Training

[Iam]

I think (although I've not been anywhere near a CCNA for a fair while) that it probably is possible to pass it without ever having seen an actual Cisco. The CCNA discs I have, whilst out of date, contain an IOS simulator designed to replicate a lab and get you through the course.

Whether or not a CCNA gained like that would put you in a position to work as a network engineer on a commercial network or not is a different matter (and probably one of opinion)...

Still only really any use if you want to do networks, though, which so far there's no indication of... Bombscare, what about learning SQL or a similar database adminstration type thing, as you already have some experience of similar? I can't really give you much info on what to look for, sorry.

 

[djbombscare]

Ahhh is SQL very similar to writing macros in Access ?

 

[Radar]

I disagree. There are router sims out there which easily replicate configs for CCNA. But there ya go!

I've had a look at a few of the IOS simulators and IMO the affordable ones were crap. The ones I looked at didn't provide any debug command simulation, had syntax differences or ommissions compared to IOS, didn't provide command completion. Inline help was also lacking compared to the real thing, as was any form of log or monitor support.

If you only want the piece of paper then one mght be able to get a CCNA solely with a sim. If you actually want to learn something useful in the real world and get a job with it, then I think there's no substitute for experience with the actual kit.

I would like to think a paper CCNA who had never worked with actual cisco kit would be picked up easily at interview stage by a decent interviewer. I have dumped interviewees for junior roles in the past for that myself where they claimed to have a CCNA but for example had never popped the case on a router to upgrade flash or DRAM, recovered from a trashed or missing IOS image or performed password recovery. That's exactly the sort of scut work you have junior engineers for

Anyhow as Iam's gently reminded us, bombscare doesn't seem that worried about networks (his loss ) As it appears moot to him we should really stop pulling his thread in strange directions.

So, how about that there Oracle then

 

[souljacker]

I've had a look at a few of the IOS simulators and IMO the affordable ones were crap. The ones I looked at didn't provide any debug command simulation, had syntax differences or ommissions compared to IOS, didn't provide command completion. Inline help was also lacking compared to the real thing, as was any form of log or monitor support.

They aren't going to match the real thing, no, but the Boson ones are pretty close and will certainly attempt to give debugging info. Inline help is always covered in the exam so any router sim that doesnt offer it is utter shite, yes. You could always use some online resources. r1r2 used to let you login to their terminal server and play with their routers.

If you only want the piece of paper then one mght be able to get a CCNA solely with a sim. If you actually want to learn something useful in the real world and get a job with it, then I think there's no substitute for experience with the actual kit.

Its the old argument, can't get the job without experience, can't get the experience without the job. You can show willing by getting a cert though.

I would like to think a paper CCNA who had never worked with actual cisco kit would be picked up easily at interview stage by a decent interviewer. I have dumped interviewees for junior roles in the past for that myself where they claimed to have a CCNA but for example had never popped the case on a router to upgrade flash or DRAM, recovered from a trashed or missing IOS image or performed password recovery. That's exactly the sort of scut work you have junior engineers for

You would certainly pick it up yes, but if a candidate is stupid enough to claim to be an expert just because he's done CCNA then he deserves to be picked up on this at interview. I've never changed RAM on a router. My CCNA got me a foot in the door at a Networking Company and I worked up from there. You're not tested on changing ram so I wouldn't expect a CCNA to kno w how to do it.

Anyway, we are derailing this thread like CRAZY so sorry bombscare!!

 

[djbombscare]

hey no worries. . .I'm just trying to understand it

 

[Sunray]

I read the other day that people with MCSD and MCSE got something like 25% less pay than people with direct experience.

Always the nugget, need experience but nobody is gonna give it to you.