SWP in congress

[Fisher_Gate]

Where is the candidate from if not from Preston?

One of the middle class Tory rural villages, 3-4 miles north of the city. It's part of the Council local government area, but it's not in the City proper.

 

[JHE]

Galloway praised the 'trotskyites' at the Respect Renewal conference, particularly in the form of Alan Thornett. Personally I've never seen this 'loathing of trots' anyway. He was particularly fullsome in his praise of Michael Lavalette at the Manchester Respect rally last autumn and I do think it was genuine. Of course he comes from a stalinist tradition but that's hardly a problem when you've had people of the organisational calibre of John Rees running the show.

His praise for the Social Workers at their 'Marxism' event last summer was fulsome. He didn't even use the term 'Trotskyite', IIRC.

He did use it when he was having a pop at Christopher Hitchens. IIRC, he called Hitchens a drink-sodden Trotskyite poppinjay - or was it 'ex-Trotskyite'?

We all know that 'Trotskyite' is a bit pejorative. That's why I generally opt for 'Trot'. It's neutral!

The Trots themselves prefer 'Trotskyist' - except for the Social Workers, who prefer just to call themselves 'socialists'.

To be fair to Gallahway, he does employ a couple of Trots. I think he's more like his Cuban heroes than his Soviet heroes in this. He doesn't mind Trots too much, as long as they get on board and support the Great Leader.

(He is, of course, very unlike his Baathist heroes, in this. They just kill Commies without fussing too much about which type of Commie they are.)

 

[sunshine1]

Twisted Cords

Galloway praised the 'trotskyites' at the Respect Renewal conference, particularly in the form of Alan Thornett.

I think that Alan Thornett is a nice geezer as it goes, 'trotskyite' or not he understands the need for a new left of Labour party, a party that brings together all the best threads and connections that link the various parts of the movement into one. As for George Galloway and the campaign of twisted cords thats been unrelenting, never-ceasing in blacking this hard working mans name one way or the other, and in doing so members of the SWP and others that say they are against war play into hands politically of all those that would like to see Galloway silenced like the American neoconservatives and there friends in the world.

 

[junius]

Galloway praised the 'trotskyites' at the Respect Renewal conference, particularly in the form of Alan Thornett. Personally I've never seen this 'loathing of trots' anyway. He was particularly fullsome in his praise of Michael Lavalette at the Manchester Respect rally last autumn and I do think it was genuine. Of course he comes from a stalinist tradition but that's hardly a problem when you've had people of the organisational calibre of John Rees running the show.

Are you so naive FG? I remember at the time of the SLP, King Arthur was quite happy to have trots carry his bags and guard the door eg Brian Heron and co.

Now Arthur would never give an outsider the impression he hated trots - Galloway, in this regard at least, is less subtle. Yet early on, he set the trot-loathing, attack dog psychos of the EPSR on FISC and Heron left the 97 conference in tears.

Now Galloway isn't a 'hard' Stalinist like Arthur. Nor does he he have an Uncle Joe fan club around him in the EPSR or the Brarites.

If you think his praise for Thornett,to paraphrase ,'as one of the most important trotskyists in Britain' is not at least unconsciously tongue in cheek, then look at his history of trot-hating.

If the CPB came on board RR, it wouldn't be long before Thornett mysteriously fell from a top-floor wingow.

 

[mutley]

Well the Sparkbrook ward candidate will be selected on Thursday next. What's interesting is that the good people who lead respect renewal round here have decided that you can only vote in this meeting if you were a member last year on 28th November.

Funny, I seem to remember a selection in kings heath where about 50 people signed up on the day. Apparently that was an example of democratic involvement of the members. Now that someone (who?) has tried to get the Sparkbrook nomination that a certain S Yaqoob isn't keen on, we have a sudden retrospective membership rule.

Wouldn't it have been funny if the SWP had tried to pull such a stunt in Tower hamlets. Oh the howls of protest we'd have heard about the exclusion of the poor huddled masses.

Respect Renewal are a shower. And Salma Yaqoob won't get elected as RR. She's frittering away her moral authority. She'll prob get in as Labour at some point though.

 

[JHE]

Respect Renewal are a shower. And Salma Yaqoob won't get elected as RR. She's frittering away her moral authority. She'll prob get in as Labour at some point though.

What moral authority is that?

(Interesting theory about her hitching up with the Labour Party one day, though. Some others in al-Respeq would probably feel more at home with the Tories.)

 

[Fisher_Gate]

Are you so naive FG? I remember at the time of the SLP, King Arthur was quite happy to have trots carry his bags and guard the door eg Brian Heron and co.

Now Arthur would never give an outsider the impression he hated trots - Galloway, in this regard at least, is less subtle. Yet early on, he set the trot-loathing, attack dog psychos of the EPSR on FISC and Heron left the 97 conference in tears.

Now Galloway isn't a 'hard' Stalinist like Arthur. Nor does he he have an Uncle Joe fan club around him in the EPSR or the Brarites.

If you think his praise for Thornett,to paraphrase ,'as one of the most important trotskyists in Britain' is not at least unconsciously tongue in cheek, then look at his history of trot-hating.

If the CPB came on board RR, it wouldn't be long before Thornett mysteriously fell from a top-floor wingow.

