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Spielberg : A poll

Spielberg

  • I think he's the best director ever

    Votes: 0 0.0%

  • He's brilliant without a shadow of doubt

    Votes: 20 43.5%

  • He's good but I'm not a fan

    Votes: 12 26.1%

  • I think he's ok, nothing special tho

    Votes: 10 21.7%

  • I think he's rubbish

    Votes: 3 6.5%

  • Is that the one with the red bike?

    Votes: 1 2.2%
  • Total voters
    46
littlebabyjesus said:
It was essentially a feel-good movie about the Holocaust, complete with saintly Jews. The half truths in it left me feeling sick.

I agree that a film about the Holocaust is a difficult thing to pull off. But an honest and simple treatment of, say, Primo Levi's If this is a man could be so much more powerful.
Click to expand...

I might have to watch it again with a more cynical eye lol. I thought it portrayed the book pretty well, and he also added his own touch using his visual flair to communicate effectively the scale of the holocaust

Which bits did you disagree with? I haven't seen the film for years, I don't remember any half truths or anything, just the atmosphere (which was very like the book)
 
The bit that annoyed me the most was when the women get sent for a shower and there's this tense few moments where they think they're going to be gassed, but eventually to their relief, water comes out
 
littlebabyjesus said:
I agree that a film about the Holocaust is a difficult thing to pull off. But an honest and simple treatment of, say, Primo Levi's If this is a man could be so much more powerful.
Click to expand...

Fateless is a great film about the holocuast.


It's hungarian - so you have to deal with subtitles.... but it's truly superb.

I think it was on BBC4 a while back.

edit to add IMDB link, if anyone is interested: http://www.imdb.com/title/tt0367082/
 
isitme said:
I might have to watch it again with a more cynical eye lol. I thought it portrayed the book pretty well, and he also added his own touch using his visual flair to communicate effectively the scale of the holocaust

Which bits did you disagree with? I haven't seen the film for years, I don't remember any half truths or anything, just the atmosphere (which was very like the book)
Click to expand...
I also haven't seen it for years, but essentially, the aspect of the Holocaust that he does not deal with is the way that the concentration camps degraded their victims. One of the reasons behind survivor guilt is that, as Primo Levi and others have said, 'the best of us are dead'. And also, 'those who experienced the worst of the camps are all dead'.

Portraying this complexity in a film is always going to be really hard, which is why the stories told often centre around outsiders such as Schindler. It's far easier to tell his story than that of the victims. That's not necessarily a criticism – it's a legitimate story to tell – but to then tell it using manipulative techniques such as the girl in the red coat just struck me as crass.
 
butchersapron said:
http://www.imdb.com/title/tt0466932/

Not done as a narrative.

See also The Truce, Rosi's last film:

http://www.imdb.com/title/tt0117959/
Click to expand...
I saw Sher do that at the Cottesloe. Very well done – he did the only thing you can do really with If this is a man – told it straight. Didn't know it was now a film.

I'll definitely watch The Truce too. Again, it's a much easier story to tell than If this is a man, but I don't blame filmmakers for shying away from it.

ETA: The challenge facing a filmmaker, I think, to make If this is a man, would be to incorporate the ideas in Moments of Reprieve and the Drowned and the Saved into it. I think elements from all three of these books could be combined to produce a complex study of brutality. But it's one hell of a challenge.
 
It's phenomenally complicated question. Jaw is both a magnificent story and technically brilliant. Then you get something that is absolute drivel like the color purple.

If you look at his IMDB The breath of output is staggering. I mean as a producer he gave us both Seaquest DSV and Pinky and Brain. It's impossible to be consistently good with massive body of work he's putting out is just impossible.

Also I think you're putting too much faith in auteur theory. Lets take between 2001 and 2005 shall we?

He directed.

# Munich (2005)
... aka Steven Spielberg's Munich (Australia)
# War of the Worlds (2005)
# The Terminal (2004)
# Catch Me If You Can (2002)
# Minority Report (2002)
# Artificial Intelligence: AI (2001)

He produced.

# Munich (2005) (producer)
... aka Steven Spielberg's Munich (Australia)
# Memoirs of a Geisha (2005) (producer)
# The Legend of Zorro (2005) (executive producer)
... aka Z (USA: poster title)
# "Into the West" (2005) TV mini-series (executive producer) (unknown episodes)
# Dan Finnerty & the Dan Band: I Am Woman (2005) (TV) (executive producer)
# The Terminal (2004) (producer)
# Voices from the List (2004) (V) (executive producer)
# Burma Bridge Busters (2003) (TV) (executive producer)
# Catch Me If You Can (2002) (producer)
# "Taken" (2002) TV series (executive producer) (unknown episodes)
... aka Steven Spielberg Presents Taken (USA: complete title)
# Men in Black II (2002) (executive producer)
... aka MIB 2 (USA: promotional abbreviation)
... aka MIIB (USA: promotional abbreviation)
# Price for Peace (2002) (executive producer)
# "Broken Silence" (2002) TV mini-series (executive producer)
# We Stand Alone Together (2001) (TV) (executive producer)
... aka We Stand Alone Together: The Men of Easy Company (Europe: English title: DVD title)
# "Band of Brothers" (2001) TV mini-series (executive producer) (unknown episodes)
# Jurassic Park III (2001) (executive producer)
... aka JP3 (USA: promotional abbreviation)
# Artificial Intelligence: AI (2001) (producer)
... aka A.I. Artificial Intelligence (USA: poster title)
# Evolution (2001) (executive producer) (uncredited)
# Shrek (2001) (executive producer) (uncredited)
# Semper Fi (2001) (TV) (executive producer)

