[Sat 28th Oct 2017] London Anarchist Bookfair (London)

Discussion in 'protest, direct action and demos' started by Kate Sharpley, May 30, 2017.

London Anarchist Bookfair
Start Date: Sat 28th Oct 2017 10:00 AM
End Date: Sat 28th Oct 2017 07:00 PM
Time Zone: Europe/London +01:00 BST

Location:
Park View School
West Green Road,
London N15 3QR

Posted By: Kate Sharpley

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  1. andysays

    andysays Defiantly non-premium member

    OK, I misunderstood what you and PM were saying.

    I can understand why the organisers wouldn't want to go down the road of banning anyone, however much they might "deserve" it, but I wonder what other actions they could reasonably be expected to take to prevent similar situations flaring up in future.
     
  2. andysays

    andysays Defiantly non-premium member

    Understood.
     
  3. Magnus McGinty

    Magnus McGinty Wh♂️

    I could be misremembering but I thought the organisers basically said that they wouldn’t ‘police’ the event as that’s against the spirit of anarchism and that everyone should be involved in that anyway; which is pretty much what happened although they got all the flak for it.
     
    MrSpikey likes this.
  4. Pickman's model

    Pickman's model Every man and every woman is a star

    generally people didn't turn up and be wankers more than the once.

    every year had a different wanker / group of wankers though.
     
    Badgers and TopCat like this.
  5. andysays

    andysays Defiantly non-premium member

    Someone (I may go back in a minute and remind myself who) was saying upthread about the 'risk' of the Green Party leafleter coming back in future and repeating their behaviour, so I was wondering if the organisers had had to face this in the past.

    Personally I don't think it's that great a risk or that it needs to result in a formal banning, I'm more wondering what concrete action those who are still focussing on this particular person expect the organisers to do, assuming they can be persuaded this individual is a dangerous bigot.
     
  6. Fozzie Bear

    Fozzie Bear Well-Known Member

    There was some pre-emotive named ban list from one of the yank anarchist Bookfairs.

    It’s the wrong way to go imo. Better to make a blanket statement that x y z activity (not wearing deodorant) is not welcome than to ban a particular individual publicly.

    (Worth also mentioning that at least one fash guy to my knowledge has been physically ejected from the Bookfair before. Again not by the Bookfair collective but by anti-fascists who happened to be there)
     
    andysays and Pickman's model like this.
  7. Fozzie Bear

    Fozzie Bear Well-Known Member

    Also it was me that said they might come back. Some of the TERFs have everything to gain by provoking a reaction and nothing to lose if that has a negative impact on the Bookfair - because they’re not anarchists or even close.
     
    frogwoman, nyxx and Pickman's model like this.
  8. Magnus McGinty

    Magnus McGinty Wh♂️

    I thought Helen Steele was an anarchist (although she apparently wasn’t handing leaflets out but attacked for saying those who did had the right to so).
     
  9. Pickman's model

    Pickman's model Every man and every woman is a star

    Yeh that happened at least once at ulu
     
    Badgers likes this.
  10. Pickman's model

    Pickman's model Every man and every woman is a star

    More tefs than TERFs perhaps
     
    Badgers likes this.
  11. andysays

    andysays Defiantly non-premium member

    I wasn't suggesting banning, more putting it forward as a hypothetical option to try to get a discussion going.

    So what sort of activity could the organisers state was not welcome, given that it will be close to impossible to get universal agreement that a contentious leaflet is transphobic or whatever? (and I really don't want to reopen the dead end of whether the particular leaflet which sparked the incident was transphobic, that's a separate question)
     
  12. andysays

    andysays Defiantly non-premium member

    Thanks for clearing that up. I thought it was someone else, but when I went back and looked, they hadn't said anything like that, so I thought I'd imagined the whole thing...
     
    Pickman's model and Fozzie Bear like this.
  13. Fozzie Bear

    Fozzie Bear Well-Known Member

    Also Conway Hall.
     
    MrSpikey and Pickman's model like this.
  14. Wilf

    Wilf Aghast.

    I'm certainly with you on not knowing what to think. I started out with a straightforward/simplisitc 'pro-trans' position across the range of issues and, to be honest, still hold much of that. But then I've listened to other opinions on women only spaces and concerns of postmodern/self recognition and the rest. Only honest position I can hold is not knowing and, most of all, naively hoping there could be some solidarity and comradeship in the middle of this. Even more that I shouldn't be pronouncing as to who is right. But the wetter and mushier I've got about the issues, the more certain I've got about the politics, the shit show, the viciousness - stuff which is after all about important issues in people's lives (on both 'sides'). Utterly depressing and becoming an all too common way of carrying on across the 'left'. Fucking awful. :(
     
  15. TopCat

    TopCat Gone away, no forwarding address

    Green Anarchist were a relevant organisation regarding this. Bat shit crazy. Loony politics.
    Did anyone try and ban them?
    Most just desperately avoided their stall.
     
