'The left can no longer afford to bury the migration debate'

[scott_forester]

If you come here with a bogus claim, we'll have you back on the plane before you can say "economic migrant".

I think the problem is that it's well know if you dump all your papers as you enter the country they can't send you home, because they don't know where it is. I'm sure someone will correct me but haven't those numbers been dropping quite readily. It appears to be economic migration form within the EU which are swelling our shores and given that it 's one of a few factors keeping inflation down I just don't see anyone is really going to tackle it.

 

[Kid_Eternity]

The Bajans can fuck off too, seing as they're pretty much all immigrants of only a few generations back as well. I somehow doubt that it's the Amerindians complaining - the natives are already well less than 10% of the population.

No particular disrespect meant to those particular islanders, but it just goes to show the paucity of the drawbridge-pulling up argument. Others from nearby are trying, unsurprisingly, to get in Barbados as it's one of the most affluent economies in the region. I cant really see a problem with that if I'm honest.

Er you have quite a low understanding of the island. Over there the problems of strain on services are very real, it may be the 'wealthiest' island in the Caribbean but that really isn't saying much given the state the other islands are in (most Bajans I spoke to view themselves as being just out of the third world bracket).

It's a joke because a land that small with that little wealth experiences immigration in a way that is far and away different to us over here bleating about it...

 

[dennisr]

Absolutely. Why is there a conspiracy of silence from the politicians and media. And U75 is just as bad, why haven't we had threads on immigration before?

Good to see the Guardian - the voice of the people - exposing this travesty

 

[mk12]

There is a lot of stuff in the media and in political circles about immigration, but not a proper debate about it.

Does the "no platform" and in some cases "arrest the BNP" slogans of the far left give off the impression that they are not interested in open debate about race/immigration?

 

[bluestreak]

Absolutely. Why is there a conspiracy of silence from the politicians and media. And U75 is just as bad, why haven't we had threads on immigration before?

I think it's because the editor is in the pay of the Left. Whenever someone starts a thread on immigration, he deletes it before anyone can debate it. Shocking behaviour it is.

 

[dennisr]

There is a lot of stuff in the media and in political circles about immigration, but not a proper debate about it.

Does the "no platform" and in some cases "arrest the BNP" slogans of the far left give off the impression that they are not interested in open debate about race/immigration?

You mean the SWP don't you?

mk12 - why do you always asked dumb arse and obvious leading questions? what is the point? - don't I remember you at one point as one of the more sheep like, party line swallowing swappies why do the rest of us have to endure you shadow boxing with your guilty past? its boring and it is no more a 'debate' (as you rightly point out...) than the one on immigration in the media

 

[mk12]

Mainly, yeah. But I am pretty sure some of the smaller far-left groups feel the same way (of course not the SP though dennis )

 

[dennisr]

Mainly, yeah. But I am pretty sure some of the smaller far-left groups feel the same way (of course not the SP though dennis )

And i'm pig sick of that "its OK it dont mean the SP , dennisr" qualifier

 

[mk12]

I'll slag them off one day, then you can smash my argument to pieces...

 

[dennisr]

I'll slag them off one day, then you can smash my argument to pieces...

cool, i'd like to add my line is my line - the party i belong to is simply sensible enough to agree with me

 

[durruti02]

Absolutely. Why is there a conspiracy of silence from the politicians and media. And U75 is just as bad, why haven't we had threads on immigration before?

you think you are being smart CR .. but you are not ..

yes you are right there is tons of near racist hypocritical rhetoric from politicians of ALL shades .. bar the left .. who find it a distatstefull subject .. talk about the socialist paper (not) smelling of vodka

 

[Ned Pointsman]

The 'right' can no longer afford to pretend that 'migration' can be taken in atomisation with regards to the free market.

