The problem of Kosovo is not the same as the partion, poltically and ethnically of Bosnia. What is your point about Britain killing Iraqis? Serbian agression has a lot to answer for, whether people protested against it or not. Fetishising Serbs killed at the hands Nasir Oric is not going to change minds on that score.
Western Media Ignores Serb US Memorials of Jasenovac
- Thread starter oisleep
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EuroDude2006
New Member
No I am not British I am Irish. So I don't accept responsibility for that.
Estimates on the numbers of deaths vary widely from 25,000 to 100,000. Personally I have mixed feelingd about the war. I agree that lies were told to justify it e.g. "No doubt that Iraq has WMD" etc. and that the true motive from the US point of view was oil, with the entirely-unrelated 911 being invoked to justify an invasion when the terrorism in Iraq is actually a result rather than a cause of the invasion. 81% in this country opposed the war.To be fair to the British, they do not have the Irish electoral system and this means it can be difficult to vote as you would like, because you can split the vote if you vote Lib Dem and thereby let in the Tories. So I don't blame them becos only 36% of them voted Labour anyway. And the British army isn't engaged in genocide in Iraq, unlike the Serbs were.
nino_savatte
No pasaran!
What about those lovely men from the Ustaše (Jasenovac was run by the Ustaše with the approval of the Catholic Church)? Or did you forget about them?
EuroDude2006
New Member
nino_savatte said:
I know that they committed genocide against Serbs. I am not excusing that. But naturally, for people alive now, in general, the vast majority of the pictures and media stories we have heard about in the former Yugoslavia concerning massacres has related to Serbian massacres and as such, it is natural that they are at the foremost in peoples' minds regarding what we know about. Past attrocities should not excuse recent ones.
EuroDude2006 said:
your first sentence is exactly the issue i've been trying to put across, pictures & media dictate a one sided story, all i want is some balance and a truer account of the conflict, not what the pictures & media do
I doubt anyone has ever tried to claim that past attrocities do excuse recent ones
apart from the someone earlier on this thread who said the expulsion of the serb civilians from the kragina/knin, was them "getting a taste of their own medicine"
Is it not just the very agreeable view that Serb agression was portrayed by the western media in an unbalanced way, and the lack og recognition of agression against Serbs that annoys you so much. Do you disagree also with the influence of the Greater Serbia idea? Of which there is evidence to support this.
Ryazan said:
yes that's right
of course the idea of a greater serbia was a huge driving force behind the conflict, and i have as little time for serbian nationalism as i do for croat or german.Like all state nationalisms, imo, they are conceived and nurtured by the state elites for their own ends to the ultimate detriment of the people. The serbs (people) are suffering as a result of this in terms of their day to day lives and then also subject to worldwide demonisation by such lazy analysis in the media. And to the extent that any word said in defence of the serbs, as has been demonstrated by many of the threads about it here, immediately has people crying out that "they deserved it" and such like
edit: why is serbia the only nation where it's people have to be held accountable for the crimes of a top layer of largely unelected officials & generals & criminals? If this analysis is going to be used it should be used it should at least be consistently applied to the horrors perpetrated by all states
nino_savatte
No pasaran!
EuroDude2006 said:
So you accept the media's view that the Serbs are inherently 'evil'. Is this correct?
Cadmus
SINsational
Actually, this idea went very far. There was a serious movement after WWII which called for collective punishment of the German nation. The rationale behind it was that they knew what was going on and that they supported Hitler. As collective criminality is not easily enforceable (the suggestion in this case was to subject the whole nation to forced labour) the idea was dropped in favour of the Nuremberg trials.Poi E said:
Cadmus
SINsational
Sorry, can't remember whether it was a singular country (and if it was which one) or just one of the possible solutions that the allies collectively had on the table when they were deciding what to do. IIRC tho (just as an interesting point) Britain was in favour of summary execution of the Nazi leaders, without due process but was persuaded to support other solutions for numerous reasons, the main one being "documenting the atrocities"Poi E said:
... this is however completely normal and hardly open to criticism as it was the time when the concept of individual criminal responsibility for war crimes, crimes against humanity and genocide was literally being pushed out of the womb so they were struggling with the problems it brings. at that point there were no ready solutions - that's why i think that's its actually irrelevant which country advocated this collective punishment approach as those were the times when they were trying to come up with a solution and lots of ideas, including insane ones, were proposed just to end the agony of finding the solution. it should be regarded as infant disease.Offtopic finished.
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