You obviously are not prepared to work with social democrats and stalinists - good luck to you in preserving your rrrrevolutionary purity, but you'll never build anything of substance.

 

[Fisher_Gate]

Well the Sparkbrook ward candidate will be selected on Thursday next. What's interesting is that the good people who lead respect renewal round here have decided that you can only vote in this meeting if you were a member last year on 28th November.

Funny, I seem to remember a selection in kings heath where about 50 people signed up on the day. Apparently that was an example of democratic involvement of the members. Now that someone (who?) has tried to get the Sparkbrook nomination that a certain S Yaqoob isn't keen on, we have a sudden retrospective membership rule.

Wouldn't it have been funny if the SWP had tried to pull such a stunt in Tower hamlets. Oh the howls of protest we'd have heard about the exclusion of the poor huddled masses.

Respect Renewal are a shower. And Salma Yaqoob won't get elected as RR. She's frittering away her moral authority. She'll prob get in as Labour at some point though.

Pots and kettles. Selection meetings are publicised in advance in Birmingham and members notified of them. Your 'model' branch in Preston now does no such thing. And SWP members from far and wide, a long way from Preston, feel free to attend and vote, even where they've got a nominal 'Respect' branch of their own (Bolton for example).

 

[junius]

You obviously are not prepared to work with social democrats and stalinists - good luck to you in preserving your rrrrevolutionary purity, but you'll never build anything of substance.

Not at all and I don't know how you reached that conclusion.

However, when you are working with trot haters, it's best to ask if all icepicks are delared at the start of the speaking.

 

[TremulousTetra]

I am not aware that anyone in membership of the SWP is involved in the Respect Renewal project

I am.

- they would be expelled immediately as I understand it (I am sure that nwnm can confirm this). There are many ex-members of the SWP involved in Respect Renewal - or supporting the notion of Respect built on a different basis to the SWP having an organisational stranglehold.

none of the one I've spoke to have couched it in that way. They have a POLITICAL disagreement with the SW modle for RESPECT. They are wrong IMHO.

You also refer to Respect Renewal as if it had some kind of homogenous view. Thankfully it does not - there is a diversity of views concomittant with the notion of building on the original concept of Respect as a range of opinion in the left, united by what they agree on, and prepared to work together around a broad range of political issues.

There are no significant structures of Renewal - the meeting on 17 November did not create a new leadership or structure, all that was agreed was to reject the SWP-front conference and that the 19 members of the National Committee of Respect would continue to lead the development of Renewal and negotiate a seperation from the SWP-front to create two new organisations. The intention would be for the new organisation to hold a conference in the Spring to determine constitution, structure, priorities etc.

The pronouncements of Respect Renewal are extremely limited, there has been one newspaper, a meeting of the NC members takes place today, and in a couple of areas Renewal is in the driving seat of some important branches. There will be local elections in May and a pact needs to be drawn up with the SWP-front, as we have no interest in seeing socialists oppose each other in elections. Galloway and Yaqoob, for example, remain important figures, but their views are not necessarily those of all those in Renewal, indeed it would be unhealthy if they are not, as Renewal should be about pluralism not unanimity.

Thus we are going through a transitional phase before a new organisation is launched. The main fly in the ointment remains the leadership of the SWP, who, having committed to negotiations for an amicable seperation have reneged on that and are trying to sabotage this process. There is still time for them to find a sensible compromise and recommence the process of negotiation, but their current attitude does them no favours or the wider cause of the radical left.

Can
John Reese join the Galloway faction? Can Galloway join RESPECT?

 

[audiotech]

I've got a great idea for the title of it - why not "the Socialist Workers Party"?

 

[Zeppo]

"Respect is organising a selection meeting for its candidates for the London Assembly elections that are set for 1 May. The meeting is at 7.30pm, Thursday 31 January, Conway Hall, Red Lion Square (nearest tube Holborn)". From this week's Socialist Worker. It also states L. German is the Respect candidate for Mayor.

Fisher what is happening? The crazy situation that has been forecasted is now reality. Two Respects in an election.

The left could not organise a piss up in a brewery. (walks off in despair).

 

[Fisher_Gate]

"Respect is organising a selection meeting for its candidates for the London Assembly elections that are set for 1 May. The meeting is at 7.30pm, Thursday 31 January, Conway Hall, Red Lion Square (nearest tube Holborn)". From this week's Socialist Worker. It also states L. German is the Respect candidate for Mayor.

Fisher what is happening? The crazy situation that has been forecasted is now reality. Two Respects in an election.

The left could not organise a piss up in a brewery. (walks off in despair).

The SWP-Respect are now telling Respect Renewal people that they have been expelled or resigned. (There is no provision in the constitution for expulsion by the way and you can be a member of other organisations and still be in Respect of course and no-one has resigned).

The Tower Hamlets SWP-Respect have now proposed changing their name from "Independent" to "Unity Coalition", which is somewhat rich as they resigned from the Respect Group on the Council and "Coalition" they ain't.

I'm afraid the SWP's antics are making the whole thing look ridiculous - it could all be sorted amicably if they were willing to return to negotiations through a trusted third party for a dignified split, out of which both groups could build, and even cooperate on elections.

 

[poster342002]

the SWP's antics are making the whole thing look ridiculous

Just for a change ...