Tim Westwood; Crap / Not Crap?

[electrogirl]

Why does everyone assume that a white man using street language is a fake?
The man loves hiphop and has been immersed in hiphop culture for decades, so of course he uses the language of hip hop - if you don't like him talking like that, maybe you just don't like anyone talking like that.

DOn't be ridiculous. I think he's a twat because he denys everything that he really is and actively lies about his upbringing. Why is he so ashamed of being middle class? The way he speaks is part of this. Are you trying to tell me he picked up this way fo speaking by accident? I think it's more likely he adopted it on purpose because he doesn't think it's cool to be a vicar's son. I'd have a lot more respect for him if he just admitted he was a priveleged, middle class boy with an enthusiasm for hip hop. I find it hard to believe that if you met him and he spoke about "dropping the bomb" and keeping it "dirty dirty", you wouldn't think he was a complete nob.

 

[Bomber]

you wouldn't think he was a complete nob.

Wot she said !!

 

[Yossarian]

Not just a vicar's son - a bishops son!

 

[rennie]

He's very crap!!! super annoying n just rubbish. Yo yo yo fake!

 

[killer b]

does westwood deny his roots?

 

[Orang Utan]

DOn't be ridiculous. I think he's a twat because he denys everything that he really is and actively lies about his upbringing. Why is he so ashamed of being middle class? The way he speaks is part of this. Are you trying to tell me he picked up this way fo speaking by accident? I think it's more likely he adopted it on purpose because he doesn't think it's cool to be a vicar's son. I'd have a lot more respect for him if he just admitted he was a priveleged, middle class boy with an enthusiasm for hip hop. I find it hard to believe that if you met him and he spoke about "dropping the bomb" and keeping it "dirty dirty", you wouldn't think he was a complete nob.

I think that's all nonsense - merely inverse snobbery on your part.
Is he ashamed of being middle-class?
Does he lie about it?
I'm prepared to be proved wrong on this, but this is what everyone assumes without bothering to find out if it's true - I read one interview with him where he's asked about his origins and he doesn't lie about them.

 

[Orang Utan]

I've lived in London for 13 years and have been known to drop 'cheers' and 'nice one' in conversation. I supposed that makes me a pussy ass faker who's denying his roots.

 

[Dougal]

there is a fucking tim westwood poll every fucking 3 months saying how shit he is

yeah he's had the most succesful hip hop show in europe for about 20 odd years, and just about everyone who has made it in hip hop in that time has been on his show, plus he gets exclusives which even put most US hip hop djs to shame

but yeah, he's a right cock, since he isn't black, he's done well for himself and he talks funny

Lots of people of all shades have contrived accents. Tim is a berk though.

 

[killer b]

i don't mind him - i don't listen to his show much, but i've always enjoyed it when i have done.

why the hatred? he's hardly chris moyles...

 

[electrogirl]

I think that's all nonsense - merely inverse snobbery on your part.
Is he ashamed of being middle-class?
Does he lie about it?
I'm prepared to be proved wrong on this, but this is what everyone assumes without bothering to find out if it's true - I read one interview with him where he's asked about his origins and he doesn't lie about them.

He's shady about it. He completely denied going to a certain grammar school on Radio 1. Yes he is ashamed of being middle class. And no, dropping "cheers" and "nice one" into a conversation is not the same as adopting the complete style and accent of another culture. And since when has thinking someone is a complete idiot been snobbery? I find him embarrassing. Do you really think that purposely adopting the accent of another culture isn't a little bit sad?

It's like when people go to Birmingham for a few days and come back speaking Brummy. "Oooh have I picked up the accent?!" No, no you haven't. You're putting it on. Berk.

 

[Funki mamma]

Aww c'mon give the guy a break, at least the man's stuck with it.

I remember back in the day, when he used to play this dodgy club in

Paddington 82/83ish. My introduction to some of the baddest, booty shakin'

B lines i'd ever heard. He introduced enuff people e.g Whodini, Africa Bambata

et all. Wonder if there's anyone on here who remembers The Peoples club.

It used to get constantly raided by the police. One time Old Timmy kept

right on playing, the lights went up, Plod everywhere, we couldnt stop

dancing. He'd have guest DJs every week some from US and UK. A lot went

on to big tings, u get me. Got me talking like a wigga now and I'm over 40.

 

[Chorlton]

westwood is not crap - the man loves what he does and is clearly knowledgable about the music he does and that has to be a good thing.

I heard a radio1 dj a couple of months back who didn't know who frank zappa was - that is who the real enemy is - fucken no-nowts that have somehow got themselves in the position of latter-day dave lee travis's - there should be no place on radio 1 for people who do not know and understand music IMO

Tim westwood, for whatever his failings knows and loves a particular brand of music, a brand of music that is possibly under-represented on british radio - that has to be a good thing.

 

[Orang Utan]

if you find it embarrassing, it's your problem not his.
I thiok he's a bit of a cock but he's genuine - I don't think he has purposely adopted an accent, I think he speaks the way I does because his genuine love of hiphop has led him to be immersed in a culture that expresses itself in the language he uses.

 

[killer b]

I heard a radio1 dj a couple of months back who didn't know who frank zappa was - that is who the real enemy is - fucken no-nowts that have somehow got themselves in the position of latter-day dave lee travis's - there should be no place on radio 1 for people who do not know and understand music IMO.

damn straight.

