so ( i am assuming ) Callinicos bottles then leaves it up to locals to give reasons? gets worse
SWP refuse to debate Tatchell .. LOL
- Thread starter durruti02
- Start date
Obviously we couldn't just have a barney with the SWP and leave Respect Renewal out of it....
Matt
**********************
Pandora column - The Independent - 14 March 2008
A scorching row has broken out between George Galloway and Peter
Tatchell over their respective special interests – the Middle East and
gay rights – with regards to the gay Iranian asylum seeker Mehdi
Kazemi.
Tatchell accuses Galloway of "mouthing the propaganda of the
homophobic dictatorship in Tehran", after the Respect MP claimed on
Matthew Wright's Channel 5 talk show that Kazemi's boyfriend was
executed in Iran for "committing sex crimes against young men".
Galloway said the uproar over Kazemi's possible deportation from the
UK "is being used as part of the propaganda against Iran". He added,
controversially: "All the papers seem to imply you get executed in
Iran for being gay. That's not true."
Galloway says that he has campaigned against the death penalty in any
circumstances. He tells Pandora: "But it is important to avoid that
propaganda. There are those who are trying to give the khaki war
machine a veneer of pink." He added: "I have an unblemished record of
support for lesbian and gay equality. I have condemned homophobia in
Iran and oppose the deportation."
Tatchell does not fear the litigious Gorgeous: "George was asked to
provide evidence for his claim that Mehdi Kazemi's boyfriend was
hanged for sex crimes against young men. He has failed to do so.
Moreover he has failed to apologise or withdraw the allegation.
"This shows him to be a politician without integrity or principles. He
should either provide the evidence or shut up."
Matt
**********************
Pandora column - The Independent - 14 March 2008
A scorching row has broken out between George Galloway and Peter
Tatchell over their respective special interests – the Middle East and
gay rights – with regards to the gay Iranian asylum seeker Mehdi
Kazemi.
Tatchell accuses Galloway of "mouthing the propaganda of the
homophobic dictatorship in Tehran", after the Respect MP claimed on
Matthew Wright's Channel 5 talk show that Kazemi's boyfriend was
executed in Iran for "committing sex crimes against young men".
Galloway said the uproar over Kazemi's possible deportation from the
UK "is being used as part of the propaganda against Iran". He added,
controversially: "All the papers seem to imply you get executed in
Iran for being gay. That's not true."
Galloway says that he has campaigned against the death penalty in any
circumstances. He tells Pandora: "But it is important to avoid that
propaganda. There are those who are trying to give the khaki war
machine a veneer of pink." He added: "I have an unblemished record of
support for lesbian and gay equality. I have condemned homophobia in
Iran and oppose the deportation."
Tatchell does not fear the litigious Gorgeous: "George was asked to
provide evidence for his claim that Mehdi Kazemi's boyfriend was
hanged for sex crimes against young men. He has failed to do so.
Moreover he has failed to apologise or withdraw the allegation.
"This shows him to be a politician without integrity or principles. He
should either provide the evidence or shut up."
taffboy gwyrdd
Embrace the confusion!
He is a member of The Green Party, and a candidate for an Oxford seat (West I think)
Whether that makes him "left" is for others to make their own judgement.
Nigel
For A Degenerates' Workers State
http://www.greenparty.org.uk/news/2977
Looks pretty left wing to me.
Greens in Oxfordshire have been doing quite a bit of work around NHS campaigns, in Witney around centre for outpatients with mental health problems, the chair of Keep NHS public is ex Labour now Green, and is an important issue which P.T has made a prioty, John Radcliffe being a flagship for PFI trust initiatives.
There are quite a few issues that I find dodgy with Peter Tatchell, HOPI being one of them, however he will be the best candidate with a realistic chance of winning beating a Blairite Andrew Smith
Looks pretty left wing to me.
Greens in Oxfordshire have been doing quite a bit of work around NHS campaigns, in Witney around centre for outpatients with mental health problems, the chair of Keep NHS public is ex Labour now Green, and is an important issue which P.T has made a prioty, John Radcliffe being a flagship for PFI trust initiatives.
There are quite a few issues that I find dodgy with Peter Tatchell, HOPI being one of them, however he will be the best candidate with a realistic chance of winning beating a Blairite Andrew Smith
audiotech
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During the Bermondsey election campaign in 1983 Peter Thatchell was vilified by both the Labour party and the Liberals. Left-wing journalist David Osler canvassed for Tatchell on a couple of occasions. Ostler was taken aback by how hostile the reception was on some of the council estates.
danny la rouge
Ninja swords for all disabled people
Are you somehow disqualified?
