cliche guevara
Well-Known Member
Which, as has been said over and over on this thread, is a change to the account. I wonder whether that will get through this time? I'm not holding my breath.
really annoyed with WoW and blizzard!
- Thread starter Jonti
- Start date
Which, as has been said over and over on this thread, is a change to the account. I wonder whether that will get through this time? I'm not holding my breath.
hegley
never odd or even
You really aren't getting it - as far as Blizzard is concerned YOU ARE NOT THEIR CUSTOMER. Your son is the account holder, your son is the customer ...
emanymton
A cat politely sat on the flaming gardener.
They don't have to take my word for it at all. I can *prove* I'm paying for the account!
(the kid refuses to divulge his password -- I've trained him too well)
Sorry if someone else has asked this, but can’t he give you the password to set up the parental controls and then change it after?
Jonti
what the dormouse said
Hmmm.
So as far as Blizzard are concerned, the term "customer" does not cover the folks who pay for their services? You got a citation for that?
My request could be sorted very easily if Blizzard knew what they were doing. Which is, of course, supplying some kind of software-as-a-service to the paying customer (who may or may not be the actual gameplayer).
You may think I have no business wanting some say over when and for how long the computing resources I've been buying are used. That's up to you. But it's not my judgment, and that's up to me.
So I'm going to improve the signal to noise ratio on this thread for myself by popping you on ignore for a while
cliche guevara
Well-Known Member
Jonti you're making yourself look like a right prick on this thread to be honest, every time someone tells you why you can't do what you want to do, you stick them on ignore. If you don't like the answer, don't ask the question. Perhaps you could get it into your thick head that it's possible that you could actually be wrong? And i don't knwo why I'm bothering to post this as you have me on ignore, but perhaps it will serve as a warning to anyone else trying to give you some friendly advice.
Jonti
what the dormouse said
No, it seems not. I should add I've found Blizzard to be evasive and dishonest in what they tell the folks who send them money ("customers", I think they're called).
But, for what it's worth, I understand that once it has been set up, the parental control is independent of the game play and the controls. The game-player does not have access to the parental control to read or change its password.
I'm not sure if this applies the other way round, but I do hope the parental control account cannot interfere with gameplay or the virtual property on the account. I've no interest in doing such a thing, and don't even want it to be a theoretical possibility.
I've no interest in spying on my child, compromising his privacy, or accessing his data in any way. I only want to be able to schedule play-times.
Look, if you pay his bill it doesn't make you the account holder. If someone paid your monthly phone bill, you wouldn't be able to check their call records and set up blocks.
If you wanted parental controls, become the account holder yourself and turn over the details to your son. Or exercise some control over him and obtain those details yourself.
If you wanted parental controls, become the account holder yourself and turn over the details to your son. Or exercise some control over him and obtain those details yourself.
Jonti
what the dormouse said
Thanks, that's really helpful. I'd thought they meant some kind of PGP key or phrase that the user had to invent way back. I've got the original media, so I've got this "key". All I have to do now is round up the other info they demand
- - The account name
- - Your full real name
- - The full name as is registered on the account (if different to above)
- - Your full address including postal or zip code
- - The last 4 digits of the credit card used on the account plus the expiration date
This may just be do-able ...
cybertect
It's grim up north (London)
I highlighted the crucial part of the equation.
From what I understand, it requires access to the player's account to set up parental controls.
From the Data Protection Act perspective, it requires your son's consent to do that, which, as a parent, you might reasonably be expected to be able to obtain from him voluntarily.
If you're hoping to avoid a confrontation, then IMHO, you're on a hiding to nothing without his consent.
Even if Blizzard acquiesced to your request, or if you successfully block at the router or via the Windows login or just let the account lapse when the credit card payments cease, then you're going to end up having the confrontation with him at that point.
TBH, I suspect this thread belongs in Health & Relationships rather than a tech forum
Jonti
what the dormouse said
Oh, great. "How to bring up your kids proper" from the Urban75 crowd. Fookin' priceless. Look bud, when I want your advice on child-rearing I'll ask. Until then here's a clue. Your unsolicited advice is neither welcome nor interesting.
