Wayne Rooney - cnut

[handy1]

I'm not talking about losing players to different clubs.Of course that would piss you off though.I don't know the West Ham Chelsea thing too much but Rooney going to the septics is like Gerry Adams joining the U.F.F.(slightly over the top like but you get the idea ).We HATE each other.

Oh dear...i hope He/She has gone for a lie down,being so upset.

H

 

[Lad]

"Oh dear...i hope He/She has gone for a lie down,being so upset."


Ever been the match then?

 

[handy1]

"Oh dear...i hope He/She has gone for a lie down,being so upset."


Ever been the match then?

One can attend?

One thought the crowd were all extras.
















Waits for obvious crap,prawn sandwich joke.

 

[Lad]

"Waits for obvious crap,prawn sandwich joke."

So that's neither a yes or no.I thought you might say I don't know what the fuss is all about.22 grown men chasing a bag of air.Your ex captain said about the prawns didn't he?

 

[handy1]

Put a question together i'll answer it.



God,i miss MMMSky.........

 

[Lad]

"Ever been the match then?"


"Your ex captain said about the prawns didn't he?"


"Put a question together i'll answer it."


I was just nosin about what sort of supporter you were.Lower Broughton Deliverence sort or Wiltshire beaut.You know the script a bit of banter.

 

[handy1]

What sort of supporter am i? my tagline says it all really.

Banter? no probs.shoot.

H

 

[STFC]

It might mean nothing to some but it does to us.I've got more respect for Gary Neville than him.

So you weren't one of the mickeys who reported him for celebrating in front of you then? Good on you.

 

[Mr Retro]

I met my mate
the other day
he said he just seen
the white Pele

So I asked him
who was he
he said he goes by the name
of Wayne Rooney

Wayne Rooney
Wayne Rooney
he goes by the name
of Wayne Rooney

 

[William of Walworth]

I'd wager that when he kissed the badge, those oh-so-sensitive Evertonians who were probably abusing him throughout the game ran straight to the nearest steward or copper to report him for 'incitement'.

Rooney's a numpty, of course he is. He is a professional footballer after all. But plenty of fans are numpties too. The game's gone fucking soft.

Never thought I'd get an different perspective on this from a Sw*nd*n fan ... but you have a point maybe, Cunty Ground man ....

 

[maverick28]

FFS - bollocks about the loyalty card business, joining the scum was the best thing he could have done, yeah I hate the fuckers but at the end of the day im a fan of football too and i appreciate talent - Rooney has this in abundance no question. Could you have honestly seen him playing for Bobs Fish & Chip Shop for 5 yrs??? Plus you got about 30 million

 

[tangerinedream]

A bit confused...

What I don't get is this line about it being good for him to join United... Would Everton have somehow drained his football ability? I don't see why, if they were good enough to nurture him into the player that exploded into the premiership and international stage, they weren't good enough for him to actually play for. What is this wierd myth that says, unless you are one of the chosen few teams (the usual champions league cartel) then you somehow have no right to have skillful players.

Do you honestly all think Moyes would be in the dressing room saying - 'Stop dribbling Wayne and just hoof it for fucks sake' or showing him pictures of Kevin Campbell and saying 'One day son, you could be this good' - No would he fuck. Its a sad enditement of both football and individual loyalty when a player has to leave a club the size of Everton 'for the good of his career' - Was it me, or was rooney not pretty good for England while at Everton? - Why wouldn't that have continued?

 

[sleaterkinney]

You need a regular diet of top football, to get used to playing with and against better players and in big occasions.

He wouldn't get that at Everton, they're shite.

 

[tangerinedream]

You need a regular diet of top football, to get used to playing with and against better players and in big occasions.

He wouldn't get that at Everton, they're shite.

so how come he coped with 'the big occaisions' as a young everton player and took to the international stage like a duck to water. He was an Everton player in Euro 2004 - which is pretty much as big as it comes, don't give me a shite line about needing to learn the 'top class' game please. A few games of champions league football are neither here nor there. You can either play, or not and he clearly can. I say again, would Everton have drained his talent?

Brilliant in Euro2004 at Everton.
Mediocre in WC2006 at Utd.

http://news.bbc.co.uk/sport1/hi/football/euro_2004/england/3828819.stm

Go figure as the yanks would say.

