ViolentPanda
Hardly getting over it.
They were traumatised at an early age by witnessing an arson attack on their local boozer, innit?
South London mob attack cops after 15yr old told to pick up litter
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They were traumatised at an early age by witnessing an arson attack on their local boozer, innit?
Listening to this story on PM, with eyewitness accounts.
The girl was told to pick up the litter, she did and droped it again in front of them. A friend of hers got aggressive and then lots of others bundled in and it all kicked off.
Three different witnesses spoke about the crowd advancing on the policemen, who kept telling the crowd to stay back.
When the crowd continued to advance, apparently one policeman got out his night stick and some spray (CS?) and the other got on the radio.
The two police were bruised and one was bitten.
Reinforcements were on the scene in 2 minutes - the police turned up in vans with sticks out.
Just heard a girl say if the backup police hadnt turned up- the situation 'could have gone another way.'
Ive seen things kick off in Croydon several times before with 50-60 kids steaming through the high street fighting. This sounds another order of magnitude altogether.
The girl was told to pick up the litter, she did and droped it again in front of them. A friend of hers got aggressive and then lots of others bundled in and it all kicked off.
Three different witnesses spoke about the crowd advancing on the policemen, who kept telling the crowd to stay back.
When the crowd continued to advance, apparently one policeman got out his night stick and some spray (CS?) and the other got on the radio.
The two police were bruised and one was bitten.
Reinforcements were on the scene in 2 minutes - the police turned up in vans with sticks out.
Just heard a girl say if the backup police hadnt turned up- the situation 'could have gone another way.'
Ive seen things kick off in Croydon several times before with 50-60 kids steaming through the high street fighting. This sounds another order of magnitude altogether.
FridgeMagnet
Administrator
They were saying that all day - they carefully avoided mentioning the ages of the two men arrested. You can see how this is being spun....
agricola
a genuine importer of owls
This does happen from time to time - its happened to me once in the West End (admittedly with drunken twats rather than chavs, and I didnt get a kicking), it even happened to a FIT team who the NF/BNP took objection to in Covent Garden (albeit the NF didnt realise there was a horde of TSG and other officers about 50 metres away 
), and I seem to recall a thread around 2002 here where it happened to a female PC in Brixton.
I would imagine this would all be on CCTV though, North End is fairly well covered and so arrests will no doubt follow once the guilty people are recognized.
), and I seem to recall a thread around 2002 here where it happened to a female PC in Brixton. I would imagine this would all be on CCTV though, North End is fairly well covered and so arrests will no doubt follow once the guilty people are recognized.
JHE
.
The colour of chavvery?
You're quite a chavologist, PK!
'Chav' means white plebeian youth or delinquent white plebeian youth, doesn't it?
I ask because I've just read in The Times: "All members of the gang were described as black."
(BTW, one of the police officers was white and the other was black.)
If anyone here had assumed that the yobs were black and posted repeatedly against 'rude boys' - or rather 'rude boys and girls' - that would be thought presumptious and racist.
I think your assumption that the yobs were 'chavs' is just as unreasonable - unless of course you are going to claim with a straight face that the term 'chav' can equally refer to white, black and other people.
If you do claim that, I won't be able to disprove that's how you in particular choose to use the term, but please don't try to kid us that that is how it is generally used.
Typical Croydon chav scum at their best.
If 30 people put the boot in then how come only two were charged?
Shame it wasn't a fight with these guys...
You're quite a chavologist, PK!
'Chav' means white plebeian youth or delinquent white plebeian youth, doesn't it?
I ask because I've just read in The Times: "All members of the gang were described as black."
(BTW, one of the police officers was white and the other was black.)
If anyone here had assumed that the yobs were black and posted repeatedly against 'rude boys' - or rather 'rude boys and girls' - that would be thought presumptious and racist.
I think your assumption that the yobs were 'chavs' is just as unreasonable - unless of course you are going to claim with a straight face that the term 'chav' can equally refer to white, black and other people.
