The MLB playoffs thread.

[nonamenopackdrill]

Two 40 somethings on tonight. Looking forward to it.

 

[nonamenopackdrill]

Both started well too, though both given up 2 hits in 2 (1.0 in the Unit's case so far with Pudge up).

 

[nonamenopackdrill]

My fucking mouth.

 

[nonamenopackdrill]

I hate baseball.

 

[mhendo]

Well, that was quite a game. Rogers was virtually unhittable tonight, throwing a wicked curve ball and some awesome change-ups. The incredible Yankee hitters really had no answer to him. My prediction of a Subway Series is looking a little rocky, much to my delight.

I never would have picked Oakland to sweep the Twins, but they've done it in style and now await the winner of the Detroit-Yankees series. Minnesota must be so deflated, after having such a great second half and winning the division on the last day of the season. I really felt for them, but that's baseball.

Mets up 2-0 and looking good over the Dodgers; you'd have to be crazy to bet against New York in that series now. Similarly, the St. Louis Alberts--excuse me, Cardinals--have taken the first two against San Diego, and look likely to move on the the LCS.

Whatever Pujols is being paid, it's still not enough. He was almost single-handedly responsible for them getting into the post-season in the first place, especially during their dramatic late season slide when he won a couple of games for them. And now he's doing almost all of their post-season hitting as well. He went 2-4 with 2 RBI (out of a team total of 5 runs) in the first Divisional Series game, and 3-4 with 1 RBI (out of 2) in the second.

As a team, the Cards really don't deserve to be where they are right now. I can't see them beating the Mets.

 

[nonamenopackdrill]

Rogers was hittable, just not in the clutch. I think we had a baserunner in 8 of the 9 innings. A very dodgy call in the 2nd didn't help, and I thought the strike zone was inconsistent.

At the same time, we probably would have lost without those things, but those things still hurt.

 

[mhendo]

Rogers was hittable, just not in the clutch. I think we had a baserunner in 8 of the 9 innings.

True, but only 5 of those 8 baserunners got on with hits. And i think that if you can spread 5 hits over 8 innings against the Yankee lineup, with never more than 1 hit per inning, and with the opposition going 0-13 with men on base, that probably qualifies as "virtually unhittable." Any other batting lineup in the Major Leagues, and Rogers probably would have been close to a no-hitter.

A very dodgy call in the 2nd didn't help...

True, and it meant a 3-run second instead of a 1-run second. Still, the way the Yankees were hitting last night, that one run would have been enough. And Detroit also managed a 2-run sixth and a solo homer in the seventh. I think the Yankees' hitting problems were exemplified in the fifth innings, when Matsui got a lead-off double, and they couldn't even move him over to third, let alone get him home.

Also, the umpiring errors didn't just favor Detroit. I can't remember the inning or the hitter, but at one stage a Detroit batter ripped one down the left field line. It hit right on the line and should have been a double, but the umpires called it a foul ball.

...and I thought the strike zone was inconsistent.

A little bit, yes, but i don't think it especially favored the Yankees. For example, in the eighth, when Rogers walked Jeter, i thought that the fifth pitch of the at-bat was a strike over the bottom inside corner. Rogers thought so too, and so did the commentators.

At the same time, we probably would have lost without those things, but those things still hurt.

Bolding mine.

Probably? Come on, mate, i know that it's good to support your team and all, but the Yankees were comprehensively beaten last night. There's no "probably" about it.

Now you have to rely on the somewhat inconsistent arm of Jaret Wright to keep you in the hunt. Bonderman hasn't looked so great recently either, so the series might hinge on which of these pitchers can produce a big game at the right time.

There's no question in my mind that the Yankees are capable of winning the next two in a row, but Detroit is looking a lot better than many people (including me) expected.

 

[Iam]

Rogers was hittable, just not in the clutch.

Just not as hittable as Johnson.

The team unity I felt that the Yankees had appears to be peeling at the seams a little...

I would have said that Wright was their most beatable pitcher prior to this series, I suspect. Any prediction I make now will, of course, be wrong... so I'm going to say that I think the Yanks will tie it up tonight...

 

[Iam]

Also...

RIP Buck O'Neill.

Nowadays, the word legend is used often to refer to sportspeople. O'Neill certainly was, imo.

"Bigger than the game itself", says one commentator. Wow.

