Seedboxes - anyone have any experience / recommendations?

[dogmatique]

This isn't just a knee-jerk reaction to today's largely toothless announcement, but it is something I've been curious about since I heard about their existance all of a week ago.

I've had a bit of a browse around, but so far the ones I've found seem a little bit in their infancy / dodgy looking, unlike say Usenet hosts like Giganews etc.

For those more in the dark than me, (which isn't difficult), the idea is that you rent some server space somewhere which runs a torrent client on a high bandwidth pipe and it hosts the torrents you download, and presents them to the outside world. When you want to download something that's completed, you grab it like a Usenet download to your local machine - therefore eliminating your ISP and your computer (and IP address) from the loop.

All well and good, supposedly. You never need a torrent client using your bandwidth, and the BPI won't come knocking - in theory.

Anyone clued up?

 

[Xanadu]

Sounds like it would all depend on where the server space was based.

 

[lobster]

I can imagine it being expensive.

Also its not just the actual data packets the isp will look at, its your usage pattern. A a lot of uploading , they consider p2p , they don;t even have to look at the actual data , that's why all those encryption, protocol obfuscation and so on options in p2p are pretty useless against the isp that just looks at actual usage patterns to determine if your using p2p for sharing illegal music/films.

Not having to upload, would cut that suspicion from them but you would still be downloading a lot . Remember some people use rapidshare and similar download sites, which are going be part of the usage pattern monitoring.

Thankfully only 6 isps are getting involved, once that list is available, you could just hop to one that's not on the list a less your isp is not already.

Sure, uploading could mean your running some kind of server but that is not part of an isp contract, that could just be as bad as using p2p.

 

[dogmatique]

Good points both, - I look at this as just shifting things further down the line of practical visability. - The BPI letters are going to be going out to Limewire, Gnutella and Pirate Bay users, not SSL'd Usenet downloaders, and private torrent site users, though as we know with Oink this will happen as sites become more brazen and popular.

Where I'm coming from that avoidance thing is more of an added (though effectively illusionary) bonus.

I'm more interested in not having the computer on all the time, and not having a torrent client open at my workplace.

Plus work will pay for it if I can combine an ftp function which has already been mooted recently.

 

[Jambooboo]

I've no specific idea, but there are a bunch of threads re: seedboxes on the Zeropaid and Filesharing Talk forums.

 

[Mr Smin]

I can imagine it being expensive.

Also its not just the actual data packets the isp will look at, its your usage pattern. A a lot of uploading , they consider p2p , they don;t even have to look at the actual data , that's why all those encryption, protocol obfuscation and so on options in p2p are pretty useless against the isp that just looks at actual usage patterns to determine if your using p2p for sharing illegal music/films. .

this week's announcement indicates that the BPI et al are going to be establishing the IP addresses of peers to torrents they have a problem with and passing those IPs to the ISPs who lookup the account holder and send a letter to them.
Your point stands in that ISPs are always against people making full use of bandwith so they use usage pattern data, but countermeasures like moblock would still seem to be relevant to avoid a letter through the post.

 

[miniGMgoit]

Just been looking in to a seed box myself.
Are you a member of any private trackers?
People often advertise in the forums on there.
I won't put any links up as I'm not sure they want just anyone asking them.

 

[UnderOpenSky]

I've been looking at splitting the cost of one of these with some mates. No letters moaning about what you've been downloading, but the main advantage for me with the weird way I access my internet, I can't open a port for torrents and can only download at weird hours so I don't bring the network to its knees.

Does anyone know about the seeding side of these if your using private trackers where you need to maintain ratio?

 

[miniGMgoit]

They are excellent for private trackers and have stupid bandwidth availible to get you that wicked ratio.
Again if your on private trackers I would highly recommend asking around there as you'll find many people using them. There are a fair few dodgy and unstable ones out there so get some recommendation from people who are actually using them right now.
Are you on what.cd?

I'm looking in to getting one now as I'm going to be off line for a few months while I sort myself out but would like to keep seeding what I have to make sure my ratio keeps going up.

When I pick I'll let you know who I went with

 

[Dillinger4]

They look pretty expensive.

If I had any money, I would probably use one. I use torrents quite a lot, and it would be pretty useful to have all my files hosted elsewhere and an excellent upload rate.

 

[UnderOpenSky]

They are excellent for private trackers and have stupid bandwidth availible to get you that wicked ratio.
Again if your on private trackers I would highly recommend asking around there as you'll find many people using them. There are a fair few dodgy and unstable ones out there so get some recommendation from people who are actually using them right now.
Are you on what.cd?

I'm looking in to getting one now as I'm going to be off line for a few months while I sort myself out but would like to keep seeding what I have to make sure my ratio keeps going up.

When I pick I'll let you know who I went with

Nice one, be intrested to hear about your results. I'll ask round in the meantime. Not on what.cd, but use demonoid and a few others quite a lot.

 

[bmd]

this week's announcement indicates that the BPI et al are going to be establishing the IP addresses of peers to torrents they have a problem with and passing those IPs to the ISPs who lookup the account holder and send a letter to them.
Your point stands in that ISPs are always against people making full use of bandwith so they use usage pattern data, but countermeasures like moblock would still seem to be relevant to avoid a letter through the post.