 

[sleaterkinney]

so how come he coped with 'the big occaisions' as a young everton player and took to the international stage like a duck to water. He was an Everton player in Euro 2004 - which is pretty much as big as it comes, don't give me a shite line about needing to learn the 'top class' game please. A few games of champions league football are neither here nor there. You can either play, or not and he clearly can. I say again, would Everton have drained his talent?

That's rubbish - you can't grow as a player unless you get new challenges and he wouldn't get that at Everton. To get better he has to play with and against better players so he learns from them - it's not rocket science.

Brilliant in Euro2004 at Everton.
Mediocre in WC2006 at Utd.

Go figure as the yanks would say.

How about 'figuring' coming back from an injury and playing in a shite team - he just barely made the WC in the first place.

 

[tangerinedream]

That's rubbish - you can't grow as a player unless you get new challenges and he wouldn't get that at Everton. To get better he has to play with and against better players so he learns from them - it's not rocket science.
How about 'figuring' coming back from an injury and playing in a shite team - he just barely made the WC in the first place.

Oh, do get your head from up your elitist arse. Why was he brilliant in Euro 2004? Why?

I presume you don't conclude that Steven Gerrard 'needs' to leave Anfield, a club that apart from one season of a flukey cup win has been consistently mediocre for the last 15 years. Why not go to Old Trafford, Steve? New challenges, better players etc

I can see why he went, it just fucking irks me, people's stupid presumptions that anyone other than the top 4 deserves a skillful player - because ultimately, that's what you are saying isn't it.

 

[sleaterkinney]

Oh, do get your head from up your elitist arse. Why was he brilliant in Euro 2004? Why? .

Seriously, do you think he hasn't gotten better as a player since he went to utd?. I do.

I presume you don't conclude that Steven Gerrard 'needs' to leave Anfield, a club that apart from one season of a flukey cup win has been consistently mediocre for the last 15 years. Why not go to Old Trafford, Steve? New challenges, better players etc

The premier league is the only thing he hasn't won there, that's hardly mediocre.

I can see why he went, it just fucking irks me, people's stupid presumptions that anyone other than the top 4 deserves a skillful player - because ultimately, that's what you are saying isn't it.

The best teams are the best teams because they have the skillful players - that's how it works....

 

[tangerinedream]

Seriously, do you think he hasn't gotten better as a player since he went to utd?. I do.

He's got older

The premier league is the only thing he hasn't won there, that's hardly mediocre.

One less thing than he could win at OT, might as well go hadn't he.

The best teams are the best teams because they have the skillful players - that's how it works....

What sort of answer is that? You clearly believe that a highly skillful player at a 'lesser' club should always transfer to a top club. So say, Le Tissier or Rooney or lets even say Kevin Nolan, Curtis Davis etc, etc shouldn't be loyal as their only loyalty is to themselves to get success fast, now, imediately, straight away. Therefore you are supporting a situation where a side can never really hope to progress as all it's best youngsters will go to bigger clubs.

Doesn't make for especially exciting times ahead for the fans of the other 87 clubs outside your little niche of 'the best' does it?

Why not just fuck the whole idea of youth development off and make everyone an official scouting outpost for the big 4?

 

[sleaterkinney]

One less thing than he could win at OT, might as well go hadn't he.

What are you on about?. He's got CL football every year, winning trophies etc.

What sort of answer is that? You clearly believe that a highly skillful player at a 'lesser' club should always transfer to a top club. So say, Le Tissier or Rooney or lets even say Kevin Nolan, Curtis Davis etc, etc shouldn't be loyal as their only loyalty is to themselves to get success fast, now, imediately, straight away. Therefore you are supporting a situation where a side can never really hope to progress as all it's best youngsters will go to bigger clubs.

That's not quite what I said is it?. If they want to get better then one of the things they can do is move to a club where this can happen.
If they're happy where they are then by all means stay. But the other side of the coin is that they should make the most of their talent - they have a responsibility to do themselves justice.

 

[Lad]

"I presume you don't conclude that Steven Gerrard 'needs' to leave Anfield, a club that apart from one season of a flukey cup win has been consistently mediocre for the last 15 years."


