Uber drivers get minimum wage

Discussion in 'UK politics, current affairs and news' started by Artaxerxes, Oct 28, 2016.

  1. Artaxerxes

    Artaxerxes Well-Known Member

    A small victory and big fuck you to exploitation.

    edit: I'm aware they are yet to actually get full minimum wage yet, but they have the right to it and to not count as self employed. I'm sure Uber will bitch and moan and plead poverty as much as it can...
    muscovyduck, Tom A, NoXion and 18 others like this.
  2. Brainaddict

    Brainaddict chief propagandist (provisional)

    Good news this, and hopefully a useful case for all sorts of people - delivery drivers etc.
    NoXion and bemused like this.
  3. bi0boy

    bi0boy Power User

    They will appeal. Might end up in the Supreme Court.
    Sherman Tank likes this.
  4. Puddy_Tat

    Puddy_Tat meh

    would imagine that the 'analogue' minicab trade will be watching this with interest - most traditional minicab / private hire firms work on the basis of 'self employed' drivers either paying X percent of takings as commission or Y amount 'radio or circuit rent' per week to the company
  5. littlebabyjesus

    littlebabyjesus one of Maxwell's demons

    Bicycle/motorbike couriers too. Paid per delivery atm, with all liability on their own shoulders and paying a radio rent.
    Purdie and crossthebreeze like this.
  6. ska invita

    ska invita back on the other side

    the principle is spot on and paid holiday is great...but its a complex one as no cabbie, uber or not, works on a flat hourly rate. Its per fare. Thats the nature of the job. Having an underlying catch all wage per hour to stop it dropping below minimum wage is great in principle, but i wonder what complexities it will throw up.
    Wolveryeti likes this.
  7. A driver for a chauffeur company works flat rate though.

    Uber is a bit odd, black cabbies won't get holiday pay.

    But Deliveroo, Hermes etc., their staff ARE staff and should be treated as such. Saying they are self employed fucks with the rights of their staff and gives an unfair advantage over competitors who don't treat their staff like shite.
  8. littlebabyjesus

    littlebabyjesus one of Maxwell's demons

    Dunno about mincabs, but I know a bit about how bike couriers work - some companies do offer a minimum per week, others don't. Many couriers prefer working for the ones that don't as they can earn more that way. Possibly a bigger issue than minimum rates is the absence of any kind of sick pay or liability cover for your equipment. Car/bike breaks down/gets nicked, tough. Get injured or fall ill, tough. Companies don't give a shit as they can always find someone else.
  9. UnderAnOpenSky

    UnderAnOpenSky baseline neural therapy

    Of course if they had paid a decent rate in the first place then there would have been no need for this.
    muscovyduck, NoXion and Artaxerxes like this.
  10. Artaxerxes

    Artaxerxes Well-Known Member

    Shit loads of delivery companies; truckers, myhermes van types are the same I believe.
  11. ska invita

    ska invita back on the other side

    well thats the thing - the uber drivers ive talked to say they earned more doing uber than with usual private mini cab companies....though it looks like Uber are continuously increasing their fee from drivers
    This is interesting, with some driver voices in there
    How much can an Uber driver earn in London? - Quora
  12. bi0boy

    bi0boy Power User

    It certainly won't make Uber regret their massive investment in self-driving car technology.
    Tankus, 8ball and sealion like this.
  13. Puddy_Tat

    Puddy_Tat meh

    black cab (hackney carriage) drivers can genuinely work independently - they can choose where to ply for hire / what ranks to use - some opt in to radio / app based circuits as well. (although it's an odd business model - lots of mainly sole traders providing a very regulated product at a price fixed by the regulator)

    private hire vehicles legally have to be run through a licensed operator / office and the booking has to go through that office (the law hasn't really caught up with the digital age yet, but think it's been established that the contact goes via the base albeit digitally) - you can set up as a one man band with your own base, but it tends not to be worth it.
    Artaxerxes and Bahnhof Strasse like this.
  14. Reiabuzz

    Reiabuzz Banned Banned

    This is good news but I'm sure Uber till take an ever higher percentage from each ride to cover their losses..

    I use Uber almost every day mind you and occasionally ask the driver what they think of the whole system and not one has complained about it, yet.
  15. littlebabyjesus

    littlebabyjesus one of Maxwell's demons

    I don't know much about them, but don't they have a rating system? If so, you're not going to find many drivers moaning to their customers. I would not read anything at all into that.
  16. Reiabuzz

    Reiabuzz Banned Banned

    Yeh. There's a rating system, I always give them 5 stars - well except for the racist greek guy a couple of weeks ago who actually stopped the car to call a bus driver a monkey and asked if he learned to drive in the jungle :facepalm:

    I know its anecdotal but I've always had frank conversations with the guys driving. I dont get the impression they were bullshitting.
    muscovyduck and ska invita like this.
  17. ska invita

    ska invita back on the other side

    driverless tractors in a field i can imagine, but driverless cars in a city, i dont believe it will happen in a hundred years - topic for another thread though
    i reckon Uber are flushing that money down the drain
    littlebabyjesus likes this.
  18. Artaxerxes

    Artaxerxes Well-Known Member

    It will only happen if a mass change in car usage happens and the roads are literally privatised and cleared of manual traffic.

