The children of Windrush

Discussion in 'UK politics, current affairs and news' started by Tropi, Apr 16, 2018.

  1. marty21

    marty21 One on one? You're crazy.

    As David Lammy said, the Tory party allowed themselves to get manipulated by #kipper cunts and this is the shameful result of this.
  2. ska invita

    ska invita back on the other side

    The Tory party are kipper cunts
    And David Lammy is a Tory
  3. killer b

    killer b No Hateration, No Holeration. in this Dancery

    This thread seems to have become exactly what I cautioned against at the start - a discussion on how better to administrate a cruel racist policy so the 'good' immigrants aren't caught up in it. Good work.
  4. marty21

    marty21 One on one? You're crazy.

    I'm not a big fan of Lammy but I wouldn't call him a Tory.
  5. Magnus McGinty

    Magnus McGinty Wh♂️

    The insaneness of unmitigated free movement between European countries which instigated Brexit etc shouldn’t have been somehow muddled with the status of those who plugged labour shortages decades ago and have been here for years. That the govt didn’t have the foresight to see this coming from their policies further illustrates their ineptness to govern.
    muscovyduck, Slo-mo and Edie like this.
  6. agricola

    agricola a genuine importer of owls

    I don't think this is about May being obsessed with immigration to be honest - the way in which this policy was implemented (against advice, reason, the lessons of experience and/or sense) is very similar to the way in which almost all the significant policies in the Home Office of her day were implemented.
    A380 likes this.
  7. Beats & Pieces

    Beats & Pieces 24601 / 9430 Banned

    Forget 'Rivers Of Blood'.


    'Rivers of Love'.
  8. Rutita1

    Rutita1 Scum with no integrity, apparently.

    Eh? Calm down..certainly not red through and through but not a Tory. :D
  9. steeplejack

    steeplejack Reluctant Hardliner

    hence my use of the word "obsession"...pressing ahead with a policy against advice, experience and reason just...because.

    I can't understand it. Nor can I understand how people bring themselves to vote for such an inhuman, cruel, vicious bigot.
    friendofdorothy and Slo-mo like this.
  10. steeplejack

    steeplejack Reluctant Hardliner

  11. captainmission

    captainmission Well-Known Member

    It's curious seeing labour get on their high horse about this considering they introduced the legislation that started this process. The immigration, asylum and nationality act 2006 that bought in employer immigration checks. Various changes to the benefit legislation with ever increasing demands placed on migrants. Charging oversea nationals for NHS treatment that again required immigration checks. These are the policies that caused problems many of the cases that have gained media attention. They pre-date May environment of hostility by almost a decade.

    About a decade ago I was working at an advice centre in an area with quite a large older African and Caribbean population and had a whole spate people loosing jobs, refused benefits and left destitute. And if they could scrape together the fee for an application maybe they'd get a decision in 6 - 18 months. About six months ago I was representing in a social security tribunal for a who'd come from Ghana 50 years ago guy who'd been refused ESA 13 months ago for being a person subject to immigration control. Thankfully his some what colourful life of being in and out of prison and on probahtion made for quite strong evidence his was in the uk for that period. But again it was labour introduced legislation that he fell foul of.

    Trying to understand developments in immigration policy by looking at whether the bad party is in power is a mistake. Whether it be dog-whistle conservatives and frothing at the mouth open racists or woke neoliberals and champions of multicultralism, both result in increasing restrictions on migrants. This is the same UK as it is across Europe and the USA. Thinking this is restricted to May being under the sway of 'kippers and racist Brexit voters is nonsense.

    It's also extremely worrying in terms of what it means for current government policy for EEA citizens post Brexit. The current plan is continue using EU legislation to determine settled status for EEA residents, albeit with a simplified application process. EEA citizens and 'generation Windrush' are in a similar sort of boat regarding their settled status. In both cases there settled status relies on their circumstances and history in the UK rather than a grant of leave or visa given by the government. Just like 'generation Windrush' there's going to be a lot of people caught out by the evidence requirement- especially since EEA freedom of movement is about free movement of labour and services- not people.
    baldrick, muscovyduck, Mordi and 9 others like this.
  12. Gramsci

    Gramsci Well-Known Member

    As you and I know we have been discussing this issue of Windrush immigration status on Brixton forum before this thread started. Understandably as Brixton is home to Windrush generation.

    I noticed this thread and had a look.

    Back on Brixton forum when I brought up parallels between the way recent East Europeans and Wiindrush generation have been treated you came back saying that "we" are talking just about Windrush.

    So what happened? You didn't think I would look at this thread?

    As I posted up on Brixton a while back a Afro Carribbean friend of mine in Brixton ( whose father was Windrush) said to me the way people are going on about East Europeans is the same way that people used to go about his Father's generation who came here after WW2.

    There are parallels between the Windrush generation and East Europeans who came here.

    After WW2 Commonwealth citizens had free movement. Due to racist/ anti immigrant backlash in 1971 this was curtailed. Existing Windrush being given leave to remain. Which is inferior to what they had before.

    The same could happen to existing EU citizens here.

    UKIP, as my Brixton Afro Carribbean friend said are racist, pushed the immigration issue to promote Brexit.

    I notice you aren't putting up post like this on Brixton forum.

