Speaker of Welsh Assembly calls on AMs to boycott visit of Israeli Ambassador
- Thread starter Udo Erasmus
- Start date
Udo Erasmus
Well-Known Member
I wasn't questioning either of your commitments to the cause, I meant getting your leaders to make some public statements, lots of AMs and politicians from other parties attacking DET, but no voices in the media from his own party applauding his stance and declaring that they would be boycotting the Ambassadors visit.
This would have been a perfect opportunity for Plaid to have used the attacks on DET to have started a debate on Israel's policies in the Welsh media, but instead DET is isolated. Let's see more politicians coming out in support of DETs stance.
This would have been a perfect opportunity for Plaid to have used the attacks on DET to have started a debate on Israel's policies in the Welsh media, but instead DET is isolated. Let's see more politicians coming out in support of DETs stance.
lewislewis
Lumumba Cymru
The best thing to do is to support the demonstration. I am sure i'll be there. AMs can decide to attend the meeting or attend the demonstration instead, it is up to them.
lewislewis
Lumumba Cymru
I do not accept that he is isolated. There is no major attack on DET, he can handle himself but i'm sure he will be encouraged by those Plaid AMs that are going to be at the demonstration. He isn't someone who seems to care what others think.
It's hardly equal to the bile directed at Jill Evans when she spoke out against St. Athan.
Udo Erasmus
Well-Known Member
That's true to some extent.
Is DET not very popular in his party?
If several AMs do attend the protest and it is covered in the media it could be a good thing.
Udo Erasmus
Well-Known Member
Out of interest has the Palestinian ambassador ever been invited to Cardiff Bay? Either Afif Safieh or Professor Manuel Hassassian, current Palestinian Delegate General to the UK
If not, it sets the visit in a very unpleasant context.
If not, it sets the visit in a very unpleasant context.
lewislewis
Lumumba Cymru
He is indeed popular and is elected as a Plaid AM and is a member of the party, but my impression is that he is an independent Welsh figure and does his own thing.
Udo Erasmus
Well-Known Member
It would be good if trade unionists could contact Wales TUC: [email protected] to ask them why organised labour that has always stood for internationalism is meeting with a representative of an oppressive state?
I wonder if the leaders of the Wales TUC will be asking Ron Prosor about the headquarters of the Palestinian equivalent to the British TUC being reduced to rubble and completely demolished by Israeli F16s only two months ago.
Udo Erasmus
Well-Known Member
Nice.
Rodney Berman once again repeating his crap that all Jewish people in Wales are in support of Israel,
http://www.totallyjewish.com/news/special_reports/?content_id=9403
"Clearly his view that the meeting should be boycotted is not one that would be understood by the Jewish community in Wales"
Actually, there are many Jewish people who oppose the policies of Israel and don't see it as representing them in anyway, just as their are many non-Jewish people who take the same line on Israel as Mr Berman.
I wonder how as a member of Cardiff's Jewish community, Berman can justify meeting the representative of a government where a senior minister threatened the people of Gaza with a Shoah ?(the word in hebrew used exclusively to designate the Nazi holocaust where 4 - 6 million Jews were industrially slaughtered)
"Speaking on Israel Army Radio, Mr Vilnai said if Palestinians increased rocket fire, they will bring upon themselves what he called a "shoah" - a Hebrew word for catastrophe, and for the Nazi Holocaust. The BBC's Katya Adler in Jerusalem says many of Mr Vilnai's colleagues have quickly distanced themselves from his comments and also tried to downplay them saying he did not mean genocide.”
http://news.bbc.co.uk/1/hi/world/middle_east/7270650.stm
Rodney Berman once again repeating his crap that all Jewish people in Wales are in support of Israel,
http://www.totallyjewish.com/news/special_reports/?content_id=9403
"Clearly his view that the meeting should be boycotted is not one that would be understood by the Jewish community in Wales"
Actually, there are many Jewish people who oppose the policies of Israel and don't see it as representing them in anyway, just as their are many non-Jewish people who take the same line on Israel as Mr Berman.
I wonder how as a member of Cardiff's Jewish community, Berman can justify meeting the representative of a government where a senior minister threatened the people of Gaza with a Shoah ?(the word in hebrew used exclusively to designate the Nazi holocaust where 4 - 6 million Jews were industrially slaughtered)
"Speaking on Israel Army Radio, Mr Vilnai said if Palestinians increased rocket fire, they will bring upon themselves what he called a "shoah" - a Hebrew word for catastrophe, and for the Nazi Holocaust. The BBC's Katya Adler in Jerusalem says many of Mr Vilnai's colleagues have quickly distanced themselves from his comments and also tried to downplay them saying he did not mean genocide.”
http://news.bbc.co.uk/1/hi/world/middle_east/7270650.stm
lewislewis
Lumumba Cymru
When will the demonstration against this be publicised?
You volunteering for some fly-posting?
Udo Erasmus
Well-Known Member
It has been advertised around the usual activist networks, but the Palestine Solidarity Campaign in Cardiff has organised it, I assume that they will be sending press releases etc. out.