 

[durruti02]

cool, i'd like to add my line is my line - the party i belong to is simply sensible enough to agree with me

dennis .. when is The Socialist going to lead on/front page this cheap labour migration?

as you know i think what the SP says is on this is pretty sensible .. but i do not see them bringing it to the fore .. after this weeks right wing front pages they need to .. no?

p.s. on the website there appears to be nowt in this weeks paper

 

[FridgeMagnet]

There is a lot of stuff in the media and in political circles about immigration, but not a proper debate about it.

You'll be telling me next that calls for a "public debate" on a topic actually mean "public agreement with me" or "public distractionary talking-shop which makes it look like I care".

 

[dennisr]

dennis .. when is The Socialist going to lead on/front page this cheap labour migration?

as you know i think what the SP says is on this is pretty sensible .. but i do not see them bringing it to the fore .. after this weeks right wing front pages they need to .. no?

p.s. on the website there appears to be nowt in this weeks paper

Well, there's been this wee dispute you may have heard of that the SP, maybe naively, consider quite important, posties, so thats back in the SPs headline this week. Last week "Public health not Private Profit for the front page - we consider it 'an issue'

Headline this week is "Unity with Postal Workers"
Backpage: "Private hands off our NHS"

I'm sure there will probably be an article next week - not front page though we leave that to the Daily Mail

ps i don't think the Socialist would be daft enough to consider itself 'in competition' or as much of a 'influence' as/with the mainstream press - its a small publication with a limited audience and aims at that audience.

Something from last year on the issue - far from 'avoiding debate' - http://www.socialistparty.org.uk/2006/443/index.html?id=pp5.htm

 

[taffboy gwyrdd]

You'll be telling me next that calls for a "public debate" on a topic actually mean "public agreement with me" or "public distractionary talking-shop which makes it look like I care".

er... that is what "public debate" actually means though isnt it?

2 of the most useless words in politics.

 

[durruti02]

Well, there's been this wee dispute you may have heard of that the SP, maybe naively, consider quite important, posties, so thats back in the SPs headline this week. Last week "Public health not Private Profit for the front page - we consider it 'an issue'

Headline this week is "Unity with Postal Workers"
Backpage: "Private hands off our NHS"

I'm sure there will probably be an article next week - not front page though we leave that to the Daily Mail

ps i don't think the Socialist would be daft enough to consider itself 'in competition' or as much of a 'influence' as/with the mainstream press - its a small publication with a limited audience and aims at that audience.

Something from last year on the issue - far from 'avoiding debate' - http://www.socialistparty.org.uk/2006/443/index.html?id=pp5.htm

yes last years article .. and it was me what posted it here ( and praised it) last year not you!

and why do you not see yourself in competition wit teh mail and all ?? maybe if you DID have that ( bigger) attitude of leading with issues like this maybe you would be???

and yes ok the post office dispute this week ( surely that was last week??) .. so immigration next week? i doubt it ..

p.s. is there any article at all in this weeks paper?

mate we need to THINK BIG .. to be braver .. to have more front .. people are looking for something ..

 

[dennisr]

mate we need to THINK BIG .. to be braver .. to have more front .. people are looking for something ..

man, I don't know where we would be without your positive vibes

*raises eyes to the potential new dawn rising*

 

[durruti02]

man, I don't know where we would be without your positive vibes

*raises eyes to the potential new dawn rising*

thank you er .. for the sarcasm .. at least i try though mate!

 

[belboid]

When? I was under the impression from my Macedonian friend that most Eastern Europeans come here because they speak english. I just don't believe when France throws it's doors open they'll all leave.

naah, that's just bollocks. german is more popular than english

 

[dennisr]

at least i'm trying though mate!

just kidding

(ps arn't most of us)

 

[dennisr]

p.s. is there any article at all in this weeks paper?

