Squatticus
for an armed populace
Cool gadget here. You'll have to know how many members your region has, and estimate what share of the vote the different parties will get. Should be easy enough to find last time's stats online.
Voting in the euro elections?
- Thread starter trevhagl
- Start date
Cool gadget here. You'll have to know how many members your region has, and estimate what share of the vote the different parties will get. Should be easy enough to find last time's stats online.
danny la rouge
Ninja swords for all disabled people
I wonder if they know it's from Offenbach's Orpheus in the Underworld? And if they do, what symbolism that conveys?
Nigel
For A Degenerates' Workers State
Do you know much about this candidate:Felicity Norman, does she support eco-socialist agenda?
Probably vote Green first NO2EU second. If their not going to stand in EU parliament, and the project seems badly organised and could fall flat on its face, could be a case of one step forward two step backwards, especially as the hearts of many of the activists involved are not in it.
However, national publicity i.e. T.V. Euro Parliamentry Broadcasts, especially around Lyndsey and Visteon disputes make it worthwhile giving it some support.
belboid
Exasperated, not angry.
she's a director of the Robert Owen Society, which should make her a bit of a socialist.
you'll have spoilt your ballot paper if you do that
I buy into all of that and at no stage have I said that you need to vote Tory to stop the BNP. It was merely trying ascertain if people would if it meant in a hypothetical senario it would stop the BNP.
But this notion of voting having nothing to do with stopping the BNP is bollocks. Your 'real alternative' can only come about via the political process of which standing for election is a crucial part. I would happily see the Conservatives not put up candidates and encourage those who would vote for it to support the candidate most likely to stop the BNP if it would make a difference but for some of you lefties on here it seems that you dont seem that keen on anything that would really make a difference to stopping the BNP actually happening.
It strikes me that for many on the left its easier to define yourselves by what you are against rather than what you are for and that a strong BNP gives you a secret thrill because you have an enemy to spark off against as opposed to really trying to build something to stop them.
belboid
Exasperated, not angry.
and it seems astoundingly easy for you to (deliberately, probably) miss the point. Voting Tory, in any circumstance, only helps the BNP and their ilk. they will never be any part of the solution.
Maybe voting will play in part in their defeat, but only if there is a decent party to vote for. Voting for anyone simply to stop them will be no help whatsoever.
But, as I said before, the important thing is dealing with the issues, not the votes.
Maybe voting will play in part in their defeat, but only if there is a decent party to vote for. Voting for anyone simply to stop them will be no help whatsoever.
But, as I said before, the important thing is dealing with the issues, not the votes.
danny la rouge
Ninja swords for all disabled people
Nope.
If you read my post about electoral performance above, you'll see that the BNP are not electorally strong round these parts. That gives me a thrill. Not that I'd be complacent, but those are the facts. Nor, more importantly, are they organisationally strong round these parts, and I find that a very encouraging sign.
danny la rouge
Ninja swords for all disabled people
Absolutely.
Well I guess we will need to agree to disagree but I cannot help but thinking that what you are after is never going to happen and that this mythical left-wing political movement which is going to be embraced by the white working classes who are going to join up with their brothers and sisters of various hues and different faiths in a glorious uprising of internationalism and socialist unity is just pissing in the wind of the political reality of modern Britain.
Me, I think the BNP are largely pricks but run by some very sinister types at the top who sense that maybe tomorrow does belong to them. And that those who want to oppose them are so fractured by outdated concepts of class warfare and the discredited works of dead Germans ( I aint saying that the BNP do not share a similar love of a dead Germans but they aint being blindsided still by them ) that they just have to sit back and allow time to bring them more and more support because the alternatives are just more consumed with hatred for each other.
The BNP are going to be part of this countrys official representation in Europe come June 5th. That seems to be a given. This idea that we can just sit back and let you on the left stop has patently not worked. And the sooner that you accept this and start looking to form broader coalitions the better.
belboid
Exasperated, not angry.
whether that happens or not, the methods that would be sued to build such a movement can be used to stop the bnp. It's happened before, and it will happen again. Continuing to support mainstream parties as a way of stopping the wankers is a method doomed to failure tho.
It is not a given by any means, they, and plenty of media commentators have said they would win seats the last wo times round. they didnt. And you can sit back or not, being a right-wing prick doesnt necesarilly mean you can't do something useful in your locality to stop them. Voting wont be that thing tho.