 

[Iam]

The Padres finally find some offense in St. Louis, scoring 3 off Jeff Supan. They had opportunities for more, too, on a day that Chris Young shutdown Pujols, Edmonds and Rolen plus the rest of the Cards lineup... but they couldn't take them. Taguchi homered for STL in the bottom of the 8th to make it 3-1, but Trevor Hoffman was unflappable in the close for the save. You have to figure that the Cards will get some offense in game 4, so unless the Padres can get their hitters into some better at bats with risp, it favors the red birds.

Magglio Ordonez has just gone long off Jared Wright in the 2nd for the Tigers. Yanks are going to need some offense of their own in this one, I feel.

 

[Iam]

A walk to Pudge, followed by another blast from Craig Monroe, 3 runs for the Tigers in the bottom of the 2nd.

The Tigers have come to win tonight. Now it's time to find out how much the best power hitting lineup ever assembled wants to win themselves...

A fascinating game in progress in Detroit.

 

[Iam]

Errors (scored wrongly, fielding error on Sheffield rather than on A Rod for the throw), balls, base-running and hit upon hit for the tigers. 2 more two out hits bring another run and the swift demise of Jaret Wright (2.2 IP, 5H, 1BB, 4R 3ER).

Bonderman has seen 9 batters and sat them all down.

4-0 Tigers, bottom 3 and it looks like the Yankees are coming apart.

 

[nonamenopackdrill]

It's over. We've just got our first hit but we're 7 down and it's the last hit I'll see from us until next season as I'm off to bed.

 

[Iam]

You should have known something was up when a Cubs fan told you he thought they were gonna win it...



Bonderman has been superb, one hit in 6 sparkling innings. Detroit have just scored again and it's 8-0.

Don't worry, the WS may well still go to New York...

 

[Iam]

Yankees score 3 at the end, but it was definitely a whimper and not a shout.

So, another year goes by and again we see that money alone cannot make a championship winning team.

I'd expect Joe Torre to bear the brunt of this. I don't see how he can't. I can also see a lot of salary going... to be replaced with a lot more. So, Johnson, Mussina, Sheffield, Rodriguez... who knows?

 

[Iam]

It's late, but there's another great game on.

The Mets are ahead 7-5, but the Dodgers are refusing to go quietly at Chavez Ravine... 26... 27 hits now and it's 8-5 Mets.

I may well miss the end of this.

 

[mhendo]

All over. Mets sweep the Dodgers.

Just the Cardinals/Padres series to be decided now. Hopefully San Diego can pull off another win tomorrow to force a Game 5.

 

[nonamenopackdrill]

Yankees score 3 at the end, but it was definitely a whimper and not a shout.

So, another year goes by and again we see that money alone cannot make a championship winning team.

I'd expect Joe Torre to bear the brunt of this. I don't see how he can't. I can also see a lot of salary going... to be replaced with a lot more. So, Johnson, Mussina, Sheffield, Rodriguez... who knows?

I can't see us keeping the unit, maybe not A Rod and probably not Sheffield. Matsui won't be going anywhere though. It's the end of Williams for sure, and maybe Moose.

Depends on whether Torre stays. 7 years is a long wait for the Yanks.

 

[nonamenopackdrill]

They're going to bring in pitching though, no doubt about it.

I'll watch the rest, but like any spoiled Yankees fan, I hate losing and I lose my enthusiasm when we're out.

 

[Iam]

They're going to bring in pitching though, no doubt about it.

They'll try.

But like everyone else, they know that true aces are at a premium right now... and the Yankees don't have any prospects to trade. No one is going to trade a Zito or a Santana for Sheffield and Johnson.

 

[mhendo]

I can't see us keeping the unit, maybe not A Rod and probably not Sheffield. Matsui won't be going anywhere though. It's the end of Williams for sure, and maybe Moose.

Depends on whether Torre stays. 7 years is a long wait for the Yanks.

They're going to bring in pitching though, no doubt about it.

Yeah, pitching is what they really need. It's a cliche that good pitching beats good hitting, especially in the postseason, but it certainly came true in this series. Johnson should go; he can still throw some nasty stuff, but by the fifth inning he starts to tire and just looks vulnerable. And despite his decent reguar season i think that Mussina is on the downslide as well. He couldn't hold a lead in game 2, and he hasn't done great in the postseason since joining the Yankees.

Sheffield was awful this series, but i'm not sure if it was a sign of overall decline, or if he just wasn't ready to come back from his injury. He certainly wasn't ready to be on the field, and should have been DHing instead. Same with Matsui who, while he looked OK, still only batted .250 in the series and wasn't his usual tenacious self at the plate.