and he wrote

# Medal of Honor: Pacific Assault (2004) (VG) (creator)
# Medal of Honor: Rising Sun (2003) (VG) (creator)
# Medal of Honor: Allied Assault - Spearhead (2003) (VG) (creator)
# Medal of Honor: Frontline (2002) (VG) (creator)
# Medal of Honor: Allied Assault (2002) (VG) (creator)
# Artificial Intelligence: AI (2001) (screenplay)
... aka A.I. Artificial Intelligence (USA: poster title)
# Medal of Honor: Underground (2000) (VG) (creator)

And six of those are video games

Do you really think every one of those projects could get his complete undivided attention? Christ he even fitted in;

Star Wars: Episode III - Revenge of the Sith (2005)
(assistant director: action scenes)

If you think he managed to do all that, and give the 6 films he directed in that period in his complete undivided attention you're deluded. He's a producer and director who surrounds himself with the best technicians and artists in the world. Janusz Kaminski shoots all his films. Michael Kahn cuts all his films. Joanna Johnston has been in charge of wardrobe for decades. John Williams always does his score.

Get the picture yet, at the level Spielberg works at, there's nothing auteur about it, there's a full team he always uses. So whenever you see a Spielberg movie, you know you're going to watch as technically perfect a film as you can see. It then lives and dies on the plot. Take saving private ryan, phenomenal opening act, solid second act, let down by an ending that is pure smaltz John Wayne esque bollocks.
 
littlebabyjesus said:
I also haven't seen it for years, but essentially, the aspect of the Holocaust that he does not deal with is the way that the concentration camps degraded their victims. One of the reasons behind survivor guilt is that, as Primo Levi and others have said, 'the best of us are dead'. And also, 'those who experienced the worst of the camps are all dead'.

Portraying this complexity in a film is always going to be really hard, which is why the stories told often centre around outsiders such as Schindler. It's far easier to tell his story than that of the victims. That's not necessarily a criticism – it's a legitimate story to tell – but to then tell it using manipulative techniques such as the girl in the red coat just struck me as crass.
Click to expand...

have you read the book?

The girls who went to the concentration camp only spent a few weeks in the concentration camp

I think the point he was trying to make was the enormity and insanity of the whole thing, rather than the experience of a jew at that time

Maybe it was a poor choice of a book, but we don't know how much of that was up to him
 
isitme said:
I think the point he was trying to make was the enormity and insanity of the whole thing
Click to expand...
This is the whole problem. He was trying to show the enormity and insanity of it, rather than just showing it. We, the viewers, can work out the enormity and insanity bit for ourselves.
 
His adventure and some sci-fi films are terrific. But as said by someone else, he's terrible doing sentimental stuff, and overdoes a lot by pushing his own views and feelings into the spectator.
 
I think that he's uneven, but that when he connects, he can hit one out of the park. Also, his work spans such a long time, that his movies have to be viewed in the context of the time they were released in. Jaws, for example, was a seminal horror movie of its time. The Sugarland Express, one of his first movies, is excellent. Duel is excellent. There are lots of examples.
 
littlebabyjesus said:
. He was trying to show the enormity and insanity of it, rather than just showing it. .
Click to expand...

That doesn't make any sense.

If it was enormous and insane, and he shows it, the thing he's showing will be enornmous and insane. To do that via a movie script, the 'enormity and insanity', must be contained within the script.
 
He is a very good story-teller that appeals universally. The simplicity of most of his films nearly always seems appropriate somehow.
 
Hit and miss.

Many of his films seem amazing at first view. If I go back and look at ET now though i realise what drivel it was and wonder why i liked it so much.
 
I think Catch Me if You Can and Minority Report are great examples of why he is still brilliant. they aren't 'big spielberg films' you'd associate with him. they do have big budgets and his mental 2.4 children agenda, but they also tackle really important stuff, at the same time as being 'adventures, and make the serious message really easy to digest

you kind of let him off with the whole pro family thing becasue he just manages to do films so well
 
isitme said:
I think Catch Me if You Can and Minority Report are great examples of why he is still brilliant. they aren't 'big spielberg films' you'd associate with him. they do have big budgets and his mental 2.4 children agenda, but they also tackle really important stuff, at the same time as being 'adventures, and make the serious message really easy to digest
Click to expand...

I'm sorry but what really important stuff does minority report and catch me if you can actually tackle?
 
8den said:
I'm sorry but what really important stuff does minority report and catch me if you can actually tackle?
Click to expand...

the bits in catch me if you can about his family falling to bits and his dad losing his job and so on were great

minority report, errr, pre crime lol
 
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