Records that people rave about that are actually shit

Discussion in 'music, bands, clubs & festies' started by ska invita, Sep 22, 2014.

  1. Knotted

    Knotted Sweet when you stir it up

    Listening to that I see what you mean about head solo head. That's really not a good record either though. Very nice piano but I could lose the rest of the band. That rhythm section is dire. Coltrane is meh.
     
  2. stavros

    stavros Well-Known Member

    Modern pop is a very hard art to crack in the medium of the LP. Both Annie's albums are very solid with some superb singles, although probably no more than that.
     
  3. danny la rouge

    danny la rouge Warning: posts may cause vasovagal presyncope

    I disagree entirely. I think Monk and Coltrane were just as aware of structure and composition as each other.

    Here's a Monk head (it's on the album I mention above):

    [​IMG]

    Here's a Coltrane head from Blue Train:

    [​IMG]

    Monk is doing his usual angular thing, with an unusual chord sequence (semi tone shifts), and Trane is giving an early outing to his renowned Trane Changes (with its equally unusual major third root note shifts). Both are highly technically adept and fundamentally logical harmonic structures. Both state the theme, then improvise over the chord sequence. Both structure the songs - head, solo, head.
     
    Knotted likes this.
  4. DotCommunist

    DotCommunist slowtime

    Pink Wafers
     
  5. DotCommunist

    DotCommunist slowtime

    oh and malted milk biscuits. You know the ones with a pastoral scene on them
     
  6. DotCommunist

    DotCommunist slowtime

    And I've got no time for plain rich tea either
     
    ouchmonkey likes this.
  7. Knotted

    Knotted Sweet when you stir it up

    Oh you've gone and written it out. You are a star, Danny but how am I supposed to argue with you now?

    It's a great theme from Coltrane and a great composition. But that lasts 38 seconds and he returns to it at the end for the last 50 seconds or so where the whole song is over 7 minutes the rest of which is soloing. Where they take turns. Including a drum solo.

    With the Monk the theme lasts 58 seconds (it gets repeated) (and it has all sorts of nice runs and things going on with it). And the whole song is only 4 minutes and Monk returns to the theme and in a very nice way. Granted there is a dull solo over a groove bit in the middle but that's only half the song, which is much more compact. We're talking big %age differences here. And the drummer starts doing interesting stuff too (despite what I said earlier) at the end and there are angular jabs at the rhythm as well as the melody.
     
  8. danny la rouge

    danny la rouge Warning: posts may cause vasovagal presyncope

    Sometimes I need to back away from the music theory. :D
     
  9. Knotted

    Knotted Sweet when you stir it up

    Not really, you've persuaded me that I'm talking shit. Maybe I just like Monk's (less subtle) style more than Coltrane's.

    Still there is something fundamentally wrong with musicians lining up to play solos. My heart sinks when the trumpet comes in on Lazybird, and that's before I've even heard what the trumpeter is doing. The very fact that he has handed a solo spot to the trumpet. I don't like that. It's morally wrong.
     
  10. Butch le zer

    Butch le zer Banned Banned

    Liquid swords hasn't aged very well

    Production is still amazing, but the rapping is as out of date as any other rapping
     
  11. Cheesypoof

    Cheesypoof Fuck off Noddy Banned

    Listened to Trout Mask Replica today again....:oops:
     
    Knotted likes this.
  12. Knotted

    Knotted Sweet when you stir it up

    Listen to it again today. Pay particular attention to Pachuco Cadaver. Surreal but biting, disturbing, kinda jolly.
     
  13. Knotted

    Knotted Sweet when you stir it up

    danny la rouge I'm going to see if I can make sense of that notation this evening. I think I can see what Monk's doing but I'm struggling with Coltrane (in the abstract that is).
     
    danny la rouge likes this.
  14. ouchmonkey

    ouchmonkey Singe Gainsbourg

    indeed. and the surprising amount of involvement you get out of asking a group of people what is the best biscuit kind of proves my (shaky) point
     
  15. Monkeygrinder's Organ

    Monkeygrinder's Organ Dodgy geezer swilling vapid lager

    It's clearly the Tim-Tam. Australia's greatest achievement.
     
  16. Bahnhof Strasse

    Bahnhof Strasse Free the Sepsis Six!

    EXODUS - control freak twats.
     
    friedaweed likes this.
  17. SpookyFrank

    SpookyFrank We kill the flame

    Yeah I heard they barely sold two dozen copies.
     
  18. killer b

    killer b Nostrofuckingdamus

    You dig Jenny Wilson stav? Check her out if not. She's ace, and should be better known.
     
  19. SpookyFrank

    SpookyFrank We kill the flame

    If it's proper compositions you're after, you want Charles Mingus or Duke Ellington. I'm not that bothered about Coltrane's compositions or his playing to be honest.

    I can see the complexity and ruthless logic of something like Giant Steps, it just doesn't interest my musically.
     
  20. SpookyFrank

    SpookyFrank We kill the flame

    Those are fucking shit :mad:
     
  21. danny la rouge

    danny la rouge Warning: posts may cause vasovagal presyncope

    Aye, aye, back in the 70s when there were trendy vicars and geography teachers buying records. But today's ones buy dubstep.
     
  22. DotCommunist

    DotCommunist slowtime


    you underestimate the power of rumours. I've often flicked through the CD wallet of an acquaintance my age or younger and found a copy of rumours. Often its the only F-Mac the person owns. It has entered into the collective consciousness as a classic, like Nevermind, Harvest and Phat of the Land. And there is nothing you can do about it
     
  23. danny la rouge

    danny la rouge Warning: posts may cause vasovagal presyncope

    I can rage, rage against the dying of the light.

    I fought and died during punk for the likes of you.
     
    SaskiaJayne and friendofdorothy like this.
  24. killer b

    killer b Nostrofuckingdamus

    Rumours is a great album. FM did some awful records, but Rumours isn't one of them.
     
  25. stavros

    stavros Well-Known Member

    I haven't heard of her to be honest. I went through a phase of keeping well up with great pop, in the UK and from the continent, about ten years ago, but I'll confess I've slipped in recent years. I'll give her a look. Being Scandanavian is usually a good marker of quality pop music.
     
  26. danny la rouge

    danny la rouge Warning: posts may cause vasovagal presyncope

    :shakes head sadly:
     
    friendofdorothy likes this.
  27. killer b

    killer b Nostrofuckingdamus

    I'd never heard of her until a lass took me to one of her gigs a couple of months ago, she was incredible live - like a scandinavian Grace Jones in her approach to the audiencel, electric.
     
  28. Cheesypoof

    Cheesypoof Fuck off Noddy Banned

    Gave the first two choons a whirl today but then had to 'quickly' switch it off, so as not to frighten my colleague! :eek::D

    Can't explain, but i have a real itchin to listen to the whole thing again tonight.
     
  29. ouchmonkey

    ouchmonkey Singe Gainsbourg

  30. killer b

    killer b Nostrofuckingdamus

    Yeah, I did a thread - they all thought it was shit.
     

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