cockneyrebel
New Member
Don't bother levien. tbaldwin is a rabid right-winger who bangs on and on about liberal racists 24 hours a day....
Should Rushdie be killed.
- Thread starter tbaldwin
- Start date
tangentlama
Nameless voices crying
belboid said:
Yeah, right. And I'm the Queen of Sheba.
This thread - with tbaldwin's old news and tired prejudices, is in danger of preventing discussion on more pressing matters, such as the way Muslims are currently being bashed by the media.
http://www.urban75.net/vbulletin/showthread.php?t=127784&page=2
cockneyrebel said:
rabid right winger who believes in..
A massive redistribution of wealth and power.....
Abolition of the monarchy.....
Increasing Inheritance tax.....
More money for Schools and Hospitals.....
Renationalising "Public Transport"
Reparations to Developing Nations....
Fighting Racism and Fascism.....
Smashing the CJS.......
Udo Erasmus
Well-Known Member
Salman Rushdie on the MCB:
http://www.timesonline.co.uk/article/0,,1072-1729998,00.html
http://www.timesonline.co.uk/article/0,,1072-1729998,00.html
bolshiebhoy
socialism leinster drink
What a truely awful article. It manages to repeat all the worst attacks from the right albeit wrapped in liberal language. After a sop to the notion that not all muslims are reactionary tossers he says:Udo Erasmus said:
Islam as exceptionally backward again. In need of a reformation no less, feudal religion that it is! At odds with the Christian cultures (which have had their Reformations ta very much and don't need the same treatment apparently) among which it finds itself. What a pile of horseshit. There are reactionary trends among muslims just as there are among the 'host' Christian cultures in the west. How different exactly are the 'stifling seminaries' of Islam to the thought police of Pope Ratzo's outfit? Has it escaped Rushdie that the reformation seems to have taken several large steps backward in the most advanced capitalist country, the US, where getting on for a majority of waspish Christians believe in Creationism and buy books predicting Armageddon in ther Middle East as if the bible is literally true?
Singling out Islam as in need of reform in this way in order to prevent muslims being 'add odds' with Christian societies in the West is doing the Islamophobes' and warmongers job for them.
sevenstars
citizen army
bolshiebhoy said:
bolshiebhoy said:
If you believe the crap you've just written, your certainly no leninist
. you seem to think islam/muslims are beyond critism, Rushdie is spot on if your 'critic' is correct.Your a (cheap) oppontunist piece of shit. If you think such head in the sand attitude is going to stop a move to the right, your sadly mistaken, its going to incourage it.
Take your line down town/the pub and see what short shrift to gets from the working class.its not a runner.
bollocks. The idea that all religions are much of a muchness and rightwing christatians are just as reactionary as right wing muslims is common curreny in many pubs and with many working class people. Theonly person dumping horse shit on this thread (tbaldwin aside) is you.
so in other words, you dont have an arguement, that can be taken out off your pinko circle. without being laughted out of court.levien said:
your a wanker.
bolshiebhoy
socialism leinster drink
Do you really think calling people wankers and pieces of shit makes you more working class? In my local there aren't many pinkos (me aside) and we argue about race/terror/religion over a beer or twenty most weekends. And if we had to listen to the sort of ignorant abuse you casually throw about online we'd all put aside our differences to help fuck you out of the pub.
Paul Marsh
NeitherWashingtonNorMecca
Belushi said:
If I asked Bookmarks to order me a copy of Satanic verses would they do so?
Donna Ferentes
jubliado
Why not ask them?
starfish2000
Well-Known Member
If you have to threaten to kill someone because they question your beliefs then your beliefs are built on nothing but illusion.
Personally I think a fair chunk of people in this country have chosen to isolate themselves & don't want to participate in our society. I think thats an uncomfortable truth rather than right wing propoganda.
Personally I think a fair chunk of people in this country have chosen to isolate themselves & don't want to participate in our society. I think thats an uncomfortable truth rather than right wing propoganda.
sevenstars
citizen army
March 1989, Socialist Review (SWP) review of Satanic Verses concludes
"If Rusdie has attacked fundametalist religion, he has done so in the interests of human liberation, not in order to impose some other form of bigotry...By defending the contents of The Satanic Verses, socialists can show how they first and foremost oppose racism and imperialism- while pointing out that fundametalism only continues to bind the oppressed to the oppressor"
"If Rusdie has attacked fundametalist religion, he has done so in the interests of human liberation, not in order to impose some other form of bigotry...By defending the contents of The Satanic Verses, socialists can show how they first and foremost oppose racism and imperialism- while pointing out that fundametalism only continues to bind the oppressed to the oppressor"
butchersapron
Bring back hanging
That's interesting - the content not the right to write and publish what you like. This latter would go without saying, but that they choose the content to stand on...sevenstars said:
sevenstars
citizen army
R.I.C.O. said:
I dont see why not but only SWP comrades can answer that one, it would be helpful if one of them does.