Blizzard market their parental controls as giving the person who pays the bills some degree of control. But it seems their efforts to deliver on that promise are far from successful. It's a right bloody pain getting it sorted.
You are right about one thing though. Parents thinking of allowing a child a WoW account would be well advised to set things up themselves (yes, it's time and effort). In particular, set up the parental control first, then pass over the account to the kid.
This isn't as easy as it sounds mind. A child can easily buy WoW tokens from games shops to set up their own account.
Jonti
what the dormouse said
That's the way they've set it up alright. Beats me why.
So they can ask for copies of kids' passports in the name of "privacy" and "security" it seems.
hegley
never odd or even
Jonti
what the dormouse said
Not really. He needs his 'puter for the stuff he *should* be doing.
I've no wish to stop him using his 'puter or the 'net generally. I (actually, his mum) wants only to timetable his gameplay on WoW.
Supine
Newt Member
You get the kid to allow you access, you then set-up the parental controls.
If the kid refuses you stop paying, you delete the program, and you totally restrict access to the PC. Simple.
The way you describe the situation is not acceptable imo. As a minor they need to accept that your the boss. Do you have a naughty step for them to sit on
If the kid refuses you stop paying, you delete the program, and you totally restrict access to the PC. Simple.
The way you describe the situation is not acceptable imo. As a minor they need to accept that your the boss. Do you have a naughty step for them to sit on
If you paid for a period of gameplay, for example 6 months, then all that will happen is the account will lapse when it's due for renewal. Anything more will require access to the account itself. I'd be more concerned as to why you can't get the account info from your kid, personally. If the account isn't in your name it won't matter whether it's you or santa claus that's paying for it.
Jonti
what the dormouse said
I disagree. The child is behaving quite rationally. He doesn't want to give up some control and autonomy. Why should he?TBH, I suspect this thread belongs in Health & Relationships rather than a tech forum
The real sticking point is that access to the account is not enough.
Seriously, I mentioned it above, in response to the people suggesting I use a key-logger to gain access. Even once one is in the account, there is then an additional "secret question" to answer. The prompt we get is "high school?". But neither of us can remember what answer we gave the system when it insisted on setting up this secret question/answer thingie.
It was a few years ago ...
newme
Giant in Pastyland now
Originally Posted by Jonti
It's their responsibility to allow the parent to exercise control.
Innit lol
It's their responsibility to allow the parent to exercise control.
This thread has made me rofl quite a bit - and the above is a particular highlight.
Innit lol
Jonti
what the dormouse said
Yeah this is all good stuff. If I can't make progress quickly enough, I will just have to cancel my card to stop Blizzard taking more payments (the way it works is that one "pre-authorises" a whole slew of payments -- that means the bank cannot cancel them like it might a standing order or even a direct debit).
I can't get all the info from the kid because he doesn't have all the info.
See above
Jonti
what the dormouse said
Heh, Blizzard have just sent me a "Blizzard Support Survey".
They asked me what I think of their support. Well, I've given them hundreds of pounds over the last few years. So I told 'em. And I've suggested it may be an idea for them to make it easier for parents to control the resources we fund for our kids.
I have a hunch they may see the justice of that PoV. We''ll see.
They asked me what I think of their support. Well, I've given them hundreds of pounds over the last few years. So I told 'em. And I've suggested it may be an idea for them to make it easier for parents to control the resources we fund for our kids.
I have a hunch they may see the justice of that PoV. We''ll see.
If the account holder doesn't have all the info you need to either input parental controls, or cancel the account, then you're fucked. I don't know why they wouldn't have all the info, but i'm not reading 4 pages to find out way, sorry.
hegley
never odd or even
Actually that's not the way it works with Blizzard:
i.e. Jonti will need to physically cancel this for Blizzard to stop taking a payment every one, three or six months (depending on original choice) for them not to continue taking payments until the card expiry. Of course he has me on ignore so won't be able to read this.
Yes my mistake. I forgot that's how they did it. Though im sure you could cancel it from the credit card companies end and thereby forcing B to deal with the account holder. Not that such action is necessary.
