Pickman's model
sunset spires and twilight woods
even if he'd only whimpered like a mewling child or squealed like a pig.
sir craig mackey: and other craven cops
- Thread starter Pickman's model
- Start date
agricola
a genuine importer of owls
Well of course it does, but then it is designed to. Now everyone is talking about Mackey rather than who made (and why) the decision to switch from armed officers being on fixed points at Parliament to them being on patrol.
bellaozzydog
rolling turds in glitter
The tactical details, unless driven by budget cuts are fairly bullet proof. You can’t plan the perfect reaction/response to a constantly mutating threat. Things aren’t “wrong”, rather lessons are learned and new responses developed. It’s like screaming at the firemen at Grenfell for making on the ground, critical decisions within their current “playbook” while facing an extraordinary event
Anyways. Many take the wage to “protect” society, we complain when they don’t step up, it’s unfortunate that the ones that get stuck in are also the ones tasering disabled grannies in the face and pepper spraying teens
Pickman's model
sunset spires and twilight woods
Yeh but then it can be maybe, 6' wide and not the 5,280' he deserves
Wilf
Slouching towards Billingham
'I followed protocol for senior officers facing a threat, I followed protocol for senior officers facing a threat, I followed protocol for senior officers facing a threat - DAMMIT, I FOLLOWED PROTOCOL!'
agricola
a genuine importer of owls
That isn't what I meant. If the decision to move those officers was made because of a tactical assessment or for some operational reason, fine (as long as the rationale is debated honestly). If it was made on the ground of some other reason like the aesthetics then it isn't.
bellaozzydog
rolling turds in glitter
Fair one, I misinterpreted your post
Wilf
Slouching towards Billingham
When you look through the detail of what he told the inquest:
Acting Met chief 'witnessed Westminster attack from inside car'
he makes it clear he was going off what one of the PCs said about locking the door. Even if the advice from the PC was right in terms of approved practice, it's fucking cowardly hiding behind a junior's decision and trying to manoeuvre that PC into the limelight. Also, it wasn't just about the attack on the copper, the cunt with the knife could have gone on to murder several more.
Acting Met chief 'witnessed Westminster attack from inside car'
he makes it clear he was going off what one of the PCs said about locking the door. Even if the advice from the PC was right in terms of approved practice, it's fucking cowardly hiding behind a junior's decision and trying to manoeuvre that PC into the limelight. Also, it wasn't just about the attack on the copper, the cunt with the knife could have gone on to murder several more.
kebabking
Not a Girly Swot, but I like them....
Including, for example, the most senior Police Officer in the lead counter-terrorism agency.
The attacker could have been wearing a suicide vest, his target might have been the Mets' senior command in order to paralyze it's ability to respond to another, much larger, much more elaborate attack - a scenario that is well established in counter-terrorism planning, and an idea well established in terrorist doctrine.
His job was to stay alive in order to command the Met response, and if that means leaving others to do their jobs then so be it - it might not look good, but he's not paid to look good, he's paid to command the Mets' counter-terrorism response to, potentially, a large, geographically spread attack.
The very obvious example of the senior officer getting stuck in was at Goose-Green in the Falklands: 2PARA were a bit bogged down, their CO led a section attack against a machine gun post in order to re-establish momentum, and he was killed. The battalions command and fire-support apparatus was paralyzed for a while and it took casualties it should not have taken while a new command was established.
Lt Col Jones richly earned his VC, but leading section attacks was not his job, and the battle, and his battalion, suffered as a result of him being killed instead of running the battle and using the assets given to him.
If Mackey had got involved, been killed/injured, and then a much larger terrorist attack taken place - the response to which would be more confused as command of it was interrupted - he would be slated for playing the role of a PC, not a Commissioner of the Met.
Bahnhof Strasse
Let's av ya fuckin' dancin'!
bellaozzydog
rolling turds in glitter
Have you got any credible sources for that detail
Not disagreeing, just can’tremember reading anything “from the horses mouth” to support that position.
Bahnhof Strasse
Let's av ya fuckin' dancin'!
Of course 'H' should have been shot, all old Etonians need to be shot. Country would be in a much better state if they were all gunned down.
Pickman's model
sunset spires and twilight woods
Pickman's model
sunset spires and twilight woods
or on their last, after their parents have shelled out years of massive fees.
Wilf
Slouching towards Billingham
Well, he's trying to hide behind that logic, suggesting his first reaction was to get stuck in, almost a case of 'hold me back, hold me back'. He says he was about to get out of the car until:
Essentially, that he wasn't aware of the stuff you mention, had to be reminded. Hmmm... But most of all its about whether you step up when one of your mates is facing danger. He didn't.
bellaozzydog
rolling turds in glitter
I’m looking for specifics. The Chris Keeble take over was apparently dynamic, smooth (trained for)and i’ve not seen him or any other paras suggesting a paralysis of command
As for fire support apparatus i’m Not sure what you mean, external support units? ie artillery. Or his support company (who anecdotally offered fire support but were told to fuck of by Jones)
While having a Sunray down moment isn’t an everyday occurrence a military unit isn’t just one man everyone trains up.
Apologies i’m being very picky about specifics
I still agree he shouldn’t have been leaping around
There is analysis that his death and the transfer from a system of tactical command known as 'restrictive control' to the alternative 'directive command' actually improved the situation
A good book to read if you want to get balls deep in military doctrine debate is
https://www.amazon.co.uk/Not-Mentioned-Despatches-History-Mythology/dp/0718830164
Anyways back on topic ACAB
likesfish
You can't park here sir
The blokes clearly laid off the Phys and does not do MMA or anything like it so his ability to do anything useful and frankly he's more useful alive than becoming a casualty I'd have tried something and achieved nothing unless the stabbing bastard was looking the wrong way then meet very heavy padlock attached to a chain 
Spymaster
Plastic Paddy
Bloke did exactly what he should’ve done.
Anyone who thinks the fat old fart should’ve jumped out and tackled the cunt with two big knives and possible explosives, whilst unarmed and knowing armed plod will be arriving shortly, and having been told to bugger off by his protection officer, is a twat.
Anyone who thinks the fat old fart should’ve jumped out and tackled the cunt with two big knives and possible explosives, whilst unarmed and knowing armed plod will be arriving shortly, and having been told to bugger off by his protection officer, is a twat.
Last edited:
Pickman's model
sunset spires and twilight woods
Soz where are you getting this protection officer from?
Pickman's model
sunset spires and twilight woods
Soz where are you getting this protection officer bit from?
Pickman's model
sunset spires and twilight woods
Spymaster
Plastic Paddy
It's still the correct advice. The choice was to stop the car and put himself and everyone in it at risk, or to do his actual job and get away to command the response while allowing properly trained and equipped firearms plod, who were a few seconds away, to do theirs. The comparisons with Lt Col Jones are apt. He was very heavily criticised for his action at Goose Green. No doubt those who are now suggesting that Mackey should've committed suicide at the PoW are the same people who'd be pillorying him had he done so.
Last edited:
cupid_stunt
Thank you for your attention to this matter!
They did, the problem, for some, is that he didn't get out.
Bahnhof Strasse
Let's av ya fuckin' dancin'!
He shouldn’t be a fat old fart though, there are ongoing standards of fitness to be met if you wanna be a filth, if this yellow bellied streak of piss is not fit for the job he should fuck off and do something else.
The real reason he stood by and did nothing whilst his ‘colleague’ was butchered before his eyes is that PC Palmer wasn’t a colleague at all, he was a minion in the eyes of this cunty-chops boss.
Similar threads
