Welsh Addresses
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Snorkelboy
A fish is not just 4 xmas
mwgdrwg said:
So what's going to happen to saundersfoot in your ideal dictatorship then?
Snorkelboy
A fish is not just 4 xmas
So why should the minority's wishes be more important than the majority's?
Snorkelboy
A fish is not just 4 xmas
mwgdrwg said:
But of course you are right?
How are you going to do it. Is the North going to march on the South and occupy us?
Pingu
Credo
mwgdrwg said:
Ynys Môn if you dont mind
(where I woz born: Camaes)my welsh is just about passable these days but wherever I go in the world I try to learn the local language as I think its rude not too.
I have to say I am not a nationalist by any stretch of the imagination but I am very proud of my Welsh heriatige and maybe people should look into the extremly brutal treatment of the Welsh by the English before passing comments on why a lot of Welsh people have so little time for the English
come home to a real fire... buy a holiday cottage in Denbych
Pingu
Credo
Wolfie said:and I was hoping to learn Welsh. As someone who failed O Level French and wasn't even allowed to take the latin exam I don't stand an earthly do I?
I'l just have to stick to my slowly improving "Wenglish"
just to make your thoughts even more confused there are differences between northern (gog - caveman) and southern (BBC ) welsh too.
its worth it though as its a beautiful melodic language. Plus it helps you avoid a kicking in some pubs in Caernafon.
stdPikachu
Plughole in bathtub curve
mwgdrwg said:
And what about the old english names? I used to live in a town near the English border with an anglo-saxon (note: that's not welsh, never has been, never will) name. This too should be welshified and renamed?
The road I used to live on was named after the local nobleman thingy who'd been living in the area for centuries. The welshification of this street name resulted in the council mis-spelling his family name on the street sign. I can handle that, but I can't handle removing his real name after his real one has been edited.
To take your point to it's logical conclusion would be to ban the teaching and speaking of english in wales and changing the names of anyone with a non-welsh name. You live in a bilingual country. Get over it.
Snorkelboy
A fish is not just 4 xmas
Pingu said:
But my point is that in a lot of wales the local language is English.
Dr. Christmas
ca suffit
I thought that this thread would go this way. 
Another fucking Wales vs. Wales fixture. No-one's better at it than ourselves.
Another fucking Wales vs. Wales fixture. No-one's better at it than ourselves.
LilMissHissyFit
Disturbed in a pink bra
s14n said:Ditto, nothing quite like feeling as though you are a pariah in your own homeland
Its quite pathetic. I think we live in a bilingual country and should celecrate and cherish it as it is not fight over some sort of welsh language superiority.I also think the welsh nationalists and welsh language activists should remember its not been long since children were taught no welsh at school ( I did 2 years of 2 hours a week... hardly enough to learn anything)
Rightly people should be able to recieve information in welsh or english, street signs should have both english and welsh on them etc.
Like it or not if you implement a welsh only policy you will cost this county millions as its now becoming a properous, cosmopoiltan nation after decades of being marginalised ( by the english).Trade will fall if you wont trade in english or do business using the english language. Nobody else in the world is going to go off and become fluent in welsh in order to do business here,take a holiday here or visit for business they'll just avoid coming here.
You have to face facts. most people in Wales dont speak welsh as their first language. By all means cherish it, encourage its use and teach it in schools, offer free courses to whoever wants to learn ( all of those happen already) but forcing english speakers who are welsh born and bred to use welsh will cause a mass revolt against the langage. It would be counterproductive and most english speakers would simply react in the same way that the welsh did when english was enforced years ago, only now I expect far more militantly.
LilMissHissyFit
Disturbed in a pink bra
mwgdrwg said:
And forcing Welsh people who are first language english to speak, read and converse in welsh would do just that.English people in wales would feel like foreigners in their own country. Its hardly progressive.