 

[ddraig]

and remember kIdZ, u aiN't BiG tiL Ya gOt hAtErZ!

 

[electrogirl]

I bet he bloody came in his pants when he got shot in that "drive-by" too.

 

[killer b]

really? i imagine he was too busy writhing in agony on the floor.

 

[kins]

am i being stupid, or does the pole not makes sense? Westwood is a hilarious. I think he's a dick though.

 

[ddraig]

am i being stupid, or does the pole not makes sense? Westwood is a hilarious. I think he's a dick though.

yeah but i don't think the OP is polish though

 

[max_freakout]

I voted for 'not-crap', anyone who thinks he is crap, are you taking into consideration the length of time he hasbeen on the scene? He may be crap now, but he is one of the first people in the UK to play hip hop, back in the early 80s, and he promoted some of the all-time greatest concerts in the 80s and 90s, and he has been the best-paid member of the UK hip hop community for a very long time now, he must be doing SOMETHING right?

Max n Dave, the other great Uk old school hip hop pioneers, did a pretty shit radio show compared to Westwood's, and where are they now? On unemployment benefits i imagine....

 

[max_freakout]

I bet he bloody came in his pants when he got shot in that "drive-by" too.

That is a really stupid thing to say

 

[Boogie Boy]

He's shady about it. He completely denied going to a certain grammar school on Radio 1. Yes he is ashamed of being middle class. And no, dropping "cheers" and "nice one" into a conversation is not the same as adopting the complete style and accent of another culture. And since when has thinking someone is a complete idiot been snobbery? I find him embarrassing. Do you really think that purposely adopting the accent of another culture isn't a little bit sad?

It's like when people go to Birmingham for a few days and come back speaking Brummy. "Oooh have I picked up the accent?!" No, no you haven't. You're putting it on. Berk.

This raises all sorts of questions, but I'm interested in exactly what "style and accent of another culture" you are talking about here? You seem to be assuming that there is such a thing as Hip Hop culture, if there is such a thing then can you explain what it is made up of, and what particular kind of language needs to be spoken to be considered a part of this culture?

And you also seem to be implying that Hip Hop culture is exclusively black, and that in order to truly be a part of that culture (as opposed to being an outsider or voyeur) you should be black? That in some way, by not being born in to something, you can never truly belong?

You could argue that by not being born in the US - and let us say (for example) New York or Los Angeles - you are not part of the 'culture' - and that even by being black you are still excluded and not quite 'keeping it real'.

Have you not considered the fact that many of the stylistic affectations that pass for 'keeping it real' are used by black Hip Hop artists (and those involved more generally) too? That their vocal 'keeping it real' is just as much an affectation as Tim's?

BB

 

[Orang Utan]

^^^
wot he said

 

[electrogirl]

This raises all sorts of questions, but I'm interested in exactly what "style and accent of another culture" you are talking about here? You seem to be assuming that there is such a thing as Hip Hop culture, if there is such a thing then can you explain what it is made up of, and what particular kind of language needs to be spoken to be considered a part of this culture?

And you also seem to be implying that Hip Hop culture is exclusively black, and that in order to truly be a part of that culture (as opposed to being an outsider or voyeur) you should be black? That in some way, by not being born in to something, you can never truly belong?

You could argue that by not being born in the US - and let us say (for example) New York or Los Angeles - you are not part of the 'culture' - and that even by being black you are still excluded and not quite 'keeping it real'.

Have you not considered the fact that many of the stylistic affectations that pass for 'keeping it real' are used by black Hip Hop artists (and those involved more generally) too? That their vocal 'keeping it real' is just as much an affectation as Tim's?

BB

I never ever said Hip Hop culture is exclusively black, in fact I actually think Westwood promotes this particular idea. Why then would he speak in an affected African-American dialect when this is blatantly not his natural way of talking? He seems to think that coming from a priveleged background and liking hiphop cannot possible coincide. I don't think anything of the kind, I just believe he is a buffoon for pretending to be something he is not.

If I were to do a classical music programme on radio 4, I wouldn't start speaking in a plummy accent etc., and you'd think I was a twit if I did.

(Oh and the thing about the drive-by, lighten up, it was a joke and you know what I meant. I bet he takes some pleasure in regailing that story to show how ghetto he really is)

 

[Orang Utan]

I never ever said Hip Hop culture is exclusively black, in fact I actually think Westwood promotes this particular idea. Why then would he speak in an affected African-American dialect when this is blatantly not his natural way of talking? He seems to think that coming from a priveleged background and liking hiphop cannot possible coincide. I don't think anything of the kind, I just believe he is a buffoon for pretending to be something he is not.

But he's not pretending - he's just speaking the way he speaks!

 

[ATOMIC SUPLEX]

When he writes in the papers (I don't think he does it any more) it is some really laugh out loud shit. It's like an amazing Chris Morris Viz style parody.

But it isn't is it.

 

[electrogirl]

But he's not pretending - he's just speaking the way he speaks!

THat's where we disagree!

 

[Orang Utan]

THat's where we disagree!

I know loads of white people who talk like Tim - if he's a faker, then they must be too.

 

[killer b]

it doesn't sound like african-american dialect to me anyway - more like a nasal london accent with some hip-hop slang thrown in...

 

[electrogirl]

I know loads of white people who talk like Tim - if he's a faker, then they must be too.

It's not a colour thing, it's a class thing.