Blizzard however will not ask for passwords either.
Blizzard however will not ask for passwords either.
Jonti
what the dormouse said
Jonti
what the dormouse said
If you buy several months of WoW playtime from Blizzard, they don't take all the money at once. I guess folks would balk at that. But neither do they set up a standing order or direct debit to take the money. I wish they had, after all, one can cancel a direct debit or standing order (some bank staff will try to tell you different, but the truth is you can cancel a direct debit from your account).
No, what Blizzard get one to do is pre-authorise a slew of payments, kind of like giving them a pile of post-dated cheques. Cheques that you can't cancel. When I asked them to cancel the payments they assured me that "No more payments will be taken once the current period of subscription is over."
In other words, despite my request to cease payments, they will carry on taking the money just the same as before. The only way I can stop them is to cancel the card.
emanymton
A cat politely sat on the flaming gardener.
Your credit card company should block payments to blizzard if you ask them to as their responsibility is to you not blizzard. You will however be in breach of contract with blizzard either way.
Jonti
what the dormouse said
I am not "in breach of contract" until a Court establishes that. And that is *so* not going to happen. I've gone from feeling neutral/positive about Blizzard (WoW is a good game and excellent value per hour) to feeling Blizzard can go fuck themselves. I've learned its procedures give idiots an illusion of security while secretively harvesting irrelevant personal information. I feel Blizzard has dissembled and been less than clear about the position. So now I view them as just another bunch of corporate filth, really. Yeah, I know I shouldn't act all surprised.
But anyway, I've asked the bank (it's a debit card, by the way) and they assure me that the only way they can stop Blizzard continuing to take money is to cancel the card. That may be a shortcoming of the bank in question, but I have to believe them. At least the bank will cancel and reissue the debit card without charging me.
One is making progress on plan B (we need to obtain the secret answer to a question that we answered when the account was first opened some years ago. The answer was fictitious -- it would provide no security otherwise -- and it has long since been forgotten). Blizzard will let us know the secret answer to this question provided we give them scads of personal info.
Most of it is about me as the guy making payment. Name and address, that kind of thing. It's still crap as far as I'm concerned, but better than being obliged to give the fuckwits a copy of the kid's passport.
But anyway, I've asked the bank (it's a debit card, by the way) and they assure me that the only way they can stop Blizzard continuing to take money is to cancel the card. That may be a shortcoming of the bank in question, but I have to believe them. At least the bank will cancel and reissue the debit card without charging me.
One is making progress on plan B (we need to obtain the secret answer to a question that we answered when the account was first opened some years ago. The answer was fictitious -- it would provide no security otherwise -- and it has long since been forgotten). Blizzard will let us know the secret answer to this question provided we give them scads of personal info.
Most of it is about me as the guy making payment. Name and address, that kind of thing. It's still crap as far as I'm concerned, but better than being obliged to give the fuckwits a copy of the kid's passport.
I think you are slightly confused over how subs work.
When you sign up to a subscription with Blizzard you specify the sub length, 1 month, 3 months or 6 months. If you cancel the subscription the account is only playable for the period you've already paid for.
eg. I just renewed my own account this morning after it lapsed due to a lost CC. They took the first payment immediately for 6 months and show the next pending payment for 6 months down the line. If I cancel the sub between now and the date of the pending payment the account becomes unusable after the 6 months I've just paid for expires. They will not collect the pending payment if you've canceled the sub as you've withdrawn permission for them to do so.
Just ask the kid for the password. If he doesn't know it, he can't play it anyway!
Jonti
what the dormouse said
Nope, even after having logged in to play the game, there's an *extra* step to navigate before parental control can be activated.
I explained that here. And, in a direct response to you, I pointed you to that answer already here.
Please don't ask the same question again. Just remember this "even after having logged in to play the game, there's an *extra* step to navigate before parental control can be activated".
I explained that here. And, in a direct response to you, I pointed you to that answer already here.
Please don't ask the same question again. Just remember this "even after having logged in to play the game, there's an *extra* step to navigate before parental control can be activated".
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