People born bred and brought up here (and who identify themselves as as welsh as the next person no matter what language they speak) would have to choose between the language of their choice/mothervtonugue and the homeland in which they live
Times have changed, you cannot change the past. You cab encourage by all means but you'll never get enforced welsh speaking/signage in Wales. it just wont happen.
stdPikachu said:
This is true - but maybe it wouldn't be if it wasn't for the hard-line attitudes in the past of people like mwgdrwg? My parents got beaten if they spoke welsh at school (in the 30s) - that wasn't designed to promote a bilingual society was it? It was designed to make English the only language spoken there (particularly by wealthy/educated people).
Wales is bilingual - to an extent at least - because hardcore Welsh speakers have tried to ensure that the language is still a living language of Wales. Otherwise, maybe, it would have gone the way of Gaelic in Scotland.
I do think it's too late to stop English being the dominant language in Wales, but it's simplistic to say that Welsh language campaigning is pointless for that reason. Personally, I think Welsh, then English is best for signs and so on. Promote Welsh, but don't try to pretend that everyone in Wales is Meibion Glyndwr. Welsh english-speakers have rights too, don't they?
Snorkelboy
A fish is not just 4 xmas
jd for tea said:
But nobody has said that AFAICS.
Everybody who has disagreed with Mwgrdwg has been positive about encouraging the Welsh Language, just not oppressive imposing of it on the majority of welsh people who don't speak it.
Snorkelboy said:
Did I attribute that comment to a poster?
At any rate, "You live in a bilingual country - get over it" seemed to me to be less than positive. People are reasonable about multi-lingual issues these days, but that's not always been the case. I thought it worth making the point that imposing a language that the majority don't speak is exactly what happened in Wales, with English, in the hope that it would promote understanding... and perhaps suggest that without those extreme attitutudes that wouldn't be a bilingual culture in wales at all.
I don't agree, but I understand why some people get so angry about it. Repression of Welsh occured within living memory.
Snorkelboy
A fish is not just 4 xmas
mwgdrwg said:
No - not at all.
Swansea is called and thought of as Swansea by the vast majority of its people. To remove Swansea from signs would be unjust.
Lilmisshissyfit was right to imply that the logical extension of your idea is to ban the official use of the English Language (the majority language in Wales).
Snorkelboy
A fish is not just 4 xmas
mwgdrwg said:
You seem to have a logical block. Swansea is not English speaking because it's full of English people. It's English speaking because of historical injustices (yes, by the English). But imposing Welsh on the English speaking Welsh people is just as unjust.
Snorkelboy
A fish is not just 4 xmas
mwgdrwg said:
OK - glad we agree on the bilingual thing.
I don't think it's unjust to have Welsh only place names. I just think that the only way it's going to happen is by some outside force imposing it on the people of the area. Which would be unjust.
Road signs in Welsh then English are a danger to 80%+ of the road users in Wales because half the time you haven't read it by the time you've passed it, as has been pointed out to me numerous times by Welsh people since I've been staying in Crug Hywel (Crickhowell) and working in Aberhonddu (Brecon).
I'm keen to learn Welsh as I'm going to be living here and working in a public service role but I'm concerned that the political differences around the language issue are having a damaging effect on Wales' economy and identity - it's clearly a linguistically and ideologically divided country in a way I hadn't appreciated before and I don't think this state of affairs is in anyone's best interests, although I've no idea what can be done about it.
(fekkin English immigrant stealing our jobs and bumping up our house prices, you're not entitled to an opinion)
I'm keen to learn Welsh as I'm going to be living here and working in a public service role but I'm concerned that the political differences around the language issue are having a damaging effect on Wales' economy and identity - it's clearly a linguistically and ideologically divided country in a way I hadn't appreciated before and I don't think this state of affairs is in anyone's best interests, although I've no idea what can be done about it.
(fekkin English immigrant stealing our jobs and bumping up our house prices, you're not entitled to an opinion)
Snorkelboy
A fish is not just 4 xmas
mwgdrwg said:
A nice double dragon for me
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