Rich Kid Poor Kid...

[_angel_]

1 You dont really believe that do you?

2 Yes Charitable status should be removed from posh schools but that doesnt mean that you then have to support subsidising the posh kids who go on to university does it?

What about the non posh kids. Sticking the prices up would only deter them more - doh!

We have less social mobility now because people are expected to pay for their education. My Dad came from a council estate in the 50's and 60's and went to teacher training college (it wasn't a university degree in those days) without having to pay. He put himself through nightschool to do A levels.

He wouldn't have been able to go to college without amassing a huge debt and would probably still be working in manual jobs.... that would be better for him, how?

 

[catinthehat]

Our education system is about credentialism now - you dont need to go to university to be educated but you do need to go for the paperwork that "proves" it. A lot of people have an idealised view of what our education system is about - its not about self actualisation or education for its own sake (sadly maybe) but about a balance that attempts to produce a workforce that have enough knowledge and expertise to be competitive in a global market and how much taxpayers money you are going to spend on it. When the universities were populated almost entirely by the middle and upper classes there were grants aplenty and graduates could walk into jobs. The expansion of universities was in part fueled by the growth of the welfare state and the need for more teachers, doctors - not enough middle class kids so open the gate a bit wider and cream of some of the working classes. This accounts for the growth of the middleclasses and a degree of social mobility. Effectively raising the school leaving age and punting more into universities under Blairs "get more graduates" policy is not going to impact on social mobility because we now have surplus graduates - all that happens is the bar is raised and you need more qualifiations to get jobs than were previously required. Intelligence has no proven class base but opportunity does - better off you are the more life chances you get.

There are plenty of studies that show the home environment and parental attitude is paramount. However poverty is a massive hurdle to overcome in the race for qualifications. Poor housing and health have a massive impact on how people learn and once you are behind labels are applied and its an enormous task to catch up - if education was a race poor kids would have their legs tied together and rich kids would get a ten yard start.

If anything this programme was an advert for scrapping private schools - once the rich kid had some understanding that the poor kid was not the enemy there was a healthy degree of empathy. Both girls talked about the "bubble" they existed in. But increasingly schools are organised around class lines - even state schools have differnt demographics hence the house prices being higher in catchment areas of "good" state schools. Parents only get to do so much socialisation the rest is done in school - and we are busy segregating these along class and religious lines so kids only get to mix with their "own" kind. So our species chops its self up into little groups that identify with themselves by showing distaste for others.

Plenty of education - not so much wisdom thats us.

 

[sim667]

just google channel 4 and click watch online, there are a lot of programs that you can watch without using 4OD,

thanks, ill have a look.

 

[tbaldwin]

What about the non posh kids. Sticking the prices up would only deter them more - doh!

Who said anything about sticking up the prices for non posh kids?

 

[_angel_]

Who said anything about sticking up the prices for non posh kids?

hows you going to do that then?

treat public school kids in the same category as international students.... could work...

 

[tbaldwin]

hows you going to do that then?

treat public school kids in the same category as international students.... could work...

Good idea.

 

[Agent Sparrow]

hows you going to do that then?

treat public school kids in the same category as international students.... could work...

With an exception for scholarship kids who might not come from monied backgrounds?

 

[tbaldwin]

With an exception for scholarship kids who might not come from monied backgrounds?

Bit of a myth though isnt it. A red herring to hide behind and justify the charitable status of independent schools.

 

[Agent Sparrow]

Bit of a myth though isnt it. A red herring to hide behind and justify the charitable status of independent schools.

Not really. I know scholarship kids - there was one down my road who never would have been able to afford private education otherwise, and I was encouraged to go for it (decided to not try in the end).

That there are not many however is important to remember.

 

[_angel_]

With an exception for scholarship kids who might not come from monied backgrounds?

hehe

Scholarships don't seem to have happened in Leeds afaik....