Simon A Free Mann: But Where's Mark Thatcher?

[likesfish]

Bollocks. How would replacing a black crook with a white crook be any improvement?

Next time you're round at the NAAFI, why not buy yourself a clue?

ah but freddies forysth blue print is you don't put a white or black crook in charge you put a relativly non corrupt black populist in charge. The important step that most of these mercenaries forget.
Hence you still get your oil/mineral at relativly favored rates but you look good on the world stage.

 

[likesfish]

frankly it would be harder to be much worse

he inheritate empty treasury and a population that had dropped to a third of its 1968 level, with about 50% of the former 1.2 million inhabitants having moved either to Spain or to neighboring African countries, or being murdered during the dictatorship of Obiang's predecessor. He formally assumed presidency in October 1979.
n July 2003, state-operated radio declared Obiang to be a god who is "in permanent contact with the Almighty" and "can decide to kill without anyone calling him to account and without going to hell. be taking lessons from blair and bush

 

[nick h.]

*rubs hands excitedly*

this could be good

I don't suppose William Hill would dare to get in on the action, but somebody's got to. 33 to 1 on Scratcher dying in mysterious circumstances by the end of 2010. Maximum stake £5. Any takers?

 

[phildwyer]

I don't suppose William Hill would dare to get in on the action, but somebody's got to. 33 to 1 on Scratcher dying in mysterious circumstances by the end of 2010. Maximum stake £5. Any takers?

I'll have a fiver on that.

 

[nick h.]

You're on. I'll also pay out for murder or manslaughter or any other cause of death which trumps 'mysterious circs', including suicide.

 

[butchersapron]

The pillow approacheth

 

[nick h.]

Stakes by Paypal please, to nef1150 at hotmail.com

 

[phildwyer]

Stakes by Paypal please, to nef1150 at hotmail.com

Oh, you want the money upfront? But how do I know you won't abscond to Equatorial Guinea?

 

[nick h.]

Of course I want the money up front - I'm a bookmaker! Not sure I fancy Equatorial Guinea though. I'll join Matt Crawford in Costa Rica. I'm sure your £5 will set me up in style.

 

[JHE]

Mann has been quoted as saying that he is keen for Calil and Thatcher to 'face justice'.

Does Mann feel very let down by Thatcher and the other top plotters? Was he betrayed by Thatcher and Co? Was there anything more that Thatcher and Co could have done to help Mann and get him out earlier?

Or is Mann just bitter and fed up with them because they were able to get away with it while Mann has spent more than five years in Zimbabwean and Equatorial Guinean prisons?

One other possibility: Mr Obiang, fed up with Thatcher and Co getting away with it, done a deal with Mann, by which Mann is freed in exchange for a promise that Mann will help bring Thatcher and Co to trial, and Mann intends at least to appear to keep to the deal.

 

[phildwyer]

Mann has been quoted as saying that he is keen for Calil and Thatcher to 'face justice'.

Does Mann feel very let down by Thatcher and the other top plotters? Was he betrayed by Thatcher and Co? Was there anything more that Thatcher and Co could have done to help Mann and get him out earlier?

Or is Mann just bitter and fed up with them because they were able to get away with it while Mann has spent more than five years in Zimbabwean and Equatorial Guinean prisons?

One other possibility: Mr Obiang, fed up with Thatcher and Co getting away with it, done a deal with Mann, by which Mann is freed in exchange for a promise that Mann will help bring Thatcher and Co to trial, and Mann intends at least to appear to keep to the deal.

Sounds plausible.

The accounts I've read say that Thatcher abandoned Mann when he was arrested. One of Mann's friends called him to ask for bribe money, and Thatcher replied "fuck off," allegedly.

 

[Errol's son]

http://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/wor...us-for-Sir-Mark-Thatcher-to-face-justice.html

This article seems to conclude that the Equata-guineans believe Mann will be keen to assist UK law enforecement agencies to implicate Thatcher etc.

But who are the "one or two others" aside from Thatcher and Calil that Mann wants to face justice?

Who are your prime suspects?

Greg Wales?
J Archer?
Severo Moto?
David Tremain?
Nigel Morgan?
Tony Buckingham?

According to the link below, Wales is one - so who is the potential other...??? (If I remember correctly, Wales pretty much implicated himself in the book "The Wonga Coup" by giving an interview to the author over a few bottles of wine).

http://www.independent.co.uk/news/w...naire-who-seems-to-know-everybody-557949.html

I secretly hope Archer gets dragged back in to all this.

 

[not-bono-ever]

Sounds plausible.

The accounts I've read say that Thatcher abandoned Mann when he was arrested. One of Mann's friends called him to ask for bribe money, and Thatcher replied "fuck off," allegedly.

"Sir Mark released a statement which read: "I am delighted that Simon will be reunited with his family at last."