    Pickman's model likes this.
  16. LynnDoyleCooper

    LynnDoyleCooper Up against the wall motherfucker.

    I don't think GA are relevant at all. Whatever one thinks of their politics they were very clearly anarchists, and i never heard any calls to ban them.

    People seem to be forgetting that this trans thing is only a part of the dilemma the bookfair faces if it happens again. There was a whole host of demands of things it 'must do' - look at the fuss about the 'Religion is Stupid' banner for starters.

    I'm actually not sure in the current climate I can imagine a Bookfair happening without it being dominated by confrontation.
     
    chilango likes this.
  17. bimble

    bimble noisy but small

    Are class war supposed to be anarchists? Idk but according to accounts they called the police to come and stop the 'other side' from going to the same pub as them after the Tara Wood court case. Its all past ridiculous.
     
  18. chilango

    chilango *shrugs*

    It not like even the anarchist organisations (never mind the wider anarchist movement) have been able to find some common ground to unite around (afaics) to engage with this. Toxicity and division appear to be everywhere.

    It's fucked up.
     
    Last edited: May 17, 2018
  19. Magnus McGinty

    Magnus McGinty Wh♂️

    The whole point of idpol is about division, not solidarity. If it didn’t exist the state would invent it.
     
  20. Pickman's model

    Pickman's model Every man and every woman is a star

    according to an article that is, on its internal evidence, problematic, you mean.

    for example, there is no such group as antifa. and even when there was there wasn't a black uniform. the accounts seem to be equivocal comments from the police. perhaps a little less credulity and a little more caution when sharing such links, bimble.
     
    TopCat likes this.
  21. stethoscope

    stethoscope Well-Known Member

    I'm sure a blog with dodgy views on trans people based in Canada with liberal politics is bound to be a great source of accounts as to the actions of Class War and events surrounding UK anarchism.

    You're just like teuchter, rather than just being open and transparent about your beliefs and positions, you hide behind this 'just asking questions' and 'but according to this...' fake naivety.
     
    belboid and Pickman's model like this.
  22. bimble

    bimble noisy but small

    I have been open about my views on this, spent months on here doing so but not willing to pour more energy into discussing it on here totally pointless, imo. I just posted that about cw allegedly calling the police to stop people going to a pub because it seemed relevant to the discussion above. That link just the first i found when searching for that story which i remember seeing on twitter that day.
    Not sure what teuchter's got to do with anything. :hmm:
     
  23. Magnus McGinty

    Magnus McGinty Wh♂️

    To be fair I’m fairly certain the author of that article is U.K. based and is a Marxist, not a liberal.
     
  24. Pickman's model

    Pickman's model Every man and every woman is a star

    i fear your critical faculties are atrophying
     
    Badgers and bimble like this.
  25. bimble

    bimble noisy but small

    me too. :(
     
  26. stethoscope

    stethoscope Well-Known Member

    Meh, perhaps so. I'm fatigued by the whole fucking business and what seems to count as politics anymore. I don't even know why I still post here so time to call it a day.
     
    frogwoman and Pickman's model like this.
  27. Pickman's model

    Pickman's model Every man and every woman is a star

    another dodgy thing in that article is the claim that class war loudly oppose "carceral feminism" yet i can't find anything to substantiate that - although there's at least 20 sites carrying the article containing the claim. it seems cw are very quiet on the issue.
     
    Badgers likes this.
  28. Pickman's model

    Pickman's model Every man and every woman is a star

    i remember a movement against the monarchy demo at highgrove where man with beard out of ga was wearing a balaclava with a big bushy ginger beard sticking out from underneath, it served absolutely no purpose in disguising his identity.
     
  29. Magnus McGinty

    Magnus McGinty Wh♂️

    Antifa is frequently used in the media as a synonym of anti-fascists and she clearly means they’d adopted the black bloc look, that many involved nowadays do as a matter of principle rather than a tactic.
    It’s a pretty one-sided article but at least criticise it for the right reasons and not that it ought to write expecting its audience have an intricate understanding of historical UK anti-fascism.
     
  30. newbie

    newbie undisambiguated

    Indeed, but I stumble trying to work out how a communist or anarchist politics not infected with idpol would deal with the contradictions thrown up by this apparently intractable divergence of opinion. Even allowing for the wise keeping the hotheads respectful there's still such a gulf in the respective positions it's hard to see how focus on solidarity (or anything else) can resolve the differences.
     

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