Reconditioned Engines

[Funky_monks]

I'm having a look at an Astra estate this weekend with a view to buying.

However, on the phone, the guy said it had a re-con engine as due to a faulty water system on the original. It has 50K miles on the clock and a full s/h. Apparently the engine is still under warranty for a yr, he did say how many miles the new engine had done, and I think it was 14k.

Should I be overly worried about this? I've never bought a car with a re-con engine before. What are the likley problems/scams?

Thanks for the help.

 

[zoltan]

Its can be a minefield.

many Recon places either leave your own engine in or simply swap it for one from a scrapper and have a complex post fitmentservicing schedule that is easy to overlook and leave you having breached the "warranty"

many however are decent places and do actually strip and rebiuld engines with new parts where needed.This obviouisly isnt cheap though.

how old is it ? how many owners Who fitted the engine ?

main dealers would not piss about with a recon engine if it was a new car under warranty - they would slap a new on e in - if it was truly knackered ( which doesnt really happen with newish cars nowadays ).


TBH, I would give it a miss unless you need that particular set of wheels urgently - it may be good & be legit , but if its a bad one, then you are wasting your money - go for a straight one if you can find it - with maybe higher miles, but good SH and one owner of at all possible.

 

[pogofish]

main dealers would not piss about with a recon engine if it was a new car under warranty - they would slap a new on e in - if it was truly knackered ( which doesnt really happen with newish cars nowadays ).

Don't bank on that. I've known many cases where a main dealer has tried to fob-off a major warranty repair with a recon. Indeed there was a thread on here just a few months back where one was trying just this on another poster.

You would be surprised how often this sort of thing happens, even with modern cars. Often because the dealer's mechanic (or junior trainee tech usually) has ignored/fucked-up the proper maintenance checklist.

As for recons - I'd agree they can be a minefield especially with a common car model. Some are excellent whilst others are often scrappie jobs. There is really no way of telling unless you supervise the whole job & get all the correct paperwork from a reputable firm etc. IME, most of the reliable & viable reconditions/reconditioners tend to be aiming at the enthusiast end of the trade.

 

[han]

I'd definitely avoid buying any car with a recon engine.

They can be problematic.

And - if the car's so great, why does it need a reconditioned engine? is the question that comes to mind. What was wrong with the original engine?

I bought a van with a recon engine and it was a nightmare from beginning to end, I had to sell it after 6 months. My brother also bought a van with a recon engine that he ended up flogging a year later cos it was so unreliable!

 

[zoltan]

Don't bank on that. I've known many cases where a main dealer has tried to fob-off a major warranty repair with a recon. Indeed there was a thread on here just a few months back where one was trying just this on another poster.

You would be surprised how often this sort of thing happens, even with modern cars. Often because the dealer's mechanic (or junior trainee tech usually) has ignored/fucked-up the proper maintenance checklist.

As for recons - I'd agree they can be a minefield especially with a common car model. Some are excellent whilst others are often scrappie jobs. There is really no way of telling unless you supervise the whole job & get all the correct paperwork from a reputable firm etc. IME, most of the reliable & viable reconditions/reconditioners tend to be aiming at the enthusiast end of the trade.

10 years ago , after a major service, my Mums car blew up - turned out the spotty apprenctice who had been given a checklist and told to get on with it had forgotten to fill the Mutha with water- 10 miles later

Thye tried to fob us off wth a repair/ recon, but we kicked off so much, a sparkly new engine was installed

 

[Wilson]

proper recons often used to be painted different colours yellow i remember but there were others depending on how much had been renewed, dunno if they still do that

 

[pogofish]

Thye tried to fob us off wth a repair/ recon, but we kicked off so much, a sparkly new engine was installed

Yup, more or less the same happened to my mother once. Her car was serviced to the checklist for another engine altogether

Also, when I worked in a medium sized garage once, they usually managed to fuck-up some customers job to the point where they offered one on about a monthly basis.

