TopCat
Putin fanboy
Son of screw...
Top Screw joins Socialist Party
- Thread starter In Bloom
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Son of screw...
Blagsta
Minimum cage, maximum cage
I'm not sure anyone buys what things "need to not be". It's a bit weak compared to a more specific positive assertion. Besides, whether or not they wear a uniform seems less than relevant.
Hue and cry wasn't it? At least as draconian and ineffective I think.
FabricLiveBaby!
Live Baby Fabric!
I find it just a >teeny< bit a bit elitist. Are there any other proffessions that are banned from joining socialist parties?
I just think that the left could do with as many supporters as possible rather than bitching and moaning about the calibre of people that join their ranks. We can't all be Univeristy Proffessors and Middle Management or Dustmen.
The fact is these people, no matter what you think of their profession, all have leftist ideals otherwise they wouldn't join the party!
I think it's silly, when the left is in such a weak posistion in UK politics, to be so picky on something so trivial as a job.
This bloke may be a screw, but he may not be a complete arsehole, he mght be, but then I'm sure there're plenty of aresholes in the Socialist Party too. Who knows, maybe he's even inspiring to some of the prisoners?
Are estate agents banned too (they sell property after all)?
And bankers are they to be banned?
Police and Screws clearly are.
What about someone that works in the civil service?
Can I have a list of potentially undesirable professions, to work out if I should bother voting for these goons or not?
As someone with leftist ideals myself this casual fucking elitism really fucks me off. It actaully makes me not want to vote for them.
I just think that the left could do with as many supporters as possible rather than bitching and moaning about the calibre of people that join their ranks. We can't all be Univeristy Proffessors and Middle Management or Dustmen.
The fact is these people, no matter what you think of their profession, all have leftist ideals otherwise they wouldn't join the party!
I think it's silly, when the left is in such a weak posistion in UK politics, to be so picky on something so trivial as a job.
This bloke may be a screw, but he may not be a complete arsehole, he mght be, but then I'm sure there're plenty of aresholes in the Socialist Party too. Who knows, maybe he's even inspiring to some of the prisoners?
Are estate agents banned too (they sell property after all)?
And bankers are they to be banned?
Police and Screws clearly are.
What about someone that works in the civil service?
Can I have a list of potentially undesirable professions, to work out if I should bother voting for these goons or not?
As someone with leftist ideals myself this casual fucking elitism really fucks me off. It actaully makes me not want to vote for them.
Blagsta
Minimum cage, maximum cage
Have you actually been following the discussion?
FabricLiveBaby!
Live Baby Fabric!
ERM, yes. The OP seemed to be a bitch and a moan about the profession (sorry, "social role" of this dude.)
Was I wrong?
Blagsta
Minimum cage, maximum cage
Spion
I hear ya
elitist?
Spion
I hear ya
I thought the OPs objection was to this Caton guy's 'social role', no?yes
Blagsta
Minimum cage, maximum cage
yes, but it's not about "bitching and moaning" is it?
Good post.
Spion
I hear ya
snobbery doesn't enter into it
FabricLiveBaby!
Live Baby Fabric!
Blagsta
Minimum cage, maximum cage
what do you think the objection is about?
What's your point? Actually, what Blagsta says. What's the problem?
FabricLiveBaby!
Live Baby Fabric!
It's a weird form of social snobbery.
It's effectivley saying THIS person is good enough to join, but THIS person isn't look at his "social role" *sneer sneer*.
It's not good enough quite frankly.
People should be judged by the person they are and who they want to be, and how they treat others.. rather than their job.
Oh please. People should be judged by the undetectable contents of their minds? For the love of Jesus. I'm sure it's OK to judge people by their job if you fancy. I think the case against screws was to with oppwession or whatever. I mean, it doesn’t really stand up to logical analysis on either side. It’s a question of emotional response, how personalities relate to authority figures etc. Like Dennisr said, it's not as if we're in a western with goodies and baddies and that.
Spion
I hear ya
Whether those who agree with this sentiment sneer, or grimace or screw up their nose when they say what they do about prison officers, I've no idea. The argument is that prison officers are front line employees of the state who administer beatings and discipline to a largely working class set of inmates who wouldn't be in prison were it not for the iniquities of the class system.
Now, I haven't decided my stance on all this but to call it snobbery is just using the wrong word. Would not employing convicted paedophiles in infant schools also be snobbery too?
Spion
I hear ya
Err, being a prison officer is a job that involves treating people in a particular way, ie locking them up and telling them what to do
FabricLiveBaby!
Live Baby Fabric!
No. Becuase peadopiles are conviceted members of socity that are a danger to another innocent section of society. It's a bit of a shit analogy tbh.
As far as I know, employed screws are neither convicted nor a danger to innocent members of society.
As for the first part of that post. Is so full of generalisations I don't know where to start with it.
FabricLiveBaby!
Live Baby Fabric!
Yes but these people have been convicted by the laws that govern our society at the moment. And the people that do the job have strict guidelines on how to behave. So as it stands at the moment SOMEONE has to do the job. And that somone may not necessarily be an asshat.
Perhaps when (never) prisons/screws are abolished then maybe you'd have a case for being annoyed with what these people do - becuase it would amount to kidnap/false imporisonment, but at the moment it's completley legal and actually quite a popular policy with the masses. You can be a kind person, and be a prison officer who cares about the welfare of the inmates and be a socialist, it's not like theu are mutually exclusive.
Spion
I hear ya
It's not a shit analogy if you understand the view being expressed by the anti-screws here - which is that they see being a prison officer as being incompatible with being a revolutionary socialist
Spion
I hear ya
Damn! it's not even my argument
I'm just trying to explain why some people think that being a screw is incompatible with being in a revolutionary socialist organisation; like a putting a fox to look after chickens or a kiddy fiddler as a school assistant
FabricLiveBaby!
Live Baby Fabric!
Damn! it's not even my argument
I'm just trying to explain why some people think that being a screw is incompatible with being in a revolutionary socialist organisation; like a putting a fox to look after chickens or a kiddy fiddler as a school assistant
Fair enough. I misunderstood. I still think it's a bollocks argument though, even if it's not your's.
Spion
I hear ya
Reading the interview, this Caton fellow is a left reformist at best, which speaks volumes about the SP
Udo Erasmus
Well-Known Member
And where was Caton and co when prisoners at HMP Ashwell staged a justifiable uprising against lack of rights and conditions earlier this year? The uprising should be seen as part of the wave of occupations and sit-ins that the working class have staged this year.
Blagsta
Minimum cage, maximum cage
You really haven't understood what the discussion is about.
emanymton
A cat politely sat on the flaming gardener.
How? All I hear for them is how crap their pay and conditions are. Screw are integral to state aims they only way they could be a threat to it would be to close down their own industry.
The39thStep
Urban critical thinker
either its victory to the labour movement or you are taking a line close to the Telegraph .
Are we really living in an era where unions run anything?
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