U.S.-Iran tensions could trigger war - AP

[ViolentPanda]

But surely that's the point. If society is that way inclined in the first place, so much the easier for those in the military with all the weapons to abuse them.

To me there's a link between the cheapness afforded to life in general in a society and the resultant amount of friendly fire by that society's military.

But i can't really argue against what you've said re training of military recruits. But isn't their mind that way inclined in the first place?

No. It's quite possible to take an averagely bright rationalist with a bent for pacifism and turn him into a killing machine. The whole aim of the US military basic training system is to "break" people, to make them shed or subsume their personal moralities and codes to the ethos of the military, and in particular to the ethos of their unit.

I'm fortunate, I was trained under the British system, which while still brutal (imo), places far less emphasis on training "killing machines", and far more emphasis on producing soldiers capable of functioning in a full range of different situations.

 

[nino_savatte]

That's interesting! I'm a bit too tired to delve into this now, but how does that explain the huge amounts of friendly fire they indulge in compared to any other nation? On the face of it it would seem to support my intuition that it might not be so accidental, an intuition i'm not entirely sure is right i might add.

To add: do CIA recruits get the same level of indoctrination?

Well, yes they do 'enjoy' the same form of indoctrination. As for friendly fire incidents, that's simply down to poor communication in the field, gung ho attitudes; over-reliance on go pills and many other things besides. War is the reason for friendly fire incidents. Take that away and you eliminate friendly fire.

 

[ViolentPanda]

Well, yes they do 'enjoy' the same form of indoctrination. As for friendly fire incidents, that's simply down to poor communication in the field, gung ho attitudes; over-reliance on go pills and many other things besides. War is the reason for friendly fire incidents. Take that away and you eliminate friendly fire.

Only if you eliminate armies as well as war.

 

[TAE]

But things in Baghdad are so confused now, any random gang could have fake ID, get out of a charged situation by blagging it then get away.

Sure, particularly since geniune Iraqi government ID is probably available to whatever bunch of death-squad goons or other paramilitaries either the US or some faction within the Iraqi government chooses to employ.

I find that a bit hard to swallow. If they had official ID and were deemed to be genuine, you have to ask what is going on. And alternatively, if such ID is likely to be fake you have to ask why they were released.

 

[slaar]

I find that a bit hard to swallow. If they had official ID and were deemed to be genuine, you have to ask what is going on. And alternatively, if such ID is likely to be fake you have to ask why they were released.

Have you ever been in a war zone? Just about anything you can imagine is going on in Baghdad, and an awful lot more besides. Almost any hypothesis with these guys is plausible, but that's the point, nobody has a clue.

 

[nino_savatte]

Only if you eliminate armies as well as war.

Aye, the two need each other to survive. Armies that don't have any wars to fight have to be put to use in some way lest they become dangerous to the state.

 

[kage]

An Iranian response to all the recent US sabre rattling

Iran will strike against US interests worldwide if it is attacked, the country's supreme leader Ayatollah Ali Khamenei has warned.

Washington accuses Tehran of secretly trying to develop a nuclear weapon, and has not ruled out using military force.

The UN imposed limited sanctions on Iran in December for refusing to suspend uranium enrichment.

The Iranians insist their nuclear programme is purely civilian and aimed at meeting its energy needs.

Iran's state-run television on Thursday quoted Ayatollah Khamenei as saying: "The enemies know well that any aggression will lead to a reaction from all sides in the Iranian nation on the aggressors and their interests around the world."

source

 

[TAE]

Have you ever been in a war zone? Just about anything you can imagine is going on in Baghdad, and an awful lot more besides. Almost any hypothesis with these guys is plausible, but that's the point, nobody has a clue.

Yes, things are chaotic in Iraq, but that does not address my point that the given account makes no sense. The Iraqi officials holding the kidnappers seem to have thought that regular Iraqi security forces had been authorised to kidnap an Iranian official. That's a pretty bad state of affairs, no matter from what angle you look at it.

 

[slaar]

Yes, things are chaotic in Iraq, but that does not address my point that the given account makes no sense. The Iraqi officials holding the kidnappers seem to have thought that regular Iraqi security forces had been authorised to kidnap an Iranian official. That's a pretty bad state of affairs, no matter from what angle you look at it.

They could have said they were arresting him, not kidnapping.

 

[TAE]

And the iraqi officials just believed them, in the current climate, without checking where he had been taken? It all seems very unlikely to me. And if that is true, well ...

The more I think about it, the more I suspect that the news source was not very reliable. That's what I hope, anyway.