    May "hostile environment" wasn't forced on Tories.

    This issue came up at work today. The people I work with aren't heavy politicos. They like me in London work with "immigrants" and have partners ( including me) from EU and beyond.

    What you are saying is bollox.
    Last edited: Apr 16, 2018
  13. Rutita1

    Rutita1 Scum with no integrity, apparently.

    That involvement could/does only work though if the Tory party were/are complicit and they are, they are the base of those positions also... Extreme nationalist groups like the NF, BNP, EDL and UKIP give the Tories something to hide behind whilst being the ones institutionalising the policies and ideas they claim are just too OPENLY right wing for them.
  14. Slo-mo

    Slo-mo Banned Banned

    Yes, you could argue that Labour, certainly in the second half of their time in office, was more hostile to immigrants than the Tory governments of Thatcher and Major. There was of course a lot discrimination against black and asian people in the 80s and 90s,but not necessarily government hostility. I don't remember immigration coming up much at all in the elections of 87 , 92, 97 or 2001. I remember a distinct gear change in 2005 with Michael Howard and perhaps Labour responded to that. The concern at that point was asylum seekers, EU migration was still in its infancy.

    But then there was another gear shift in 2010 of course, and we were well on course for the present mess. It's too late now, but David Cameron's first move in office should have been to ask the EU for an immigration pause, and to kick up a stink until he got it. Ironically enough if the nettle had been grasped in 2010 ish we'd probably be close to being able to take the pause button off by now.
  15. Gramsci

    Gramsci Well-Known Member

    How about coming back on Brixton forum and voicing your views on EU immigration.

    You right wing cunt.
  16. captainmission

    captainmission Well-Known Member

    Apart from it wasn't just the second half- the late 1990's and early 2000's saw massive extension of the detention system, the removal of support for destitute asylum seekers and massive practical barriers that stopped people claiming asylum in the first place. Asylum claims peaked in 2003 and sharply declined after that, largely because of the harshness of the policies new labour introduced. Public opinion regarding asylum seekers was trailing government policy, not forcing it. Certainly the tory governemnt of the 80's and 90's was more expressive in their open racism than the urbane liberals of new labour, yet still had a less restrictive immigration policy.
    Kaka Tim and Slo-mo like this.
  17. GarveyLives

    GarveyLives Well-Known Member

  18. Puddy_Tat

    Puddy_Tat lumpen proletaricat

    seems like a chunk of law was quietly changed in 2014

    from guardian article here
    muscovyduck and Slo-mo like this.
  19. Sprocket.

    Sprocket. Baroudeur...

    This appears to have been compiled by someone whose only knowledge or experiences of the Caribbean come from listening to Dreadlock Holiday by 10CC, they may as well have put ‘concentrate on trucking right’
  20. bimble

    bimble noisy but small

    Two times i've been on flights from uk to Jamaica where deportees were on board. These were commercial virgin flights, and each person being deported was 'accompanied' by big blokes in uniform (i remember they were in uniform but now can't remember what) and they were physically restrained into their seats. I presumed they were people being deported after doing a certain amount of prison time or something but actually I have no clue, maybe its the same treatment if you can't produce the necessary paperwork about what infant school you went to.
  21. Slo-mo

    Slo-mo Banned Banned

    Charmed I'm sure :)

    I didn't put this on the Brixton forum because that wasn't the place for yet another debate about Brexit!

    But I'm perfectly open with people about which way I voted (out) and why ( to reduce immigration)

    If that makes me a ' right wing cunt' so be it, there are a lot of us out there in that case.
  22. killer b

    killer b No Hateration, No Holeration. in this Dancery

    Plumdaff likes this.
  23. Athos

    Athos Well-Known Member

    Policies of a government in which David Lammy was a minister. His outrage rings a bit hollow, now.
    muscovyduck, Celyn, Wilf and 2 others like this.
  24. Athos

    Athos Well-Known Member

    As much as I despise the Tories, I don't think Labour are much better on this. Both have consistently courted the racist vote (whilst simultaneously not wanting to disturb to any significant extent the benefits to capital of a trans-national labour market), in their self-interested grasping.
    Last edited: Apr 17, 2018
    Magnus McGinty likes this.
  25. SpookyFrank

    SpookyFrank Ridin' a Stutz Bearcat, Jim

    David Lammy's very good at suddenly being furious about stuff he didn't give a shit about last week, before it was in all the papers.
  26. Athos

    Athos Well-Known Member

    He's vile.
  27. SpookyFrank

    SpookyFrank Ridin' a Stutz Bearcat, Jim

    So a bunch of people who weren't able to vote in the referendum are the ones who 'instigated' brexit?

    I'd love to see your working out for that one mate.

    I'd also love to see how you worked out that EU migrants have not filled skills shortages, have not been here for years etc.
  28. killer b

    killer b No Hateration, No Holeration. in this Dancery

    It's undeniable that european free movement was one of the wedge issues that made Brexit possible, whatever you feel about free movement per se.
    Slo-mo and Magnus McGinty like this.
  29. Magnus McGinty

    Magnus McGinty Wh♂️

    I was talking about immigration policy. Presumably then you think the two aren’t linked?
  30. Magnus McGinty

    Magnus McGinty Wh♂️

    Or what Killer B said.

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