Well it is far from certain that the bnp will get elected this time, but it is entirely feasable, they will pick up a lot of ukip's votes from last time and anyone who dosen't think that ukip kept the bnp out last time is a fool. In the North West I'd say that Green is probably the best tactical antifascist vote (but I would wouldnt I) but in Yorks and Humber, I think the Tories will regain most of the voters they lost to ukip and pull ahead of Labour, and to get their third and the region's last seat, they'll need triple what the fourth place party get.
the ways the bnp will be kept out of yorkshire's 6th seat are
assuming they come fourth:
*the tories win and get 3 times what the bnp get,
con-3 lab-2 ld-1
*labour stay ahead of the tories and get triple the bnp's vote,
lab-3 con-2 ld-1
*the lib dems get 2 thirds of the winner's vote, around 18% I reckon at a minimum,
con-2 lab-2 ld-2
or any result in which the greens leapfrog them or ukip hold on to 4th
now which one of these is most likely?
I'm not one to advocate voting for the Conservatives, but these are the cold, hard statistics I'm afraid
the ways the bnp will be kept out of yorkshire's 6th seat are
assuming they come fourth:
*the tories win and get 3 times what the bnp get,
con-3 lab-2 ld-1
*labour stay ahead of the tories and get triple the bnp's vote,
lab-3 con-2 ld-1
*the lib dems get 2 thirds of the winner's vote, around 18% I reckon at a minimum,
con-2 lab-2 ld-2
or any result in which the greens leapfrog them or ukip hold on to 4th
now which one of these is most likely?
I'm not one to advocate voting for the Conservatives, but these are the cold, hard statistics I'm afraid
Rod Sleeves
New Member
The only real qualititative change if the BNP get a seat or even two, to the situation in this country at large, will be the amount of money that will flow into the BNP, what with staff costs, expenses, salaries etc. Whether they get a seat or not will do nothing to change the reasons people vote for them, if they narrowly fail to get in it will not be a victory of any sorts - it will not show that their support has collapsed, it will merely show that the establishment parties have successfully out manourvered them psephologically (sp?). It could I suppose cause some tensions within the party, with people looking for internal scapegoats for the failiure, plus their ongoing financial problems, but it's just as likely (if Griffin plays it intelligently) that it will actually increase a bunker mentality among party activists, and serve to harden the core.
Buster Bloodvessell is an ANTI fascist !!! You couldn't make it up...
What next, a Specials song?
I didn't think they had enough members to put up candidates in all regions.
'can I use the phone box now?'
'fuck off we are using it for the SLP AGM'
Jean-Luc
Well-Known Member
yes, but is it the same list in all Regions? Most of those standing in London are from up North, from Lancs and Yorks. I see the Leader himself has a second residence in the Barbican.
Nigel
For A Degenerates' Workers State
Got the impression that the voting system was based on some bizzare form of proportional rep?
danny la rouge
Ninja swords for all disabled people
STV. You put 1, 2, 3 next to your preferences.
I believe Belboid was suggesting if you only use 2 preferences, then you won't have put your vote to best use.
Come on people, I'm an anarchist. You really should know more about voting than me.
articul8
Dishonest sociopath
STV. You put 1, 2, 3 next to your preferences.
I believe Belboid was suggesting if you only use 2 preferences, then you won't have put your vote to best use.
Come on people, I'm an anarchist. You really should know more about voting than me.
You don't know as much as you think you do!
Not STV at all - no preferences involved. It's a closed regional list form of PR with no threshold. Seats are allocated by d'Hondt method.
Lack of transfers means votes can split - eg. voting for a small party might mean wasted vote, without ability to transfer to keep BNP out.
Jean-Luc
Well-Known Member
Maybe he was thinking of the North of Ireland (or the South, for that matter) where the Single Transferable Vote system does apply. But then there's no BNP there either -- which ought to mean, to judge by some of the views expressedhere, that they are living a trouble-free existence over there . . .
I'd be more likely to vote Tory than Labour right now (
) but only until I thought about it for 5 minutes. I mean, if only the BNP and the NF were standing, would you vote for one to keep the other out?
N_igma
Epistemic nuisance
danny la rouge
Ninja swords for all disabled people
What a relief.
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