.
If people are really concerned about what the BNP are about, they should be looking at local newsletters and websites, where some of the members actually let their guard down.

 

[ViolentPanda]

Very well, carry on.

Zu befehl, mein fuehrer!

 

[Silver_Fox]

Agree about local newsletters. But surely in the below there is enough for socialists and pro-working class activists to get stuck into them about?

There are enough policies and statements to show that they are anti-working class, racists, sexists, homophobes etc

Along with stuff like being desperate to go to the queens garden party.

Ultimately though there has to be a pro-working class alternative built up at a local level.

Quote:
British National Party (BNP) chairman Nick Griffin has defended a party leaflet which says that black Britons and Asian Britons "do not exist".

The BNP's "Language and Concepts Discipline Manual" says the term used should be "racial foreigners". In a BBC interview, Mr Griffin said to call such people British was a sort of "bloodless genocide" because it denied indigenous people their own identity.
So British black and asian people don't exist?

Quote:
Raise the inheritance tax threshold to £1 million
Party of the workers?

Quote:
Deport two million immigrants
Quote:
Use electronically tagged chain gangs to build coastal defences
Quote:
Re-introduce grammar schools
Quote:
Re-introduce corporal punishment in schools
Quote:
Re-introduce Christian assemblies
Quote:
Introduce a system of workfare for the unemployed
Victorian workhouses?

Quote:
Abolish anti-discrimination laws
Quote:
The BNP has also denounced homosexuality as “form of behavioural deviancy” and “not a valid lifestyle choice”. Griffin claims the BNP speaks for “the majority of the population” who, he says, believe“homosexuality is wrong” and that it “needs to be pushed humanely but firmly back into the closet”. Griffin warns that if gays continue to “press their aims further” there will be an “almighty backlash” which will result in the imprisonment of all homosexuals.
Does this manifesto seems so different from the BNPs? Would it have given any idea of what the organisation who wrote it would actually do if they took power?

http://www.scrapbookpages.com/Dachau.../25Points.html

 

[moon23]

thats just boring racist toss fail
I'm sure there education and economic policy must hold some truly awesome laughs
compulsory morris dancing etc

Most morris sides I know would kick out any BNP members. Their attempts to try and claim Morris as a cultural icon is offensive and has nothing to do with what is a working class folk tradition

 

[likesfish]

sorry don't even know if the bnp are pro or anti Morris.
started this thread to find ammo to point out just how insane they really are.

there point there not really Nazi's (too ugly and no sense of style to be real Nazis and too cowardly as well don't see griffin leading a volunteer brigade to have a crack at the Taliban )

leaving there racist toss to one side
1) they want Ireland to rejoin the UK.
2) there in favor of handing out assualt rifles to the general public.

both ideas are monumentally crazy

 

[The39thStep]

yes thats all pretty nasty .. but where do get most of the above from? doesn't appear to be BNP policies at all .. where are you getting these from?

just a couple of examples re defining fascism .. war is a key one .. yet BNP policy appears to be very isolationist not expansionist .. another is state control yet BNP appear to be in favour of decentrailisation NOT centralisation " ..Power should be devolved to the lowest level possible so that local communities can make decisions which affect them.."

but the key is this from Tatchell " ..As well as the party’s long history of homophobia, BNP activists also stand accused racism, anti-Semitism, holocaust denia and Islamophobia. A disturbing number of past and present BNP members have criminal convictions for violence. Although the BNP has publicly ditched some of its most extreme and bigoted policies, many critics believe this make-over is just an astute public relations exercise designed to con people who were put off by its thuggish, macho neo-Nazi image. They say the BNP hasn’t changed at all; it has just got more professional and media savvy. Disguising its extremist views and donning sharp suits, its game-plan is to copy the tactics of successful European far right parties, such as the Front National in France, the Vlaams Blok in Belgium and the National Democratic Party in Germany.

Ex-BNP activist turned anti-fascist campaigner, Matthew Collins, is a Director of Searchlight’s Operation Wedge. He says the new-look BNP is all spin and PR. The party may have toned down its open racism, homophobia and street violence, but behind the smiling face of its leader Nick Griffin lurks the same old hateful bigotry. It hasn’t really changed its core values and aims."

to attack it simply on policy when as others have ponted out all the other parties support neo liberalism ( bnp opposed to a degree) invading oil countries ( bnp oppossed) privatisation ( bnp oppssed) shutting post offices ( bnp oppossed) cheap labour ( bnp oppossed) etc just does not work

Here lies the rub. The alternative to doing excatly that is to just reel out the BNP are racists line. Every one knows they are, they know they are. Actually there are issues in their policies that can be singled out , for example they still advocate selling off council housing. The biggest issue is that many of their policies on race are either unachievable without massive civil unrest and are unaffordable. If the 'left' actually picked up on post office closures, crime, cheap labour, and other issues and applied a think global act local perspective it could take them on.

 

[moon23]

sorry don't even know if the bnp are pro or anti Morris.
started this thread to find ammo to point out just how insane they really are.

there point there not really Nazi's (too ugly and no sense of style to be real Nazis and too cowardly as well don't see griffin leading a volunteer brigade to have a crack at the Taliban )

leaving there racist toss to one side
1) they want Ireland to rejoin the UK.
2) there in favor of handing out assualt rifles to the general public.

both ideas are monumentally crazy

The BNP have been trying to inflitrate Morris dancing to lay claim to our folk traditions as a cultural icon for their facist ideology. So it's a sore point at the moment!