    Stranger things have happened and I wouldn't rule it out. Will take a lot of pain to get to that situation though.
    muscovyduck and 8ball like this.
  19. brogdale

    brogdale Coming to terms with late onset Anarchism

    Looks like the Uber twats didn't help their own cause...

  20. squirrelp

    squirrelp Banned Banned

    A good thing as things are but this is why I'd like to see a basic income. We wouldn't then need to force employers to be nice with legislation. The 'gig' economy would work and everybody would benefit.
  21. UnderAnOpenSky

    UnderAnOpenSky baseline neural therapy

    Fortunately for the drivers I suspect we are a long way from tech like this working in a city like London.
  22. littlebabyjesus

    littlebabyjesus one of Maxwell's demons

    Indeed. Turn the whole damn thing on its head. So, why exactly should I come and work for you then?
    NoXion likes this.
  23. Sasaferrato

    Sasaferrato Grateful for what I have.

    Perhaps different now, but when I lived in London (circa 26 years ago), mini-cabs were incredibly cheap, plentiful, and mostly illegal. Had a few journeys in ancient vehicles, and more than a few psychotic drivers. :) It was usually from my mate's house in Burridge Road, Woolwich, to just off the top of Shooter's Hill Road. Cost about 80p back then.
  24. littlebabyjesus

    littlebabyjesus one of Maxwell's demons

    Yeah, it's different now. The advent of the mobile phone has made illegal cabs far less attractive. My g/f was attacked in one once. Drunk women late at night are a lot safer now than they were then, I think.
  25. ska invita

    ska invita back on the other side

    In the Telegraph, whose headline was A Bad Day For The Gig Economy :)
    Solicitor Alex Bearman, partner at Russell-Cooke, said the ruling was bad news for the company and others operating in the so-called "gig economy".

    "The company now faces having to fund costly benefits for its drivers such as holiday pay, sick pay and pension contributions. It is possible that it will look to do so by increasing the percentage of each fare that it keeps as commission," said Mr Bearman.

    Sam Dumitriu, of the Adam Smith Institute, agreed that the decision could result in price rises for Uber passengers. "Consumers will see prices rise and a less stable, predictable service," he said. "And this doesn't just hit Uber. It threatens other new business models like Deliveroo and Amazon Prime Now.""

    :) :)

    The crap bit is if they try and fuck their drivers over the money....will be interesting to see what happens next
  26. Puddy_Tat

    Puddy_Tat meh

    at that time, private hire vehicles / drivers / operators in London were not regulated at all (despite the hackney carriage trade in London being regulated to a higher standard than pretty much anywhere else in England) - private hire licensing in London didn't come in until after the GLA was formed in 2000.

    obviously any cars being used before that were subject to the same driver licensing / MOT requirements as any other car on the road, and should have had insurance that covered private hire, but there was no licensing beyond that, and there was nothing to stop someone just out of the clink for sex /violent offences being a mini-cab driver the next day.

    councils are obliged to regulate / license hackney carriages, but have powers (i.e. they can but don't have to) with private hire vehicles. (in London the licensing has always been the public carriage office not local councils - this used to come under the police, now it's under TfL)

    i think the last areas (outside london) that didn't license private hire vehicles got caught up in the local government re-organisations of the 1990s
    maomao likes this.
  27. littlebabyjesus

    littlebabyjesus one of Maxwell's demons

    There used to be loads of entirely illegal cabs outside clubs when they were closing. I don't really go clubbing any more :D but I'm not sure these blokes (and they were all blokes) are in business any more. tbh it's mobile phones more than regulation that's put them out of business - there is now always a better option. They were flouting regulations anyway.
  28. Pickman's model

    Pickman's model Every man and every woman is a star

    illegal cabs flouting regulations? :eek: never!
    muscovyduck likes this.
  29. maomao

    maomao 四月她爹

    It wasn't the advent of the mobile phone it was regulation and licensing of minicab drivers 13 years ago. Before then if it was prebooked all you needed was the right insurance.
    Purdie and agricola like this.
  30. bi0boy

    bi0boy Power User

    I have fond memories of being off my face and after leaving the Fridge at 4am being driven across London Bridge at 70mph in a Vauxhall Omega with 270K miles on the clock, wonky suspension and no headlights.
    Pickman's model likes this.

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