The main reason that place offered recons, sourced from a non-factory reconditioner, was to avoid getting into shit from the factory rep over how bad they were at maintaining the basic standards in their main dealer aggreement. Ordering too many new engines/factory recons (which were good but usually came from fleet contract vehicles & were very high-milage to begin with) under warranty got extra scrutiny for their "performance".

 

[zoltan]

proper recons often used to be painted different colours yellow i remember but there were others depending on how much had been renewed, dunno if they still do that

I think the Old BL engines / gold seal ones were different, not sure about it nowaqdays

 

[zoltan]

Yup, more or less the same happened to my mother once. Her car was serviced to the checklist for another engine altogether

Also, when I worked in a medium sized garage once, they usually managed to fuck-up some customers job to the point where they offered one on about a monthly basis.

The main reason that place offered recons, sourced from a non-factory reconditioner, was to avoid getting into shit from the factory rep over how bad they were at maintaining the basic standards in their main dealer aggreement. Ordering too many new engines/factory recons (which were good but usually came from fleet contract vehicles & were very high-milage to begin with) under warranty got extra scrutiny for their "performance".

UM

same dealer, different model of car a couple of years later - a snapped Cam belt like 10 minutes after driving out of the major service - I wonder if the same spotty youth was still employed at that point ?

NO argument this time - they picked it up within 5 minutes, gave us a demionstrator for a week and delivered the family car back to the door with a nice hand finished wax.

incompetent twats

 

[Funky_monks]

As far as I'm aware with this one, the water system went and it was cheaper to fit a whole new engine (albeit on that had done £14K) than replacing the system. It's cool though, I have a mechanic mate of mine to look at it before I buy (I wasnt sure if hed be available) and seems to think that the new engine is nowt to worry about, given that it was dealer fitted and still under warranty. I'm sure he'll sniff it out if it's dodge.

 

[longdog]

As far as I'm aware with this one, the water system went and it was cheaper to fit a whole new engine (albeit on that had done £14K) than replacing the system. It's cool though, I have a mechanic mate of mine to look at it before I buy (I wasnt sure if hed be available) and seems to think that the new engine is nowt to worry about, given that it was dealer fitted and still under warranty. I'm sure he'll sniff it out if it's dodge.

Water system?

The pump, rad or hoses?

The only thing I can think of that could reasonably be considered to be part of the water system needing a re-con is if somebody had run it dry and cracked the block. Wouldn't say much for the general upkeep of the van and I'd give it a wide berth. If he's not been checking the water he's probably not been checking the oil either.

 

[Funky_monks]

It was from a dealer taken in part-ex. From what was said it sounds like it overheated and rather than replace all the seals/hoses, they put a new engine in.

logbook says two prev owners - motability for the 1st 1k miles and the previous owners until now - 52K miles since 2000.

The engine is still under warranty for another year, ane the car has done 1k miles since it was fitted.

I've had a mechanic look at the car (his wife works with me) and although he identified a couple of minor faults (the earth lead needs cleaning and the rear discs need tightening) which the dealer is prepared to rectify before I buy, he says it looks fine to him and I shouldnt be too worried about the engine for the price the dealer wants (the engine is all very new and shiny looking, can you tell I'm not a mechanic?).

So now my dilemma.

You lot have given me a resounding NO! Whilst the mechanic has said YES!

I need a sit-down.

 

[Funky_monks]

Water system?

The pump, rad or hoses?

Hoses I think, the rad looks fine too (although not new).

 

[deviousmonkey]

Working for Motability myself I can state that there the cars themselves are throughly looked after (as you would expect for a private fleet owned vehicle) however only around 60% were returned after the 1st the years in a salable state.

Given the reg I can find alsorts about it (obviously not able to revel anything which might constitute a breach of data protection)

 

[Poi E]

In think that the real issue is why would you buy a model of car when you know the last engine died early? The same thing could happen again to the engine.

It is such a buyers' market out there that you should be very choosy.

 

[pembrokestephen]

So now my dilemma.

You lot have given me a resounding NO! Whilst the mechanic has said YES!

I need a sit-down.

Well, we lot haven't seen the car, and are probably operating a counsel of perfection. Your mechanic HAS seen the car, and is presumably not being quite as idealistic about it as we are!