 

[likesfish]

fascist nutters trying to Morris dance mind boggles
had two would be race warriors try to join the TA once.
fascists and commies are banned from joining the forces but before anybody found the paperwork these two hero's failed to complete the 3 mile run
a rather unkind cpl pointed out "if your mothers had liked African cock maybe you two could run" bit unkind I thought

 

[butchersapron]

fascists and commies are banned from joining the forces

Since when?

And yeah, the TA sounds great on that story.

 

[ViolentPanda]

Since when?

There's been an unofficial bar to members of CPGB etc (which has probably been extended to cover the many grouplets in the interim) since the 1920s, but I'm not aware of a similar one (official or unofficial) against fascists.

 

[JHE]

Communists served during the Second World War and did their National Service like anyone else, up to whenever Nat Service was abolished (early 1960s?).

 

[ViolentPanda]

Communists served during the Second World War and did their National Service like anyone else, up to whenever Nat Service was abolished (early 1960s?).

Did you notice the word "unofficial"?

 

[durruti02]

There's been an unofficial bar to members of CPGB etc (which has probably been extended to cover the many grouplets in the interim) since the 1920s, but I'm not aware of a similar one (official or unofficial) against fascists.

what was the deal with Tom Winteringham then? thought he was a CP soldier ..

 

[butchersapron]

He'd left by then i think, they were actually smearing him as a nazi-trotskyite..the usual...

 

[durruti02]

He'd left by then i think, they were actually smearing him as a nazi-trotskyite..the usual...

yep u right

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Tom_Wintringham

also says he was banned from joining home guard .. and i never realised that the CP called him a Trot .. what a mess they were

his home guard guerilla warfare book 'New Ways of War' was one of the books i read the most as a kid .. it was on the shelves in the loo!

 

[elbows]

I notice the BNP's "Language and Concepts Discipline Manual" was mentioned earlier in the thread, has this been talked about here much?

It seems to be on wikileaks, and its interesting in places.

http://wikileaks.org/wiki/British_National_Party_Language_and_Concepts_Discipline_Manual,_July_2005

A few extracts:

Rule #1: The BNP is not a ‘racist’ or ‘racial’ or ‘racialist’ or ‘race-conscious’ or ‘white’ or ‘white- people’s’ party. It should never be referred to as such by BNP activists, and anyone else who does so must be politely but firmly corrected. The precisely correct description of what we are, in the standard terminology of international comparative politics, is an ‘ethno-nationalist’ party. That is, we espouse, like many political parties all over the world, the interests of the particular ethnic groups to which we belong. There is nothing fascistic or unusual about this, and we don’t have to apologise for it. If we must describe our attitude towards race, it is ‘racial realism,’ as no-one can admit being against realism.

Rule #9: The BNP strongly prefers the term ‘hard right’ to ‘far right,’ ‘extreme right,’ or ‘radical right.” ‘Hard’ implies moral seriousness and firmness of purpose. ‘Far’ and ‘extreme’ imply we are outside the spectrum of reasonable opinion. ‘Radical’ is acceptable when addressing a highly disaffected audience, especially when making ‘radical’ critiques of the present regime, but is otherwise to be used sparingly, lest
we sound like Marxist troublemakers. The best term of all is ‘patriotic right’, as opposed to ‘unpatriotic right’ or ‘globalist right’ (i.e the Tories).

Rule #13: When addressing a specific audience, arguments for our policies should always be couched in language calculated to be relevant to the interests of that audience. Do not bore a workingmen’s audience with those parts of our ideology that derive from old-school Toryism, or puzzle an affluent suburban audience with an explanation of worker ownership of industry. Equally, don’t deny that these other parts of our ideology exist; they are nothing to be ashamed of and will not alienate any true supporter.

Rule #14: Racial and ethnic epithets and insults should never be used. If you just want to make trouble, join the National Front or some other psychologically twisted, politically useless and sometimes criminal organisation.

 

[Azrael]

If it wasn't too incredible, I'd wonder if the BNP are a straw man party set up to discredit conservatism. Their polices are all parodies of conservative positions. The right to bear arms in personal self-defence becomes the right to whield assault rifles, of use only if you intend to shoot it out with the Coldstream Guards. Concerns about the Good Friday Agreement and respecting the wishes of the protestant minority in Ireland become an unhinged plan to re-conquer Eire. Now I find that they want to ban modern architecture.

Throw in the dribbling racial bigotry and you have a perfect smear-job. Sadly they're for real. I'd be amazed if they ever implemented the above policies, or believe them. Their extreme nature indicates that they're not thought through, and adopted only because the BNP think they'll be popular. Racialism is all they care about. The policy on tooling up the people with military hardware is especially unlikely. You only let citizens own guns if you trust them, and I suspect the BNP despise anyone who isn't in their sordid little club.

 

[Fedayn]

Since when?

And yeah, the TA sounds great on that story.

When I joined the Army in the 80's you were handed a leaflet that made it clear that membership of fascist or communist organisations was prohibited.

 

[Serotonin]

My personal favourite is their opposition to globalisation. They plan on ending globalisation by stopping the majority of foriegn imports, which will in turn end unemployment in the UK.

A stroke of political genius that!