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Sinead O'Connor

danny la rouge

Raddled old poet
Interesting that she is equating race (skin colour) and faith. "white people" "if that's what non-muslims are called".

I know she has her daemons, and I wish her health, but those words, those concepts, from a person with her reach, are, to put it charitably, deeply unhelpful.
 

Lupa

Well-Known Member

Lupa

Well-Known Member
Interesting that she is equating race (skin colour) and faith. "white people" "if that's what non-muslims are called".

I know she has her daemons, and I wish her health, but those words, those concepts, from a person with her reach, are, to put it charitably, deeply unhelpful.

Context matters. See previous post. People targetted her for becoming muslim
 

danny la rouge

Raddled old poet
Context matters. See previous post. People targetted her for becoming muslim
Sure, but the response to that is “don’t be bigoted”, not “here’s some bigotry of my own”.

I like her. I empathise with her issues. I hope she finds peace and happiness. But these words were not skilful. It’s not helpful to excuse them, whatever they are a response to.
 

danny la rouge

Raddled old poet
The above went into justifying the content, not just excusing it.
The article does indeed try to justify.

And it’s worth saying that her words might well be an angry response to the shit she’s been showered with. And I also condemn that shit. Over the decades she’s been vilified personally, in misogynist ways, as well as anti-Muslim bigotry. Nobody deserves that. But that does not mean her words, their meaning, their effect, are acceptable.
 

butchersapron

blood on the walls
The article does indeed try to justify.

And it’s worth saying that her words might well be an angry response to the shit she’s been showered with. And I also condemn that shit. Over the decades she’s been vilified personally, in misogynist ways, as well as anti-Muslim bigotry. Nobody deserves that. But that does not mean her words, their meaning, their effect, are acceptable.
No i meant lupa's post here
 

danny la rouge

Raddled old poet
No i meant lupa's post here
Oh Jesus. Lupa , sorry, that’s nonsense. We all love Sinead here, but that’s not a good argument. Stick to having empathy for her issues, the abuse she’s showered with, and so on. But it’s possible to deplore both what she’s received as well as what she’s said. (And there’s no need to attempt equivalence or anything else).
 

danny la rouge

Raddled old poet
So you responded to that with:

white men have fucked up the world. Do you think otherwise?
Who has more power, an unemployed white man in Ballymun, or someone like Rosalind Brewer?

The people with the power to fuck up the world are the captains of capital, whatever their gender, sexuality or colour.
 

Lupa

Well-Known Member
So you responded to that with:



Who has more power, an unemployed white man in Ballymun, or someone like Rosalind Brewer?

The people with the power to fuck up the world are the captains of capital, whatever their gender, sexuality or colour.
Obviously Joe Soap has no power.....at all. This doesn't stop some from being prejudicial or racist or islamophobes.
 

danny la rouge

Raddled old poet
Obviously Joe Soap has no power.....at all.
So the description of the people who ‘fuck up the world’ that you used earlier was cast too wide. A better description would be “the ruling class”.

For example, the people the protestors in Hong Kong are opposing are not white men. Carrie Lam, the chief official, is neither white nor a man.

This is why class matters as an analysis of power. It is about structure.
 
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