Paul Marsh
NeitherWashingtonNorMecca
The Osler quote is hilarious in that the successful candidate was Simon Hughes (who is gay) and in large part won the seat because he received the anti-gay vote.
In the late 90s I worked with a Tory party member who had canvassed in that by-election, and told me that the Conservative party candidate was also gay.
I am not sure what it says about British politics that all 3 of the main party candidates were gay, and 2 of the 3 were in the closet hurling abuse at the guy out of the closet, but I'm sure it says something.
Spion
I hear ya
It's sort of funny while being shameful too.
I'm off to watch that White in Barking thing
danny la rouge
Ninja swords for all disabled people
You'd laugh if it wasn't so sad.
I think I know what it says, mind. I'm just not sure I have the energy or the heart to type it all out.
During the Bermondsey election campaign in 1983 Peter Thatchell was vilified by both the Labour party and the Liberals. Left-wing journalist David Osler canvassed for Tatchell on a couple of occasions. Ostler was taken aback by how hostile the reception was on some of the council estates.
NOT cos he was a 'communist poofter' MC
but because he was more doctrinaire, more narrow minded, more m/c trendy lefty, more arrogently pc, then, than now ..
taffboy gwyrdd
Embrace the confusion!
Are you somehow disqualified?
Being wanky about it, Id say that Green politics is partly about moving beyond old paradigms.
Of course, compared to the establishment the Green Party is "left wing", probably averaging out as "social market" types compared to the neoliberal fundementalism elsewhere. But it is complex, there is more sympathy for anarchism in the party than you might get in many traditional left parties.
However, people who think they are "proper" left often dont like Greens because we are lacking in class fetish. They also say we are too "middle class" which is funny because that would have ruled out Marx and Engels from their little gang for starters. And we dont fit the left mould of endless "Judean Peoples Front" infighting.
audiotech
wav, aiff, mp3, ogg, flac
NOT cos he was a 'communist poofter' MC
No? Well there was a distinct campaign to highlight his homosexuality at the time and some of the tabloids described him as 'Red Pete'. No suprise then when some reactionary old git comes out and describes Tatchell as a 'communist poofter'. Then there were the physical threats made on him, his windows smashed and his telephone ringing off the hook.
Widely believed by a half a dozen Gallowayite lunatics and a few folk from Harry's Place, you mean.
Fisher_Gate
Active Member
Like Tony Greenstein comes into that category, eh? Roland Rance is someone whose judgement on this I trust.
things are not just black and white mc .. there is NO question there was a DISGUSTING RIGHTWING attack on him from mellish and old school labourites, opportunist ( and as we learn hypocritical ) libdems and the media .. BUT many leftists were unhappy with him too, as at the time he summed up the patronising, ultra PC, almost anti w/c brigade of the GLC trendty lefties .. i think he has got a lot better thru time
p.s. don't forget 'neither washington nor moscow' .. we do not have to take sides!
butchersapron
Bring back hanging
I know long term fairly influential SWP members who think it too.
audiotech
wav, aiff, mp3, ogg, flac
p.s. don't forget 'neither washington nor moscow' .. we do not have to take sides!
Yes, you side with the anti-immigrant brigade - I don't.
audiotech
wav, aiff, mp3, ogg, flac
as you keep on telling me!
Is that your dog attacking the poles?
Udo Erasmus
Well-Known Member
On Negri: This is the joker who said that the State was irrelevant and the age of imperialist interstate rivalry was over just before 9.11 and the 'war on terror' driven by . . . inter-state rivalry between EU, America and China.
He's popular among bourgeois academia but of little practical use for activist theoreticians. Though some of the work of the autonomia has value.
Peter Tatchell IS an apologist for imperialism! He has clearly attacked the anti-war movement for calling for an immediate withdrawal of troops on the basis that US occupation would be the lesser evil to Iraqis governing their own country. Apparently the natives would all be murdering each other without daddy US according to this latterday colonialist.
It's disappointing but all the evidence suggests that Peter Tatchell is islamophobic and many of his pronouncements are reminiscent of Pim Fortuyn.