I think the Yankees, and Joe Torre in particular, actually suffered from an excess of talent towards the end of the season. Big name players like Sheffield and Matsui are getting paid so much money that the Yankees obviously feel like they have to get tham back into the line-up as soon as possible. But the Yankees played some of their best baseball this year with those players out, and with a bunch of lesser known guys filling in and adding energy and spirit to the team.

Torre himself effectively acknowledged this in Game 4, when he brought Melky Cabrera back into the lineup, but by then it was too late. It really did seem in this series that the Yankees were a bunch of great players, but they weren't a team. There was none of the energy and camaraderie that you expect from a cohesive, committed club. It's sort of interesting that the only two hitters to really step up in the series were Jeter and Posada, two guys left over from the great team of the late '90s. Both of them hit .500 in the series, in a lineup that hit .246 overall, and .196 over the last three games.

As for A-Rod, just about every writer in the New York Times today is calling for his ouster. The problem, of course, is that his contract includes the right to veto any transfer. It will be interesting to see if he really wants to stick around, or if he's decided that the boos of the Yankee fans and the increasingly obvious disappointment of his teammates in his performance isn't worth living with anymore. There are only a few teams in baseball who have the money to pick up his contract, and i think he's already burned his bridges with Boston, so he won't be going to the Red Sox. The Angels are apparently interested, and could definitely afford him.

Despite all that, though, Detroit played amazing ball over the last few games. I think they would have beaten just about any team in baseball on the last two nights, with their combination of amazing pitching and solid hitting. The Oakland-Detroit series should be very interesting.

 

[mhendo]

They'll try.

But like everyone else, they know that true aces are at a premium right now... and the Yankees don't have any prospects to trade. No one is going to trade a Zito or a Santana for Sheffield and Johnson.

Good point.

And look at some of the best young pitchers around the league. In most cases, they're playing for the team that groomed them, not for a team that bought them after they started to win lots of games.

Detroit's pitcher in last night's game, Jeremy Bonderman, went to the Tigers at age 19, and they weren't afraid to throw him out there and let him lose some games. He went 6-19 a few seasons ago; last night he took a perfect game into the 6th inning against one of the best hitting lineups ever assembled.

The Yankees should cut back their payroll and start to develop their own talent, even if it means conceding the AL East for a couple of seasons. They certainly know how to develop players; look at Jeter. And they should trade for some good prospects, rather than just for big names. Abreu and Damon both did fine for the Yankees this season, but their presence still didn't help the team win the World Series.

 

[districtline]

i've stayed away from the baseball discussion for a few years but let this be my return: come on you mets!

 

[colbhoy]

I have to say, well done to the Detriot Tigers! Always nice to see the Yanks humbled (and humbled they were).

A fantastic victory, considering they finished the season so poorly. I fancy the A's to beat them though and go on to win the WS - however, the one thing that you can predict about play-off baseball is that you can't predict play-off baseball!

 

[nonamenopackdrill]

Yeah, pitching is what they really need. It's a cliche that good pitching beats good hitting, especially in the postseason, but it certainly came true in this series. Johnson should go; he can still throw some nasty stuff, but by the fifth inning he starts to tire and just looks vulnerable. And despite his decent reguar season i think that Mussina is on the downslide as well. He couldn't hold a lead in game 2, and he hasn't done great in the postseason since joining the Yankees.

Sheffield was awful this series, but i'm not sure if it was a sign of overall decline, or if he just wasn't ready to come back from his injury. He certainly wasn't ready to be on the field, and should have been DHing instead. Same with Matsui who, while he looked OK, still only batted .250 in the series and wasn't his usual tenacious self at the plate.

I think the Yankees, and Joe Torre in particular, actually suffered from an excess of talent towards the end of the season. Big name players like Sheffield and Matsui are getting paid so much money that the Yankees obviously feel like they have to get tham back into the line-up as soon as possible. But the Yankees played some of their best baseball this year with those players out, and with a bunch of lesser known guys filling in and adding energy and spirit to the team.

Torre himself effectively acknowledged this in Game 4, when he brought Melky Cabrera back into the lineup, but by then it was too late. It really did seem in this series that the Yankees were a bunch of great players, but they weren't a team. There was none of the energy and camaraderie that you expect from a cohesive, committed club. It's sort of interesting that the only two hitters to really step up in the series were Jeter and Posada, two guys left over from the great team of the late '90s. Both of them hit .500 in the series, in a lineup that hit .246 overall, and .196 over the last three games.