I think you'll find that we've had more than 1,even flukey,cup win in the last 15 years.We haven't won the title though so for us it hasn't been good enough.The rest of the post is right in pointing out the soccer am isation of football.

"FFS - bollocks about the loyalty card business, joining the scum was the best thing he could have done"

Yeh fuck that loyalty shit things like that mean nothing-if you're a glory hunter.


"What sort of supporter am i? my tagline says it all really."


That's a bit vague.

 

[tangerinedream]

What are you on about?. He's got CL football every year, winning trophies etc.

That's not quite what I said is it?. If they want to get better then one of the things they can do is move to a club where this can happen.
If they're happy where they are then by all means stay. But the other side of the coin is that they should make the most of their talent - they have a responsibility to do themselves justice.

What's so great about CL football then? - I'm on about the fact that Liverpool havn't come even close to winning the title for over 15 years, therefore Gerrard should go to United or Chelsea to make him a better player and win the title (your own logic). I think it's quite obvious what I mean and like all koppites you are going to hide behind a load of tinpot devalued trophy wins to disguise the fact that you havn't been the best for nearly 20 years.

Anyway,

Tom Finney or Stanley Matthews weren't great players then? They didn't get better over their careers or make the most of their talents as they didn't play for teams that challenged for honours very often. Same with say, Gordan Banks and Geoff Hurst or even Bobby Moore - what did he win? Not much really at club level, but yet he wasn't bad was he? - By your logic, these players have wasted their careers at second string clubs and were only half the players they could have been. There's only about 9 domestic medals between those 5 players. Jimmy Greaves - he didn't win very much either. Waste of space he was.

I ask again, where is your evidence that staying at Everton would have had a detremental effect on Rooney's ability level?

 

[pk]

To stare at Everton fans and kiss the Man U badge (I dislike badge kissers anyway as a rule) is asking for murder.

Oh grow up, for fucks sake.

Sure, Rooney's a cunt, but he's a product of his environment - that is the environment of stupid people who talk about murder when he kisses part of his football shirt.

 

[Biffo]

Oh grow up, for fucks sake.

Sure, Rooney's a cunt, but he's a product of his environment - that is the environment of stupid people who talk about murder when he kisses part of his football shirt.

Ah..... The environment of the Sky Sports generation?

 

[sleaterkinney]

What's so great about CL football then? - I'm on about the fact that Liverpool havn't come even close to winning the title for over 15 years, therefore Gerrard should go to United or Chelsea to make him a better player and win the title (your own logic).

Why do you keep misrepresenting my views?. I never mentioned anything about the title making someone a better player, can you argue with the points I make?

Tom Finney or Stanley Matthews weren't great players then? They didn't get better over their careers or make the most of their talents as they didn't play for teams that challenged for honours very often. Same with say, Gordan Banks and Geoff Hurst or even Bobby Moore - what did he win? Not much really at club level, but yet he wasn't bad was he? - By your logic, these players have wasted their careers at second string clubs and were only half the players they could have been. There's only about 9 domestic medals between those 5 players. Jimmy Greaves - he didn't win very much either. Waste of space he was.

And football was different back then so the comparison is meaningless.

I ask again, where is your evidence that staying at Everton would have had a detremental effect on Rooney's ability level?

Where did I say he would lose ability?. I said get better

ffs, try arguing against the points I actually make, have you trouble reading or something?.

 

[pk]

Ah..... The environment of the Sky Sports generation?

Been going on for longer than Sky were around, but yeah, I guess...

 

[tangerinedream]

Why do you keep misrepresenting my views?. I never mentioned anything about the title making someone a better player, can you argue with the points I make?
And football was different back then so the comparison is meaningless.
Where did I say he would lose ability?. I said get better

ffs, try arguing against the points I actually make, have you trouble reading or something?.

No, think about the point you are making if you don't want to complain about me viewing it as what it can be legitimately read as. i.e. your tacit support for a vision of football where only the top 4/5 teams matter.

I only picked Gerrard to wind you up a bit. - the point is, he could have had more challenges and pressure at a bigger club and won more stuff. Which seemed to be your justification for why Rooney was right to leave.

Could you explain in exact detail what was different about football then? Was it not 11 v 11 on the same pitch with roughly the same rules? 'It was different' is the most piss poor defence I have ever heard in my life. (I predict you will mention the 'champions league' as if the European Cup wasn't in existence.

