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Support the people of Iran- oppose the Iranian Regime 7th October

barney_pig said:
when did I claim to stand in the tradition of the fucking leninists?
Its you who in defending the butchers of the iranian revolution keep quoting the butcher of the russian revolution.
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But the Iranian communists participated fully in the 1979 Iranian revolution! From students to armed militias. And those communist militias slaughtered people who participated in the Shah's regime and also religious leaders. That's correct, isn't it?
 
invisibleplanet said:
Support the people of Britain! Oppose the Lords Spiritual!
Every year the supporters of the vicious Theocratic regime in Britain demonstrate their support with a rally at the Palace of Westminster. This rally is organised by a group which calls itself the House of Lords, (in fact it is a pro British mainly Christian front group that cares nothing for the human rights of people living under British regime).

The Church of England have gained support from not only the nutty christofascists of British National Party, but also the what's left of the idiot Tory Party.

This year there will be a counter demonstration called by British communists and dissidents and their supporters. Gather at Piccadilly 12 PM Sunday 32th October...

:rolleyes:
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:D :D
yee-owch!
 
invisibleplanet said:
But the Iranian communists participated fully in the 1979 Iranian revolution! From students to armed militias. And those communist militias slaughtered people who participated in the Shah's regime and also religious leaders. That's correct, isn't it?
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Since you're so knowledgable, perhaps you could remind us all what the Iranian regime did to the communists afterwards.
 
Well I didn't see any puppets on the counter demo today.

Just a principled gathering with a good speech from Mary Namazie.

As for the Al Quds lot - a load of very unpleasant people marching beneath pictures of that well known friend of the working classes the Ayatollah Khomeini.

Scum, basically.
 
invisibleplanet said:
But the Iranian communists participated fully in the 1979 Iranian revolution!
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Many reformists, leftists and self-proclaimed Communists, with the exception of Mansoor Hekmat (who founded the Worker Communist Party of Iran, and opposed the Islamic Revolution from the beginning), did exactly that and paid a cruel price for siding with clerical fascists.

Hekmat's The History of the Undefeated - A few words in commemoration of the 1979 Revolution is well worth reading, IMO.

Also, his take on 'Political Islam' (what gets called 'Islamism') is interesting.

It is not a repeat of the same old phenomenon. It is the result of a defeated - or better put - aborted project of Western modernisation in Moslem-inhabited Middle Eastern countries from the late 60s and early 70s as well as a decline in the secular-nationalist movement, which was the main agent of this economic, administrative and cultural modernisation. The ideological and governmental crisis in the region heightened. With this political-ideological vacuum and the local bourgeoisie's confusion, the Islamic movement came to the fore as a Right-wing alternative for the reorganisation of bourgeois rule to confront the Left and the working class, which had emerged with the rise of capitalism. Even so, without the 1978-79 developments in Iran, these movements would still not have had a chance and would have remained marginal. It was in Iran that this movement organised itself as a state and turned political Islam into a considerable force in the region.
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what an interesting value of demcracy you corporation sucking ideologues have- in the UK the only candidates allowed to even stand in elections are those funded by the capitalist authorities. The idea that these facades equal a democratic govermnet is absurd.
 
ymu said:
what an interesting value of demcracy you corporation sucking ideologues have- in the UK the only candidates allowed to even stand in elections are those funded by the capitalist authorities. The idea that these facades equal a democratic govermnet is absurd.
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Look, regardless of how democratic or not the UK is (and I don't think it is, particularly), most of the people on these boards would likely be maimed or executed if they carried on in Iran like they do over here. The demo isn't there to call for a US invasion, but to:
A) Support the Iranian working class and;
B) Pull up the fucking numpties who seem to think that Iran is some utopian bastion of democracy in the Middle East, that will suddenly turn to dust if you say anything bad about it.
 
Nah, it's just hundreds of thousands of other people getting murdered by our regime and a bunch of terr'ist teenagers getting banged up for owning the Anarchists Cookbook (don't worry, they're mostly Muslims).