See , Ole Scratcher is a nice man after all

 

[likesfish]

thatcher and archer ofed it mysterious car crashes yes yes yes

 

[Pie 1]

Nice

http://www.guardian.co.uk/commentisfree/2009/nov/06/await-joy-simon-singing-canary

 

[Meltingpot]

ah but freddies forysth blue print is you don't put a white or black crook in charge you put a relativly non corrupt black populist in charge. The important step that most of these mercenaries forget.
Hence you still get your oil/mineral at relativly favored rates but you look good on the world stage.

If you mean "Dogs of War", the twist was that yes, there was a black populist in charge but Endean and co. didn't get their platinum at favoured rates - they had to pay a market price (if it was sold to them at all) because the new regime didn't regard it as a priority. The Russians were also refused permission to enter port.

 

[sleaterkinney]

Nice

http://www.guardian.co.uk/commentisfree/2009/nov/06/await-joy-simon-singing-canary

They'll be waiting a long time, I reckon his promises of spilling all are just to detract from his role in the whole thing.

 

[Errol's son]

So President Obiang is a forgiving type after all. The man who tried to kill him is free after just one year in jail. "Humanitarian grounds" yeah right. What murky deal was done, one wonders, and did it involve the Thatcher boy?

http://www.guardian.co.uk/world/2009/nov/02/simon-mann-pardoned-equatorial-guinea

Apparaently all that was needed was a splodge on Mann's wonga.

http://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/worldnews/africaandindianocean/equatorialguinea/6630198/Simon-Mann-bribed-his-way-out-of-jail-claims-co-conspirator-Nick-du-Toit.html

 

[t0bytoo]

Mark Thatcher seen on Friday in a harley street (nearby) dental practise.
I got a text "Mark Thatcher's just walked in"
"Arrest him" I replied.
She didn't. She reckoned he was incredibly charming and flirty to the women. Ignored the men.

 

[weltweit]

Saw an interesting programme tonight on Simon Mann.

Filmed mainly while he was incarcerated afaikt he seemed to have it in for his former backers, partly because they had done nothing for the men involved in the attempted coup.

No filming since his release. Wonder what he is up to.

Lot of backstory on the oil riches of Equatorial Guinea and how the winners seem to be the Chinese who are now best friends of Obiang and are building him a new city.

 

[temper_tantrum]

I thought it was an excellent and really fascinating programme.
Makes you wonder what goes on behind the scenes when coups DO actually come off.

 

[teuchter]

I watched that too. Interesting stuff.

 

[likesfish]

If you mean "Dogs of War", the twist was that yes, there was a black populist in charge but Endean and co. didn't get their platinum at favoured rates - they had to pay a market price (if it was sold to them at all) because the new regime didn't regard it as a priority. The Russians were also refused permission to enter port.

sorry I forget remembering freddie going on that none of the various mercenary types who have tried to use dogs of war as a manual for pulling off a coup remember the plan.

 

[Idris2002]

ah but freddies forysth blue print is you don't put a white or black crook in charge you put a relativly non corrupt black populist in charge. The important step that most of these mercenaries forget.
Hence you still get your oil/mineral at relativly favored rates but you look good on the world stage.

I see what you're saying, but the problem there is that even the most populist of black leaders would be corrupted by the fact that he (and it's usually a 'he') owes his position to mercs.

 

[likesfish]

in the orginal book the leader was some african version of " bonnie prince charlie " except with brains most of the military force were his men.
the white mercs providing fire support and weapons to get them to the state.
large part of the population were his tribe.

 

[Belushi]

in the orginal book the leader was some african version of " bonnie prince charlie " except with brains most of the military force were his men

Wasn't he based on the Biafran leader, who Forsyth comes across as having a great deal of regard for.

 

[IMR]

One other possibility: Mr Obiang, fed up with Thatcher and Co getting away with it, done a deal with Mann, by which Mann is freed in exchange for a promise that Mann will help bring Thatcher and Co to trial, and Mann intends at least to appear to keep to the deal.

But how would Obiang enforce the deal once Mann had got out of jail and left the country?

 

[weltweit]

I thought Mann looked very gaunt and weak in the programme, he looked like a frail old man, not at all like someone who used to be in the SAS.

 

[Idris2002]

Wasn't he based on the Biafran leader, who Forsyth comes across as having a great deal of regard for.

Forsyth wrote a pretty good non-fiction book on Biafra, which I've got somewhere (years since I read it mind). So maybe he did know whereof he wrote.

Thing about the Biafra war was,though, that a) there was no way Biafra was going to be allowed to secede as it's where most of Nigeria's oil was (and none of the great powers, UK, US and USSR wanted Nigeria broken up) and b) the Biafran leadership had blots on their own copybook: it was in Biafra that the first TV images of starving African children were taken and the leadership were actually quite happy about that, as they thought this would help their cause internationally.

 

[JHE]

But how would Obiang enforce the deal once Mann had got out of jail and left the country?

He couldn't. It would be a 'gentleman's agreement', though I'm not convinced either is gentle. One is a brute and the other a dodgy military adventurer.

If Mann really resents 'Scratcher' a lot (and I don't really know what his attitude is), he has has his own reason for keeping any such promise he may have made President Obiang.