ViolentPanda
Hardly getting over it.
Good old-fashioned naval engagements ftw!
Saudi-owned oil tanker hijacked in Indian Ocean
- Thread starter david dissadent
- Start date
Good old-fashioned naval engagements ftw!
It's not the first time that's happened. The Royal Navy killed a few pirates only a few weeks ago and landed the remainder in Kenya for trial. That is why all of this talk about 'sink on sight' misses the point: it already happens. What matters is to have ships enough there to deter and/or hunt down pirates and to try and stabilise Somalia so it no longer functions as a base for them. Preferably without killing thousands of innocent people, as some wankers seem to think is a good idea.
CyberRose
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Was that supposed to be an example supporting piracy or opposing piracy?
Anyway, here's another pirate that did rather well:
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Guybrush_Threepwood
nino_savatte
No pasaran!
Take it how you like, you always do.
The other issue is that bulk freight companies in general are getting the fear. Pretty soon, mining overseas will stop being cost-effective, and recycling or mining rubbish tips will take off...
CyberRose
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Well if you're going to make a point, and provide evidence to back up your point, then don't you think it would also be helpful if you also explained exactly what your point was supposed to be?
You provided a link to a privateer who raised money for the revolutionary war against the British, and therefore helped free a nation from the clutches of an oppressive empire. However, in your previous post on privateers, it seemed that you were being critical of such practices. So, my question of whether or not you were trying to support or oppose privateering was a perfectly valid one in my opinion...
nino_savatte
No pasaran!
Funny how you're the only one to take issue with my post. But then I realise that, aside from being pedantic, you tend to see things in binary (i.e. I have to either "support" or "oppose" something).
You've obviously overlooked something else too (in fact you conveniently ignored my point about the lack of a state, or an recognisable economy): this is a form of economic activity and like it or not, it won't go away until a more stable country is created out of the mess that Somalia is currently in.
Furthermore, you also ignored my point about the warlords and whether or not they have a influence on the pirates. For instance, do they demand a form of tribute from the pirates? These questions don't seem to figure in your rather black/white analysis.
Finally, some countries have become incredibly rich off the back of piracy. Who says the same cannot happen in Somalia? Suggesting that they could start a "global empire" is a little silly, don't you think?
nino_savatte
No pasaran!
Whereas the letters of marque granted to the likes of Drake and Morgan led to great riches for the nascent British Empire.
CyberRose
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So can I take from that then, that you didn't actually have a point to make? If you did have a point, I'd be interested to know what it was (hence my asking you in my previous post)
I didn't over look it or ignore it, I merely chose not to respond to it as I don't have anything to add to it
Hey don't cry love! Sorry I didn't respond to all your points but at least I'm responding to your posts, otherwise you would have been completely ignored and then how would you be feeling?!
Yes, suggesting that Somalia could start a global empire is a little silly.
Not sure about how rich Somalia could become off the back of this modern phenomenon of piracy, as the examples I think you are referring to were on a lot larger scale and served to influence international trade to get rich, rather than getting rich of the stolen booty
nino_savatte
No pasaran!
I made my point and, as usual, you chuck out usual crap about me not making one. Have you always been this wilfully ignorant or did you have to work at it?
Whatever, nice wriggle.
Laughable bollocks.You ignored my point for the sake of a scrap. Hence the "do you support or oppose" bollocks.
It is and you were trying to infer that was my point. Pathetic.
They demand ransoms, they don't appropriate the cargo. In fact, there was someone from Chatham House talking about this and he was saying how piracy has had an effect on the local economy.
CyberRose
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You just posted a link about an American privateer, I don't know what the relevance is, especially as it seemed to contradict your earlier post on privateers
Wriggle from what?!
I ignored it because it didn't interest me in the slightest, hence why I don't reply to 99.999999% of posts on U75
Glad you agree it was a daft thing to suggest
Whether the pirates create wealth from selling the cargo or demanding ransoms is irrelevant. The point is Somalia won't "get rich" from the activity in the way that Britain got rich from privateering
nino_savatte
No pasaran!
You're a bit slow, aren't you?
Slow as well as wilfully ignorant, Nice combination.
Rubbish, it is entirely relevant. It "doesn't interest you" because you obviously have other reasons for responding to me.
No, it isn't "irrelevant". It's only "irrelevant" if you look at this as a purely black/white issue. How do you know what this will do for Somalia?
It's a shot in the arm for an economy that's in tatters and until the deep-rooted problems in Somalia are addressed, it won't go away.
http://news.bbc.co.uk/1/hi/world/africa/7650415.stm
Oh, I don't expect you to read the link either. If you do, I expect the usual reply from you. Try to prove me wrong for a change.
nino_savatte
No pasaran!
Intersting NYT article.
They're an odd sort of coast guard to be sure. But there is more to Somali piracy than meets the eye. Then again, because there is no functioning state, the coastal waters off Somalia can be overfished by other countries.
They're an odd sort of coast guard to be sure. But there is more to Somali piracy than meets the eye. Then again, because there is no functioning state, the coastal waters off Somalia can be overfished by other countries.