Forget that there was a substantial protest movement in Iran before Armadinajad got his fabulous propaganda boost from USuk posturing. Not important. We should just join the USuk propaganda machine like any good citizen.
 
ymu said:
Forget that there was a substantial protest movement in Iran before Armadinajad got his fabulous propaganda boost from USuk posturing. Not important. We should just join the USuk propaganda machine like any good citizen.
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But nobody on the counter demo was such a person.
 
Wow, another unbelievable thread. Will the po-faced leftists ever understand? The 'corporation sucking ideologues' seem to have done so pretty easily - my enemies enemy is not my friend. It's not that hard a lesson.
 
ymu said:
Nah, it's just hundreds of thousands of other people getting murdered by our regime and a bunch of terr'ist teenagers getting banged up for owning the Anarchists Cookbook (don't worry, they're mostly Muslims).

Forget that there was a substantial protest movement in Iran before Armadinajad got his fabulous propaganda boost from USuk posturing. Not important. We should just join the USuk propaganda machine like any good citizen.
Click to expand...

Seriously, why must you argue like a teenager whose just discoverd Conflict? Why must you moralise so crassly at those who disagree with you? Why must everyone else be 'corporation sucking ideologues' 'good citizens', or any of big mac and media obssesed people who populate your paranoid political psychology. You're not talking to who you think you are.
 
ymu said:
Forget that there was a substantial protest movement in Iran before Armadinajad got his fabulous propaganda boost from USuk posturing. Not important. We should just join the USuk propaganda machine like any good citizen.
Click to expand...


What on earth is your argument supposed to be here? That an anti-theocratic movement was already underway in iran before the US started on them. Well yes, agreed. But that now the US has started we should abandon those people who were in the head of that movement, the same people who are now being persecuted by the space the US has opened up for the theocracy to clamp-down in the name of national security? And worse, we shouldn't do our best to attack those who are attacking them - instead we should effectively support them, or at the very least turn a blind eye and pretend that it's not happening? Is this how you support that pre-existing 'substantial protest movement' that you mentioned?

It's all over the shop - what was this 'substantial protest movement' potesting at and for? Have their demands been met? Have they stopped protesting? (No is the answer). So why have you stopped suporting them?
 
butchersapron said:
Why must everyone else be 'corporation sucking ideologues' 'good citizens', or any of big mac and media obssesed people who populate your paranoid political psychology. You're not talking to who you think you are.
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Adding 'imam-sucking trots' to that list, for balance :-/

adc069975 said:
invisibleplanet said:
But the Iranian communists participated fully in the 1979 Iranian revolution! From students to armed militias. And those communist militias slaughtered people who participated in the Shah's regime and also religious leaders. That's correct, isn't it?
Click to expand...
Many reformists, leftists and self-proclaimed Communists, with the exception of Mansoor Hekmat (who founded the Worker Communist Party of Iran, and opposed the Islamic Revolution from the beginning), did exactly that and paid a cruel price for siding with clerical fascists.

Hekmat's The History of the Undefeated - A few words in commemoration of the 1979 Revolution is well worth reading, IMO.

Also, his take on 'Political Islam' (what gets called 'Islamism') is interesting.
It is not a repeat of the same old phenomenon. It is the result of a defeated - or better put - aborted project of Western modernisation in Moslem-inhabited Middle Eastern countries from the late 60s and early 70s as well as a decline in the secular-nationalist movement, which was the main agent of this economic, administrative and cultural modernisation. The ideological and governmental crisis in the region heightened. With this political-ideological vacuum and the local bourgeoisie's confusion, the Islamic movement came to the fore as a Right-wing alternative for the reorganisation of bourgeois rule to confront the Left and the working class, which had emerged with the rise of capitalism. Even so, without the 1978-79 developments in Iran, these movements would still not have had a chance and would have remained marginal. It was in Iran that this movement organised itself as a state and turned political Islam into a considerable force in the region.
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Very informative.
Thankyou for posting that. Are there any other political groups beside Hekmat/Workers' Communist Party of Iran (State-communists, yes?) that we should know about?
 