 

[DRINK?]

Course he's made the right decision....come to the biggest club in the world, not rocket science is it....compare him in a way to Le tiss at Southampton...he wouldn't want to be a big fish in a little pond all his career, can't blame him

 

[sleaterkinney]

No, think about the point you are making if you don't want to complain about me viewing it as what it can be legitimately read as. i.e. your tacit support for a vision of football where only the top 4/5 teams matter.

No, that's what you choose to read into it. What team do you support incidentally?.

I only picked Gerrard to wind you up a bit. - the point is, he could have had more challenges and pressure at a bigger club and won more stuff. Which seemed to be your justification for why Rooney was right to leave.

I would point out that he gets plenty of challenges and wins plenty of stuff at Liverpool as it is compared to what Shrek would playing kick and rush at Everton.

Could you explain in exact detail what was different about football then? Was it not 11 v 11 on the same pitch with roughly the same rules? 'It was different' is the most piss poor defence I have ever heard in my life. (I predict you will mention the 'champions league' as if the European Cup wasn't in existence.

You don't think football has changed at all in the past 40 or 50 years - Have you ever seen any old football matches?. Tackling from behind and no pass back to the goalie for example never mind the better preperation they have nowadays, you're having a laugh.

 

[tangerinedream]

No, that's what you choose to read into it. What team do you support incidentally?.
I would point out that he gets plenty of challenges and wins plenty of stuff at Liverpool as it is compared to what Shrek would playing kick and rush at Everton.
You don't think football has changed at all in the past 40 or 50 years - Have you ever seen any old football matches?. Tackling from behind and no pass back to the goalie for example never mind the better preperation they have nowadays, you're having a laugh.

a) their are different levels of meaning inherent in everything we write, I didn't choose to read anything in what you wrote deliberately, I have no beef with you or anything.

b) but, he could still get a higher level of pressure, better team mates at another club. I'm not an Everton fan so not bothered if you want to dig at them. - I maintain, by your logic, Gerrard should move.

c) But the central concept that the best players need to play 'at the highest level' - why would that be any different? Of course the game has changed, but not that much and even if it has changed that much, then it's a level playing field, still doesn't explain why Finney and Matthews were the best, despite playing for clubs that won virtually nowt.

I do not understand why Rooney or anyone else has to be at a 'big' club to be a great player. I understand why HE would go, but not why neutrals (or indeed koppites) would accept the notion that to be great, you have to play for Chelsea, Arsenal or Man Utd.

It's not like Everton actually do play kick and rush either, or that Moyes' training is fundementally that different from say, Alex Ferguson's. It's not like Moyes is an idiot and gets them to smoke 40 capstan then throw a medicine ball arround, while Fergie is doing martial arts style mental training and reading the players a bit of Sartre.

I would argue the difference between Everton and Utd is no different than the difference between a mid table team and a title challenging team in 1960's - therefore as great players played in mid table sides then, why not now? If there is a difference, it is that the teams are more entrenched in their roles these days and the more stars that leave teams like Everton the more stagnant the league will be - why defend that?

I do not understand why Rooney HAD to leave in your eyes, he was already an England regular, already had proved himself on the world stage and was playing for his boyhood club, which are a massive team with a long, long history of great and skillful players. Clearly his coaching hadn't harmed him up to them and I do not honestly see why your logic of 'challenge' and 'better players arround him' doesn't extend to Liverpool's best players going to Chelsea or Madrid with your happy blessing.

Maybe I'm just bitter that Rooney left, as for just 5 minutes I was half interested in the premiership, in a bit of romance and I got a kick out of a kid from Croxteth doing his bit for his hometown club. Maybe I'm just niave and stupid to think that Roony scoring 900 goals for utd will never mean as much as one of his Everton goals, maybe I'm saddened that it's like this now. I just can't work out why anyone would defend 'the way it is'

and by the way...

"only one pool in England, only one pool in England"

 

[nonamenopackdrill]

Me too td, on the romance and hometown stuff. I actually could see him leaving when he was 21/22, but I thought he'd stick to his word, and there's no denying it hurts.

He has to expect stick after that though.