That Nice Mr Ignatieff To Lead Canadian Liberals
- Thread starter Fullyplumped
- Start date
Y_I_Otter
Dangerous Terroirist
The coalition was a Rae/Layton construct with Duceppe jumping aboard on contrarian grounds. Iggy was always lukewarm about it. That's his out. I'd be amazed if the Conservatives don't come back with a budget even he can accept-- and he'll surely whip the Liberal caucus into voting for it. As our southern neighbours take a few tentative steps to the left, our left-of-center parties (mine included) seem to be lurching ever further right.
On ethnic grounds? They wouldn't dare.
His familial pedigree, like his academic credentials, is unassailable.
Oh, come on... if that were the case, Justin Trudeau would still be teaching highscholl drama classes.
By concede you mean Rae? I suspect wiser heads in the party took him aside and reminded him of what a fuckup he was when he led Ontario (as a social democrat
) during the last recession, and the baggage the he still carries with him in the eyes of the federal electorate from that time. Making Bob Rae the Liberal leader, in these times, would be tantamount to handing Harper a majority.Fullyplumped
in a personal capacity
If I summarise what people are saying, Iggy is a politician who is prepared to admit that ideas he formerly held were wrong and change them, but he's a patrician from an elite family, and it was a good move for Rae to concede the leadership to him because he'd be prepared to lead a minority government rather than be in a coalition with separatists.
I might vote for someone called Iggy. but I wonder if he'd win a contested election, even against the Tories.
I might vote for someone called Iggy. but I wonder if he'd win a contested election, even against the Tories.
Y_I_Otter
Dangerous Terroirist
That's a bit oversimplified, but nothing in it is actually wrong.
Everyone's wondering about that. I think he's wondering it too, hence my comments about what he's likely to do in the event of a Conservative budget being brought to Parliament that's not taken directly from the neo-con hymnbook.
Johnny Canuck3
Well-Known Member
By concede you mean Rae? I suspect wiser heads in the party took him aside and reminded him of what a fuckup he was when he led Ontario (as a social democrat
I don't agree. Whatever baggage Rae has in Ontario doesn't translate outside of that province.
Johnny Canuck3
Well-Known Member
The only part that's wrong, is that he will lead the liberal party, which is in opposition at the moment, and will not be forming a minority govt. It's the conservatives who have the minority govt.
Fullyplumped
in a personal capacity
But presumably the Liberals could win a vote of no confidence in the Tory government in the House of Commons, and could ask the Governor General to let them have a go. That's how it would work here in the UK.
Johnny Canuck3
Well-Known Member
The libs wouldn't win a confidence vote: the tories would lose a confidence vote. Not likely that the libs alone would get GG assent to govern. They'd need the coalition. The coalition would actually be a majority govt.
Y_I_Otter
Dangerous Terroirist
Forget the coalition. That's sooo last week.
There's no way Iggy would force a no-confidence vote on January 26 unless the Conservative budget was loaded with goodies for the middle class and the wealthy with nothing for the little guy. Even then he'd be on shaky ground. Don't expect an election call before he's well and truly ratrified at the convention in May.
There's no way Iggy would force a no-confidence vote on January 26 unless the Conservative budget was loaded with goodies for the middle class and the wealthy with nothing for the little guy. Even then he'd be on shaky ground. Don't expect an election call before he's well and truly ratrified at the convention in May.
Y_I_Otter
Dangerous Terroirist
Liberal MPs and Senators as well as 800 Liberal back-roomers and heavyweights from across the nation seem to think otherwise.
Don't get me wrong-- I like Bob. But I don't think even he thinks he's electable at this point.
Johnny Canuck3
Well-Known Member
Liberal MPs and Senators as well as 800 Liberal back-roomers and heavyweights from across the nation seem to think otherwise.
Don't get me wrong-- I like Bob. But I don't think even he thinks he's electable at this point.
Like I said, those same senators and heavyweights selected Stephane Dion.
I was talking about the real, actual Canadian electorate outside Toron...I mean, Ontario.
Y_I_Otter
Dangerous Terroirist
Look: I voted for Trudeau, and I'm from the West.
However did you manage to get on the voter's list in Mount Royal?
Johnny Canuck3
Well-Known Member
However did you manage to get on the voter's list in Mount Royal?
It was a reference to a different decade. I guess it went over your head, youngster.
spring-peeper
Well-Known Member
.
spring-peeper
Well-Known Member
.
Johnny Canuck3
Well-Known Member
Youngster? I'll be 59 in less than a month ffs. Not much goes over my head; I'm 6'3".
I remember the decade you're talking about vividly. The people who 'voted for' Trudeau were the people in his riding, no?
Grrrrr...
spring-peeper
Well-Known Member
But there's no guarantee that a new liberal leader would support the coalition. Ignatieff says 'maybe'.
Look: I voted for Trudeau, and I'm from the West.
We hold the same views and outlooks. This point is beyond dispute. The only difference is that I'm East and you are West.
I was just curious what the views from out there was.
As for the "maybe", I'll take a maybe over an outright refusal to listen.
purves grundy
ambient clown remix
Ignatieff's 'Human Rights as Politics and Idolatry' gives a nice window onto the way he'd approach this job. Superficially coming across all reasonable and very supportive of human rights, overall it shows him eager to clip the wings of human rights and keep the rights discourse firmly under western control. Doesn't surprise me to hear him apparently cheering on Bush like in that clip (although a minute of snipped segments from a whole presentation can't prove much).
spring-peeper
Well-Known Member
nino_savatte
No pasaran!
That gives me some hope and confidence, then.
Are you a Eustonite, FP?
Johnny Canuck3
Well-Known Member
No, a new center-left party would form, just as a new party was formed and called 'The Conservatives', after the traditional party was decimated in the wake of the Mulroney Era.
Fullyplumped
in a personal capacity
nino_savatte
No pasaran!
Just wondered...
Fullyplumped
in a personal capacity
But I might help them out if they were busy.
nino_savatte
No pasaran!
Given your views, I can see that happening. Though I suspect you and others who share the Eustonite position can't see or understand the obvious contradictions of your position.
Fullyplumped
in a personal capacity
I really just said it because I think that the commitment that Canada is giving to the NATO effort in Afghanistan is outstanding, and I hope that whoever is in charge in future will continue with it.
littlebabyjesus
one of Maxwell's demons
You don't think invading Afghanistan was a huge mistake, then? You think it is a 'winnable' war?
Fullyplumped
in a personal capacity
No, I don't think it was a big mistake. As to whether it's a "winnable war" - no it's not in the sense of "defeating" the mediaeval islamists trying to recover control of the country, but that isn't the point of NATO's invovement there and it's not what NATO is trying to do.
I hope Canada continues its commitment to the NATO effort whoever ends up in charge there.
Similar threads