The Ingenious Knight of La Mancha said:
Nah, it's just hundreds of thousands of other people getting murdered by our regime and a bunch of terr'ist teenagers getting banged up for owning the Anarchists Cookbook (don't worry, they're mostly Muslims).
Click to expand...
What the fuck does that have to do with anything anybody's said on this thread? Has anybody said that they support US or UK invasions in the Middle East? Has anybody suggested that the recent arrests of fantasist teenagers with a few books you can download easily from the internet is anything but rediculous?
 
butchersapron said:
State communist?!!!! No, the exact opposite. Please, do some reading people.
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I know a lot less about this than I probably should. What's a good source on the WPCI?
 
The problem is, the leaflet quoted seems to regurgitate USuk propaganda about Armadinajad's statements on the Holocaust. I've not seen independent unedited versions of his speeches, but VP has and he seems to think the points he makes are not Holocaust denial. but concern the inappropriate propaganda use of the Holocaust to justify Israel's crimes and neutralise opposition. So, much the same as Norman Finkelstein's arguments; the ones that got him labelled a "self-hating Jew" and forced him to resign because there is zero academic freedom in the US if you are critical of Israel.

The Council of Ex-Muslims was only formed in June 2007, so I don't know very much about them. Just that they formed and started putting out propaganda leaflets against Iran just when the Western media is in propaganda overdrive against Iran.

I don't have any evidence yet that they are any less of a propaganda tool of the West than IHRC is of the Ayatollahs.
 
It’s probably worth pointing out that the counter demo was actually organised by the pro war Harry’s Place blog and supported by the WPI and others:

The counterprotest was organized by the popular British blog "Harry's Place‚" under the banner "Oppose the Government of Iran, support the people of Iran." It included a variety of individuals, Jewish and non-Jewish, from all along the political spectrum: Iranian dissident groups and individuals stood with human rights campaigners, socialist groups like the Alliance for Workers' Liberty and anarchist group Class War.

"We wanted to see if we could pull together people from across the political spectrum, from communists to liberals, who support democracy and human rights in Iran and oppose the current murderous regime," Dave T., the proprietor of "Harry's Place" and organizer of the counter-demo, told The Jerusalem Post.
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http://www.jpost.com/servlet/Satellite?cid=1191257244732&pagename=JPost/JPArticle/ShowFull

Given both the politics of the organisers and Brown’s recent declaration that he’ll back air strikes on Iran, I wouldn’t have participated in the counter demo. I don't think I could've stomached the al Quds demo either though.
 
Iranian Revolution 1 Step Foward 3 Steps Backward

Both seem a bit dodgy to me.
Don't like the sound of these Council Of Ex Muslims, nothing much on regimes which are user friendly to U.S. Western Imperialism, such as Saudi Arabia & Kuwait. Very Pro-Israeli as well by all accounts, but the counter demo seems the better of two evils. I think the Libertarian Left are right to talk about Islamo Fascism, however they are throwing the baby out with the bathwater, not seeing the gains made by the 1979 revolution.

Shirin Ebadi when I saw her speak was very critical of Western Intervention/Aggression towards Iranian Regime as it makes it a lot diificult for proggressive groups, individuals elements gaining popular support because of the seige mentality created by it.


I don't see much support on hear from anyone when their was a transport strike in Iran about a year ago that was violently attacked.
The CWI/Socialist Party and other 'trots' and elements of the Authoritarian Left supported this politically, morally & financially.

Giving genuine support for struggle in Iran would be better than supporting groups like this Council Of Ex Muslims, who if they are not stooges definitely play right into such a role, if not only alienating any development of a united front with individuals who maybe Muslim and a struggling for freedom, democracy and social justice as well.
 
muckypup said:
whenever the capitalist murder machine is about to strike, it whips up the populace in an 'anti islamicist' frenzy. i love the way the loony left give the capiltilits elite a help hand to dehumanise and pave the way for a good slaughter.

Oh and dont forget you commies, it was the Iranian working class who democratically elected the 'Islamists'

:rolleyes:
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which group is this one from?
 
the Iranian government are a bunch of thugs and deserve a kicking at any oppurtunity.
just because you think the mullahs are scum does'nt make you a cheer leader of op persian freedom:rolleyes:
 
Nigel said:
however they are throwing the baby out with the bathwater, not seeing the gains made by the 1979 revolution.
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Any "gains" made by the 1979 revolution were all overturned and fucked over when the islamists crushed it when they took power immedatiely afterwards.
 
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