Though the current anti-islamic onslaught from the right seems like the main danger at the moment, at some point they are going to have to differentaite themselves from the mosques on another big political question or other. Their more experienced members I would expect to understand this
exosculate
a stagger with a beat
pants
levien and bolshiebhoy you both appear to think you don't have to have a covincing arguement and any one who disagrees with you is ignorant working class scum 'Islamophobes' or some such cobblers. i hate to see what your idea of the dicatorship of the proletrait is like, you don't believe with engaging with the proletrait.
Your line flies in the face of leninism(not that im a leninist ,but it does illistrate what oppotunist cretins you are).As for me calling you pieces of shit and wankers, I was being over polite to you.
Your line flies in the face of leninism(not that im a leninist ,but it does illistrate what oppotunist cretins you are).As for me calling you pieces of shit and wankers, I was being over polite to you.
bolshiebhoy
socialism leinster drink
What are you on about you idiot? How can you draw that conclusion from what either of us said? Most of the people I work, live and socialise with share the media's picture of Islam. I argue with them all the time but I manage to do it without calling them 'ignorant working class scum'. Funnily enough if I did they wouldn't still be talking to me. I've found a bit of mutual respect goes a long way talking to people who are miles away from me politically. Your pub chats must be very short if you carry on the way you do on here.
Where this started was Rushdie's singling out Islam as in need of a Reformation to fit into Western Christian society. That is an idea that people I meet echo all the time, albeit in very different terms. 'How dare they come here and tell us our women are sluts if they don't wear a veil!' and the likes. The point is of course that Christianity is full of reactionary tossers every bit as anti-gay and anti-woman as some sections of the Muslim community. The right wing media don't wage war on the nutters in the Vatican or Evangelical Christians. Why? Because the attack on Islam isn't about defending liberal values it's about defending the 'war on terror', the occupation of Iraq, poor little Israel, the list goes on.
And Rushdie's article helps put those of us swimming against that tide on the back foot. Which is a shame because it's quite obvious that socialists share all the things he says in the article about needing to look at the birth of Islam in it's historical context and seeing the class interests it served and how that has evolved. But he ruins it all by letting the suppposedly liberal and 'post-Reformation' West off the hook.
Where this started was Rushdie's singling out Islam as in need of a Reformation to fit into Western Christian society. That is an idea that people I meet echo all the time, albeit in very different terms. 'How dare they come here and tell us our women are sluts if they don't wear a veil!' and the likes. The point is of course that Christianity is full of reactionary tossers every bit as anti-gay and anti-woman as some sections of the Muslim community. The right wing media don't wage war on the nutters in the Vatican or Evangelical Christians. Why? Because the attack on Islam isn't about defending liberal values it's about defending the 'war on terror', the occupation of Iraq, poor little Israel, the list goes on.
And Rushdie's article helps put those of us swimming against that tide on the back foot. Which is a shame because it's quite obvious that socialists share all the things he says in the article about needing to look at the birth of Islam in it's historical context and seeing the class interests it served and how that has evolved. But he ruins it all by letting the suppposedly liberal and 'post-Reformation' West off the hook.
Pickman's model
sunset spires and twilight woods
imo rushdie should have been condemn'd to death less for the alleg'd blasphemy in his "satanick verses" than for the utter crapness of the novel.
belboid
Exasperated, not angry.
gee thats original! what a wit!Pickman's model said:
were Rushdie to be killed for his literary 'crapness', one dreads to imagine what would have to happen to you for any punsihment to be commensurate. 'twould have to be one of those utterly ludicrous, slow, and deeply painful, Hannibal Lecter type jobs.
sevenstars
citizen army
Where this started was Rushdie's singling out Islam as in need of a Reformation to fit into Western Christian society.
I agree with you about the anti-muslim media but dont you think though that as someone who was brought up a muslim, who wrote a groundbreaking historical and contemporary novel about islam and who was sentenced to death by a major muslim leader as a result, Rushdie is entitled to his criticisms of Islam?
If not then I will start to wonder myself whether or not the satanic verses would get the same review today as in 1989...
I agree with you about the anti-muslim media but dont you think though that as someone who was brought up a muslim, who wrote a groundbreaking historical and contemporary novel about islam and who was sentenced to death by a major muslim leader as a result, Rushdie is entitled to his criticisms of Islam?
If not then I will start to wonder myself whether or not the satanic verses would get the same review today as in 1989...
sevenstars said:
The truth is large sections of the Left since 89 have moved further and further towards stifling any debate that they see as possibly promoting racism.
This has led them to making some very reactionary alliances. It's almost unbelievable how the SWP Livingstone and plenty more besides have lined up with reactionary muslims.
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