As for A-Rod, just about every writer in the New York Times today is calling for his ouster. The problem, of course, is that his contract includes the right to veto any transfer. It will be interesting to see if he really wants to stick around, or if he's decided that the boos of the Yankee fans and the increasingly obvious disappointment of his teammates in his performance isn't worth living with anymore. There are only a few teams in baseball who have the money to pick up his contract, and i think he's already burned his bridges with Boston, so he won't be going to the Red Sox. The Angels are apparently interested, and could definitely afford him.

Despite all that, though, Detroit played amazing ball over the last few games. I think they would have beaten just about any team in baseball on the last two nights, with their combination of amazing pitching and solid hitting. The Oakland-Detroit series should be very interesting.

There's too many generalisations in this post from one (albeit important) series. The Yankees have played as a team, and the collection of individuals really gelled towards the second half.

Moose has been great for the Yanks, in particular keeping us in touch with Bostin in the first half of this season, but also for years. He wasn't our Game 1 starter year on year for nothing.

Sheffield - well he could have worked or not, playing 1st base and brought back in - in hindsight maybe we shouldn't have, but I'd have brought him back. Matsui - well I just don't agree. It's one bad series...

I haven't bothered to read any of the press yet; but I'm sure some must be calling for Torre's head. It took five days to forget we finished the regular season with the best record in baseball.

 

[nonamenopackdrill]

They'll try.

But like everyone else, they know that true aces are at a premium right now... and the Yankees don't have any prospects to trade. No one is going to trade a Zito or a Santana for Sheffield and Johnson.

It's not true aces actually. Moose is valuable to someone and so is the unit - and we don't need people with a sub 3 era, but youngsters with character.

We also need some decent middle relief to support Proctor. Myers and Farnsworth aren't enough (Farnsworth will get another year though, I'm sure).

I don't know the detail of the contract situations though.

I do know that both our really good prospects that the fans are excited about are hitters as well... and a 16 (iirc) year old pitcher who's 5 years off the big leagues.

 

[E.J.]

Many congratulations to the Detroit Tigers on a great and fully deserved series win against the Yankees. Fair play to them, they've proved me wrong (based on my intial predicion) also well done to the As for sweeping the Twins, tottally suprised on that, although i felt that the As will be a team that could do some damage in the playoff. It should be a very close and cracking AL pennant series.

And speaking of Joe Torre's future as the Yankees skipper, he could well be fired by "mad king" George Steinbrenner. Lou Pinella the ex Mariners and Cinci Reds coach will be his replacement!

Link

The redbirds didn't get the job done last night at home against the Padres, thanks to some good pitching from Friar's picther Chris Young and some errors in defence. So it's game 4 and i feel it's a must win for the home team, with a possible decider on game 5. Nervous, with regards to the picthing line up Chris Carpenter vs ex-redbird Woody Williams (who picthed superb against St Louis in the regular season) but i'll be watching it tonight!

Districtline - Congrats to the Metropolitans (Mets) for their sweep against the Dodgers. The Mets offence, pitching and the Dodger's lack of patience when facing the pitchers was the factors in this series. St Louis or San Diego will have their work cut to try and maintain the Mets dangerously potent batting line up and the way that this team can score runs at any given time.

You're certainly right Colbhoy you certainly can't predict play-off baseball and for that reason it's so good to watch!

 

[Iam]

It's all gone quiet over here...

So, where are we?

I don't want to jinx anyone here, but it looks like the Tigers might be going to the big show...

Fair play to them if they can make it. They're making Oakland look pretty ordinary here in game 3.

2-0 Tigers v 2

 

[nonamenopackdrill]

And if they face the Mets with their problems I can see a Tigers sweep.

I'm also coming to the conclusion that Torre staying on is the end for ARod as he'll waive his no trade and the Angels will have him. I think we're going to promote two minor leaguers I keep hearing about (one is a 3rd baseman) to semi-regular action and there's talk of Johnny Damon learning 1st base in Spring Training (seems far fetched to me, still got Phillips and Giambi).

 

[mhendo]

The Tigers are looking almost unbeatable in the playoffs, especially their pitching. I always thought that whichever AL team made it through to the World Series would probably win, and Detroit's performance over the past week has only strengthened that feeling.

The Cardinals really needed that win last night. If they lose with Carpenter on the mound, they really are in dire straits. They finally got some offence out of someone besides Albert Pujols.

That's interesting about the possibility of moving Damon to first. I think it's quite a good move. While Damon is a great hitter and a good fielder of the ball, and would be an asset to any ballclub, i'm still not sure that centerfield is his ideal position. I always wondered why the Yankees replaced one centerfielder with a weak throwing arm (Bernie Williams) with another guy who also can't throw very well (Damon).