Er.. hang on... lets have a flick through...
urrr .... brown's expedient election climb down .. posties: determination to contuinue the battle ... ummm ... anti war right to protest ... any spare cash (drop in disposable income), retired and insolvant ... child poverty growing ...super rich, super 'donations' ... burmese students join london march ... widscale 1957, the lessons ... phewwww (bored now...) ... beat back the profiteers (privatisation of education) ... defend public services (fire service cuts) ...... postal workers defy royal mail attacks (+ a page of picket line round-ups) ... marching in support of the Burslem 12 ... 1917, 90th Anniversary (fancy theory page) ... the art of politics (art review) ... hummmpph ... Jupiters Dance (film review) ... scramble for profit (world bank policies) ... iraq - brown;s token gesture ... dafur ... national shop stewards meetings ... civil servants march against cut privatisation ... UCU pay ... save out post office (about saving post offices surprisingly....) ... bolton care workerrs fight on ... mmmmmm ...national nhs demo ....

nope, we clearly have* got our fingers on the immigration pulse this week matey - your point is clearly proven (i think? )

*ooops- edit "havent" not have

 

[durruti02]

Er.. hang on... lets have a flick through...
urrr .... brown's expedient election climb down .. posties: determination to contuinue the battle ... ummm ... anti war right to protest ... any spare cash (drop in disposable income), retired and insolvant ... child poverty growing ...supper rich, uper 'donators ... burmese students join london march ... widscale 1957, the lessons ... phewwww (bored now...) ... beat back the profiteers (privatisation of education) ... defend public services (fire service cuts) ...... postal workers defy royal mail attacks (+ a page of picket line round-ups) ... marching in support of the Burslem 12 ... 1917, 90th Anniversary (fancy theory page) ... the art of politics (art review) ... hummmpph ... Jupiters Dance (film review) ... scramble for profit (world bank policies) ... iraq - brown;s token gesture ... dafur ... national shop stewards meetings ... civil servants march against cut privatisation ... UCU pay ... save out post office (about saving post offices surprisingly....) ... bolton care workerrs fight on ... mmmmmm ...national nhs demo ....

nope, we clearly have got our fingers on the immigration pulse this week matey - your point is clearly proven (i think? )

yes all very worthy ! and what is always in the SP! BUT immigration IS the news this week .. by default in a workers paper it should be front page .. OR at least back or at the very least somewhere inside! if you do not cover it the Scum will

it is NOT enough imho to keep to the same old formula .. anyway good night!

 

[dennisr]

by default in a workers paper it should be front page ..

indeed - i feel cleansed and rightly chastised...


haver you come back for the pub or something mate?!

 

[durruti02]

indeed - i feel cleansed and rightly chastised...
mate?!

no worse than that .. college! been up since 6.30 as always .. work then college .. fucks yer brain!

 

[cockneyrebel]

mk12 - why do you always asked dumb arse and obvious leading questions? what is the point? - don't I remember you at one point as one of the more sheep like, party line swallowing swappies why do the rest of us have to endure you shadow boxing with your guilty past? its boring and it is no more a 'debate' (as you rightly point out...) than the one on immigration in the media

I’ve thought this many times but didn’t wanna get personal

Does the "no platform" and in some cases "arrest the BNP" slogans of the far left give off the impression that they are not interested in open debate about race/immigration?

As the far left is a total irrelevance to 99.9% of people why do you care?

yes you are right there is tons of near racist hypocritical rhetoric from politicians of ALL shades .. bar the left .. who find it a distatstefull subject .. talk about the socialist paper (not) smelling of vodka

Again why is there this obsession with seeing working class politics and general political issues through the prism of the far left when the far left is so irrelevant? You criticise the SP for not "thinking big" but seem to address all your points to the far left. If you think the far left is a waste of space, then why not, as the TV show said, do something better instead.

 

[dennisr]

I’ve thought this many times but didn’t wanna get personal

Nowt personal - its good for the young uns to face their fears

 

[cockneyrebel]

Sorry I was only messing about, mk12 asked me to stop being personal the other day.....

 

[8ball]

Sparklehorse's second album is fucking phenomenal.

 

[dennisr]

Sorry I was only messing about, mk12 asked me to stop being personal the other day.....

*forlorn* *goes off to sulk*