Interesting.

I moved in Feb from a place that could only get 0.5MB broadband to one that gets 4MB. In the last couple of months I have started getting emails from BT stating that I've reached my bandwidth limit of 80GB that month and if I go over 100 then my broadband speed will be throttled to 1MB during the day.

I wonder whether this is the kind of usage pattern that may be flagged up as unusual and therefore investigated or whether it's just that I'm using more bandwidth than I'm contracted for and they're taking steps to bring me into line. I suppose I'll only find out if I get a letter stating "please stop downloading films". I also wonder how much someone uses who is an iPlayer fan and who downloads films from Sky and Xbox Live etc.

The annoying thing is that I'm willing to pay for as much as I use but their contracts don't allow anyone more than 80GB bandwidth a month at full speed.

eta: just checked their fair usage policy and it seems it's standard behaviour for them but if I go over for more than two months they start charging £1 per GB! That takes the piss really, especially when they've got no option to upgrade. I'm on the Unlimited one already.

 

[miniGMgoit]

Nice one, be intrested to hear about your results. I'll ask round in the meantime. Not on what.cd, but use demonoid and a few others quite a lot.

PM Sent

 

[Jackobi]

I wonder whether this is the kind of usage pattern that may be flagged up as unusual and therefore investigated...

I doubt very much that any ISP would investigate high usage patterns as being commensurate to copyright infringement.

Some ISPs will send you a notice that they have received a copyright infringement accusation, but will not act upon it, others I believe have a three strike rule leading to disconnection, although this is still controversial.

They cannot release your details unless issued with a court order, which would require some evidence of infringement to obtain, not just a high usage pattern.
ISPs are not proactively seeking infringers, but are being encouraged to be more proactive in response to accusations.

Have a look at http://www.samknows.com/broadband/search.php to see whether your exchange is LLU enabled, ideally for Be/O2. Both have truly unlimited useage, no caps whatsoever, no traffic management, and no three strike rule, they will inform you of any copyright infringement notices on your account but will not act upon them.

Then, if your contract with BT has expired, request a MAC and migrate.

BT are a crap ISP, although most BT IPstream based ISPs have a cap as BT Wholesale bandwidth is expensive.

 

[miniGMgoit]

Lets not forget that you sign up for "x" amount of data a month. Its common practice to throtle your download speed after that. I max my data out practically every month as does a friend of mine. We both just get an email stating they we have used the amount we pay for and that they are no lowering it down until the next billing cycle. I'm sure if you read the contract you signed it will state that very clearly.

If you are concerned get a seedbox.

I'm about to sign up to one and give it a go.
Really looking forward to it too. I love the idea of not having my computer on all the time. It doesn't like it very much. Also being able to get films quickly and seed with good speed for as long as I wanted, even when on holiday

 

[bmd]

Lets not forget that you sign up for "x" amount of data a month. Its common practice to throtle your download speed after that. I max my data out practically every month as does a friend of mine. We both just get an email stating they we have used the amount we pay for and that they are no lowering it down until the next billing cycle. I'm sure if you read the contract you signed it will state that very clearly.

If you are concerned get a seedbox.

I'm about to sign up to one and give it a go.
Really looking forward to it too. I love the idea of not having my computer on all the time. It doesn't like it very much. Also being able to get films quickly and seed with good speed for as long as I wanted, even when on holiday

I'm unclear about how the seedbox works in terms of getting the stuff from the box to your pc. You're still using your ISP bandwidth to get it from the box to your pc, aren't you? The seeding thing is for uploading is it?

BT allow you to go over for two consecutive months and then charge £1 per GB after that. They don't just lower your speed.

 

[grit]

I'm unclear about how the seedbox works in terms of getting the stuff from the box to your pc. You're still using your ISP bandwidth to get it from the box to your pc, aren't you? The seeding thing is for uploading is it?

Exactly you still have to download it from the seedbox, I'd imagine the transfer is conducted over HTTP so to the ISP it doesnt appear to be a torrent download.

 

[miniGMgoit]

I'm unclear about how the seedbox works in terms of getting the stuff from the box to your pc. You're still using your ISP bandwidth to get it from the box to your pc, aren't you? The seeding thing is for uploading is it?

BT allow you to go over for two consecutive months and then charge £1 per GB after that. They don't just lower your speed.

It saves you from having you computer on 24/7.
Also you should check your contract as many providers (well down here at least) include what you upload in your monthly allowence.
When you consider that your provider will know your illegally sharing stuff by the amount you upload rather than download it kind of makes sense to do this.
Further more you can't be traced via the seed box. I'm not sure how that works but I know it does

 

[Awesome Wells]

Instead of wasting money on letters, why not just give the record industry the same amount of money, and let us download what we want.

 

[jæd]

Further more you can't be traced via the seed box. I'm not sure how that works but I know it does

Do you know any seed-box providers...? Won't their ISP complain...?

 

[dogmatique]

Ooh, I'd forgotten about this thread...

Question still hasn't been answered! any recommendations for providers of this service?