If you do claim that, I won't be able to disprove that's how you in particular choose to use the term, but please don't try to kid us that that is how it is generally used.
JHE
.
My only use of the word 'gang' is in the quotation from The Times. It is perfectly obvious that the word refers to the group who attacked the police. (I don't think there is any suggestion that the 30 people usually form any sort of pre-existing organised gang.)
Personally, I call them 'yobs' or 'thugs', but there's nothing wrong with calling them various other things. I've nothing against the use of the word 'gang' here - nor anything against the use of 'mob' in the thread title. Have you?
What do you think of PK's attribution of the thuggery to 'chavs'?
Probably a combination of (a) exaggeration (there weren't actually 30 directly involved at all); (b) minimal involvement (of those actually taking a direct role, some/many would have been guilty of no more than a bit of low-level pushing, shoving and shouting) and (c) a lack of evidence immediately available / officers immediately available to make multiple arrests (as I suspect the majority would leg it as soon as assistance turned up).
There will probably be a review of CCTV and other evidence, with a view to identifying and arresting any main culprits, responsible for significant criminal offences. There will not, however, be a massive reactive investigation to trace people who will only ever be convicted on trivial public disorder / common assault level offences - it simply is not worth the resources.
(This approach is nothing new, by the way. It has ben thus for donkeys years - in fact, there is probably MORE chance of some more serious offenders being traced and arrested subsequently now that there was previously, not least as CCTV provides good identification evidence that did not exist then).
Maybe ... but there is absolutely no reason that there would have to be. Any sort of challenge, no matter that there is not actually any penalty intended to it, is perceived as "disrespect" by large swathes of the population now. They will kick off over anything (see the post about the bus - you must have seen that loads of times), you see it on Police, Camera, Action type programmes all the time.
No, they aren't. No, it isn't. And no, they're not.
There are certainly some who fail to recognise their responsibility to break the aggression cycle, no matter how provoked they are ... but there is absolutely no reason to suspect that that must have happened here as the response happens regardess of the attitude of the officers.
pk
drink flounce rinse repeat
In my extensive experience of dealing with cops, in both a polite and confrontational context, is that most of them are dickheads.
As for the dickhead:nice person ratio, I'd put it at about 7 in 10. Feel sorry for the remaining 3 in 10 who are decent people, but that's how it is.
Just as well he moved to Dorset, to be honest. Clearly he was provoking these responses by the way he dealt with them, poor lickle victimised darlings. We're better off without him. God help Dorset ...Yup thats the sort of shit my dad had to put up with on a daily basis, being spat at and all sorts, thank fuck he moved to Dorset
... according to some of the posters on here, anyway ...
Tell me about it ... I was at the centre of it a number of times when I was trying to arrest the fucking drug dealers the "community" kept moaning that we didn't arrest enough of ...
JHE
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You don't think that telling the girl to pick up the litter was provocation enough?
agricola
a genuine importer of owls
that would probably be during the kickoff
Its PK innit! Force of nature. law unto himself etc etc ...
I may be wrong about that. Actually I didnt read it as him dissembling or attempting to mislead- I saw it as his word for young scrotes in general- with no intention of indicating race or colour in this specific instance.
Its not a word I would have used it myself. Its was you objecting to chav but using 'gang' that jarred with me.
'Chav' and 'gang' are both loaded and serve as political shorthand to label and stigmatise specific groups of young people.
Call any group of kids a 'gang' and suddenly people are nodding and they know who you’re talking about.
snadge
metal alchemist
nope before according to BBC scotland.
According to eye witness on Radio4 it was to stave off the kick off/ imminent beat down.
Do you think appeasing violent morons is the way forward then?
snadge
metal alchemist
what, the coppers, I agree, keep out of their way is what I say, keep off the radar.
JHE
.
No, nor did I. I think he believed what he had simply imagined.
I'd like to read his response - but, anyway, do you - or does anyone here - think 'chav' is not racially-coded?
untethered
For industry & decency
It'd be nice for a "mob" to come to the assistance of the police once in a while.
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