CyberRose
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Well, I didn't want you to feel that everyone was ignoring your 'insightful' posts on privateers, as I know that makes nino sad
Can you give me an example of an ass-backwards country "getting rich" from piracy? And I'm not being racist if that's what you mean about me looking at this as a purely "black/white" issue, in fact I think that's pretty low of you to suggest such a thing
I did try nino, seriously, but I stopped reading it half way through. So you think this piracy is a good thing because the criminals are gaining more power in Somalia...erm coolIt's a shot in the arm for an economy that's in tatters and until the deep-rooted problems in Somalia are addressed, it won't go away.
http://news.bbc.co.uk/1/hi/world/africa/7650415.stm
Oh, I don't expect you to read the link either. If you do, I expect the usual reply from you. Try to prove me wrong for a change.
kyser_soze
Hawking's Angry Eyebrow
The answer to all this has already been explained in Call of Duty 4:
Maybe I should have used a picture to illustrate my comment 2 days ago
kyser_soze,
I came up with the exact idea as you did. However on an oil tanker I don't know whether the oil will leak out after gunfire. Plus the hostage was (supposedly) very valuable to the pirates in CoD4 but on the Sirius Star they can just kill them all if seen helicopters dropping off soldiers on board!
I came up with the exact idea as you did. However on an oil tanker I don't know whether the oil will leak out after gunfire. Plus the hostage was (supposedly) very valuable to the pirates in CoD4 but on the Sirius Star they can just kill them all if seen helicopters dropping off soldiers on board!
nino_savatte
No pasaran!
Well, I didn't want you to feel that everyone was ignoring your 'insightful' posts on privateers, as I know that makes nino sad
Can you give me an example of an ass-backwards country "getting rich" from piracy? And I'm not being racist if that's what you mean about me looking at this as a purely "black/white" issue, in fact I think that's pretty low of you to suggest such a thing
I did try nino, seriously, but I stopped reading it half way through. So you think this piracy is a good thing because the criminals are gaining more power in Somalia...erm cool
What a fucking tool you are. You fail to understand what is meant by the words "binary" and "black/white" - which are the same thing. Bombing Somalia won't help either.
Your last paragraph merely underlines your wilful ignorance.
Sure you did.
CyberRose
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I honestly did! It's not my fault, I have trouble concentrating sometimes!Sure you did.
Indeed. Maersk have just announced today that some of their slower ships, tankers mainly, will be re-routed. In all likelihood other operators will follow. It's not going to do the economic situation much good if oil and other goods have to be shipped via the Cape, rather than through the Suez Canal.
david dissadent
New Member
I would have thought most of the big tankers like the one siezed would have been SuezMax i.e. to big for Suez? Oh and it seems there is alot of spare capacity in the shipping world suddenly and oil is no longer all that hard to come by (espicialy for ships using heavy bunker oil rather than diesel).
But it does seem as if a major effort is gaining momentum to get this sorted. China and Japan are taking a very keen interest in this and sending ships.
In the real bad news Blackwater are supposidly sending a ship (named the MacArthur ffs!!!!!!) to the area to helecopter 'security' teams for hire onto ships.
Suezmax refers to ships that can transit the canal; VLCCs such as Sirius Star are Capesize and have to pass through the Gulf of Aden on their outbound passage from Saudi Arabia. Loaded, they make a very valuable prize for the pirates. But shipping of any sort in the area - outbound tankers, ships on heading northbound towards the Suez canal, even fishing vessels - is at risk.
Potentially it is very disruptive. You're right that the price of oil is dropping atm, but even so, the extra mileage around the Cape is going to add to shipowners' fuel bills, among others, and insurance rates are already shooting up. At the very least the disruption is going to blunt the effect of falling prices of oil. It's not good news whichever way you look at it - unless, I suppose, you happen to be a shipowner with a surplus of Capesize tonnage!
Indeed, and having more warships knocking about in the area is some sort of deterrent. However, there's still the problem of it being a huge area of sea to patrol, in the hunt for small and highly mobile targets. IMO it won't be more ships that solve this in the long run, but rather changes ashore in Somalia.
Well, obviously they think someone wants their services. Personally, if I were captain of a big ship full of something flammable I'd rather not risk a firefight aboard, and a captain interviewed on C4 last night thought that arming merchant vessels was unlikely to achieve anything other than upping the ante in terms of violence when attacks fo happen, but perhaps Blackwater know something we don't.
teqniq
DisMembered
I would imagine the only thing that Blackwater know or care about is that there's potentially vast amounts of money to be made.....but perhaps Blackwater know something we don't.
Following their earlier success, India has secured an agreement with Somalia, allowing it to pursue pirates into Somali waters. Expect to see more pirate ships taken out...
India goes fishing for Pirates
India goes fishing for Pirates
Well they wouldn't be sending people out there if they didn't think that, would they? However, most of what's been reported so far suggests that there isn't really a market for their services. One wonders if they know different and, if so, how.
Andy the Don
Wise men say only fools..
An oil tanker's cargo will also produce flammable gas like propane which is vented off from the oil tanks. This gas being heavier than air does not disperse into the atmosphere but sinks and clings to the structure of the oil tanker so a spark from even a ricochet can cause an explosion.
david dissadent
New Member
http://news.bbc.co.uk/1/hi/world/south_asia/7749245.stm
seems the indians did not get Somali pirates after all.......
seems the indians did not get Somali pirates after all.......
DotCommunist
So many particulars. So many questions.
crossbows with wooden arrows
lostexpectation
New Member
whats the deal with the news blackout over the mv faina
nothing new for weeks, some update by ngo called ecoterra but nothing else but a line in stories about the oil tanker.
nothing new for weeks, some update by ngo called ecoterra but nothing else but a line in stories about the oil tanker.
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