The cost of activism
- Thread starter KeyboardJockey
- Start date
tobyjug said:
What is a 'modern protester'?
What makes me one?
What makes me a protester?
What makes a protester in the first place?
Why is a modern protester so different from any other protester?
What's wrong with being a protester anyway?
Have you the brainpower to address these questions?
Am I bashing my metaphorical head against an equally metaphorical brick wall for no reason? probably.
tobyjug said:
Are they?
With every cause? No matter what it might be?
Are you prepared to die because you believe in ridding Cornwall of drug dealers? Would it then be okay if one of said dealers came along and kicked your back door in...?
Had I access to some webspace, I'd make up a 'tobyjug philosophy' pic to complement 'another tobyjug fact.'
But why bother?
Tell me, if everyone who believed in a cause was willing to die for it, where would we be? Would that give everyone who didn't believe in it licence to go round killing everyone else? Maybe Darwin should have been slaughtered by a baying mob at his front gates, chanting 'evolutionists fuck off!?'
How about all the activists, lawyers and journalists who've cleared people of wrongful convictions (eg the Guildford Four)? Should they all have died for their cause?
Christ tobes, even by your standards this is poor stuff. You're losing your edge old boy!
Roadkill said:
Absolutely, I have faced down a drugs delivery because I just will not put up with it around me. Neither the delivery man or the dealer were prepared to have ago in the middle of a crowd of people.
There have been several attempts to shut me up, including a very serious attempt to fit me up with an arson charge, the theft of a large quantity of cigarettes and also accuse me of being a paedophile. (The latter caused them so much shit and hassle they leave me well alone now)
.KeyboardJockey
Clowns to the Left of me
tobyjug said:
Toby, I very very rarely tell you are singing out of your ringpiece but I'm afraid you hitting the Top C note out of it tonight.
KeyboardJockey
Clowns to the Left of me
tobyjug said:
Right I'll give you the fucking arguement. It used to be that unless you were a serving member of HM Armed Forces you could get out there and make your point in front of the legislature at what ever time people so chose and as long as there wasn't a breach of the peace a la Gordon Riots etc we were allowed to do so.
Now we have the situation where we can be jailed as 'terrorists', our property sequestered using laws designed for dealing with top level drug smugglers, given ASBOs that were designed for arsehole thugs and called harrasers for speaking out under laws designed to protect women from wanky ex partners. And all this just for gathering in front of the legislature that WE elect and who are our representatives allegedly.
What will it take YOU to say enough is enough.
I like you Toby and I find a mixture of common sense and amusement in what you say in the nicest possible way but on this subject you are totally wrong.
Its been over 250-300 years since people were criticised for 'hanging around with Quakers' and this is what is happening to me because of the Quakers pacifism message (that I don't agree with totally I might add).
KeyboardJockey
Clowns to the Left of me
tobyjug said:
One or two people reading out the names of the dead in Iraq - you don't get much more peaceful than that.
KeyboardJockey
Clowns to the Left of me
tobyjug said:
The next lot just may well be.
tobyjug said:
I'm not going to name names on a bulletin board, but a considerable number of Trident Ploughshares members have spent time in jail, either on remand or for non violent offences. Obstruction of the highway, criminal damage, aggravated trespass, non payment of fines, breach of bail conditions, etc.
So people HAVE in fact been jailed for peaceful protest, and the signs are that many more will be in the future.
Here are the statistics: TP Pledgers have collectively had 2240 arrests made, 520 trials and 2197 days in prison (excluding time spent in police cells). And ALL (without exception) for explicitly NON-violent offences.
Pilgrim said:
I am afraid you definition of peaceful protest differs somewhat from mine. Given the sort of direct action Trident Plougshares have been involved in they are lucky in some instances the security on some establishments did not obey standing orders and shoot them.
KeyboardJockey
Clowns to the Left of me
tobyjug said:
Why do you have this strange fantasy about agents of the statekilling people for speaking out?
http://news.bbc.co.uk/1/hi/england/london/4514004.stm
Ironically enough though, the bloke the Serious Organised Crime and Police Act was partly aimed at, Brian Haw, who's spent the last couple of years camped in parliament square with a stack of anti-war placards, is still there because the lawlords told the government they couldn't apply the law retrospectively!
Ironically enough though, the bloke the Serious Organised Crime and Police Act was partly aimed at, Brian Haw, who's spent the last couple of years camped in parliament square with a stack of anti-war placards, is still there because the lawlords told the government they couldn't apply the law retrospectively!
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