This is the guy who was happy to form a truly unholy alliance, appearing on the same platform as BNP front-group 'Civil Liberty' and extreme right 'Liberty Alliance' on a "March for Freedom of Expression" while attacking Unite against Fascism for inviting a spokesperson from the Muslim Council. Yes, you read that right, Nazis are okay for Tatchell. Appearing at a rally where the BNP were openly present and the square was decked out in Union Jacks was okay for Tatchell. But a spokesperson for a mainstream muslim organisation at an anti-fascist event is beyond the pale for him. For more info on some of the unpleasant types that Tatchell hangs with, see: http://www.whatnextjournal.co.uk/Pages/Latest/MFE.html
This is the guy who thinks that police aren't harrassing Muslims enough! At the aforementioned march he explicity addressed the police and said, "stop being afraid of upsetting the Muslim community. They are not above the law.”
After Forest Gate, Belmarsh Prison, dawn raids on Muslims, the increase of Stop and Search against Asians by police in excess of 300%, the whipping up of 'muslims under the bed' by the mainstream media, it is unquestionable that only someone who is an islamophobe could make such an absurd statement.
Claiming that police are scared of upsetting Muslims is the kind of crap you'd expect from The Sun or some right wing bigot.
He's popular among bourgeois academia but of little practical use for activist theoreticians. Though some of the work of the autonomia has value.
Peter Tatchell IS an apologist for imperialism! He has clearly attacked the anti-war movement for calling for an immediate withdrawal of troops on the basis that US occupation would be the lesser evil to Iraqis governing their own country. Apparently the natives would all be murdering each other without daddy US according to this latterday colonialist.
It's disappointing but all the evidence suggests that Peter Tatchell is islamophobic and many of his pronouncements are reminiscent of Pim Fortuyn.
This is the guy who was happy to form a truly unholy alliance, appearing on the same platform as BNP front-group 'Civil Liberty' and extreme right 'Liberty Alliance' on a "March for Freedom of Expression" while attacking Unite against Fascism for inviting a spokesperson from the Muslim Council. Yes, you read that right, Nazis are okay for Tatchell. Appearing at a rally where the BNP were openly present and the square was decked out in Union Jacks was okay for Tatchell. But a spokesperson for a mainstream muslim organisation at an anti-fascist event is beyond the pale for him. For more info on some of the unpleasant types that Tatchell hangs with, see: http://www.whatnextjournal.co.uk/Pages/Latest/MFE.html
This is the guy who thinks that police aren't harrassing Muslims enough! At the aforementioned march he explicity addressed the police and said, "stop being afraid of upsetting the Muslim community. They are not above the law.”
After Forest Gate, Belmarsh Prison, dawn raids on Muslims, the increase of Stop and Search against Asians by police in excess of 300%, the whipping up of 'muslims under the bed' by the mainstream media, it is unquestionable that only someone who is an islamophobe could make such an absurd statement.
Claiming that police are scared of upsetting Muslims is the kind of crap you'd expect from The Sun or some right wing bigot.
Udo Erasmus
Well-Known Member
Did you also support their 'red scare' letters to the bourgeois press? Yeah the SWP are out but forming coalitions with the Tories and LibDems and cutting local services is okay for the Greens.
butchersapron
Bring back hanging
No, you're the joker who says that he said this - he's never said anything as mind-numbingly stupid as 'the state is irrelevant.'
I'd be interestd to hear what 'work of the autonomia has value.' to you.
Udo Erasmus
Well-Known Member
Generally you find with these types that under the cloak of radical language they are basically left-liberals.
Negri makes a series of statements that are bullshit. This 'radical' for example campaigned for a Yes vote to the neoliberal European Constitution because he took a classic left-liberal position of illusions in the EU bosses club. His colleague Hardt denounced the Feb 15th demonstrations for being 'anti-american'. Incidentally, you see more evidence of Negri's use of radical language for reactionary politics in his stances on Latin America - ultra-critical of Chavez, an apologist for Lula.
In the preface of his book Empire he absurdly states that imperialism is over and that the nation state is irrelevant: "The United States does not, and indeed no nation-state can today, form the center of an imperialist project. Imperialism is over. No nation will be world leader in the way modern European nations were." - er no!
He says that 'Empire' has no centre. Actually Empire has a centre - The United States of America.
If you want to understand the 'war on terror' Negri's concept of 'Empire' is useless as a tool for interpreting reality and incredibly weak when compared to far older theories of imperialism such as those of Lenin and Bukharin.
Geri
wasn't born to follow
There you go, you're unable to find Negri saying that the state is irrelavent. In fact all you've done is pointed to an anlaysis that's explicity based on the continuing but changed importance of states. In fact, the very next line, the one that follows on from your quote goes onto say:
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