Personally, I think it would be effective to write to every AM.
Personally, I think it would be effective to write to every AM.
Udo Erasmus
Well-Known Member
Strange, I posted up an ad for the demo on indymedia and they changed without asking:
"Far from being about peace or dialogue, the ambassador, Ron Prosor has made clear his aim is to be a PR man for the state of Israel to undermine the efforts to build a just solution by muddying the waters on what the real situation in the Middle East is."
to,
"The ambassador, Ron Prosor, has made clear the aims of his visit are far from being about peace or dialogue. The state of Israel has a history of PR men actively undermining the efforts to build a just solution by muddying the waters on what the real situation in the Middle East is.
I understand that the second half of original paragraph is interpretation and they may have been concerned about libel, Prosor would claim to support peace and just solutions just like George Bush. But their amended para doesn't improve things if that is their concern, and I think it is a bit off to change the wording of something that someone has written without informing them or posting a note: as the para I didn't write has my name against it!
"Far from being about peace or dialogue, the ambassador, Ron Prosor has made clear his aim is to be a PR man for the state of Israel to undermine the efforts to build a just solution by muddying the waters on what the real situation in the Middle East is."
to,
"The ambassador, Ron Prosor, has made clear the aims of his visit are far from being about peace or dialogue. The state of Israel has a history of PR men actively undermining the efforts to build a just solution by muddying the waters on what the real situation in the Middle East is.
I understand that the second half of original paragraph is interpretation and they may have been concerned about libel, Prosor would claim to support peace and just solutions just like George Bush. But their amended para doesn't improve things if that is their concern, and I think it is a bit off to change the wording of something that someone has written without informing them or posting a note: as the para I didn't write has my name against it!
Udo Erasmus
Well-Known Member
It wasn't Indymedia who changed the wording but rather a national organisation to whom I had sent the "call-out", doesn't bother me that site changed it as it doesn't have my name as an author. I just copied and pasted from that site onto the Indymedia without noticing the alteration.
The phrase, "PR man" is one used by Prosor himself, he has spoken of the need to get down into British society and speak to as many different organisations and sections of society as possible to build support for Israel, for example, he recently met with Alex Fergusson and professional footballers, he visits schools and universities, meets with trade unions etc.
while he would deny the rest, it obviously is subjective and hinges upon what do you consider a "just solution" to be? Prosor's vision of a just solution is not consistent with international law, or the view of the United Nations as articulated through resolutions, for example. More importantly Prosor's vision of a just solution is not just nor will it bring peace.
In interviews he makes kitsch references to "peace", "moderates" etc. But he is very clear that he regards Israel as being the victim, and that Palestinians have declared war on Israel, and also states that Israel basically has the right to do whatsoever it likes to defend it's citizens, but as Professor Noam Chomsky said "someone who is occupying someone elses land cannot claim to be acting in self-defence"
Prosor's aim is to muddy the waters on Israel's human rights abuses and deflect attention away from them, he also wants to promote a narrative in which Israel is the victim of agression rather than the perpetrator.
The phrase, "PR man" is one used by Prosor himself, he has spoken of the need to get down into British society and speak to as many different organisations and sections of society as possible to build support for Israel, for example, he recently met with Alex Fergusson and professional footballers, he visits schools and universities, meets with trade unions etc.
while he would deny the rest, it obviously is subjective and hinges upon what do you consider a "just solution" to be? Prosor's vision of a just solution is not consistent with international law, or the view of the United Nations as articulated through resolutions, for example. More importantly Prosor's vision of a just solution is not just nor will it bring peace.
In interviews he makes kitsch references to "peace", "moderates" etc. But he is very clear that he regards Israel as being the victim, and that Palestinians have declared war on Israel, and also states that Israel basically has the right to do whatsoever it likes to defend it's citizens, but as Professor Noam Chomsky said "someone who is occupying someone elses land cannot claim to be acting in self-defence"
Prosor's aim is to muddy the waters on Israel's human rights abuses and deflect attention away from them, he also wants to promote a narrative in which Israel is the victim of agression rather than the perpetrator.
Udo Erasmus
Well-Known Member
Gavin Bl
terrible awful baaad
Why are you telling me like I can do anything about it? You got your announcement. Let it go, mun, like a dog with a bone.
Udo Erasmus
Well-Known Member
You implied I was pushing it, I was just explaining that I felt my phrasing was well chosen and justified.
Udo Erasmus
Well-Known Member
yeah I did, just spare us the lecture every single time, eh?
Well, don't imply that I make rash statements then. What I said was entirely appropriate and concise snapshot of Ron Prosor.
lewislewis
Lumumba Cymru
I actually don't have a facebook, believe it or not. Even Dave Cameron does, apparently.
Gavin Bl
terrible awful baaad
that's too funny.
lewislewis
Lumumba Cymru
Can somebody tell me where the 'Welsh Assmebly' is, vis the Respect-Left List website?
Udo Erasmus
Well-Known Member
Do nationalists never make typo's?
lewislewis
Lumumba Cymru
Nevre ever. But in case we do- we proof read our website before clicking the 'save' button. ; )
