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Question about global warming

One To Watch: The Great Global Warming Swindle

Channel 4 Thursday 8 March at 9pm

In a polemical and thought-provoking documentary, film-maker Martin Durkin argues that the theory of man-made global warming has become such a powerful political force that other explanations for climate change are not being properly aired.

The film brings together the arguments of leading scientists who disagree with the prevailing consensus that a 'greenhouse effect' of carbon dioxide released by human activity is the cause of rising global temperatures.

Instead the documentary highlights recent research that the effect of the sun's radiation on the atmosphere may be a better explanation for the regular swings of climate from ice ages to warm interglacial periods and back again.

http://www.channel4.com/science/microsites/G/great_global_warming_swindle/index.html
 
But Martin Durkin's a fellow-traveller, at least, of the bizarro ex-Revolutionary Communist Party sect.

More content-free C&P, then.
 
180 Years accurate CO2 - Gas Analysis of Air

Summary
Accurate chemical CO2 gas analyses of air over 180 years show a different trend compared to the literature of IPCC climate change actually published. From 1829 the concentration of carbon dioxide of air in the northern hemisphere fell down from a value of e.g. 400 ppm up to 1900 to less than 300 ppm rising till 1942 to more than 400 ppm. After that maximum it fell down to e.g. 350 ppm and rose again till today, 2006 to 380 ppm. Accurate measurements had been done amongst others by de Saussure 1826, Pettenkofer/v.Gilm 1857, Schulze 1864/71, Farsky 1874, Uffelmann 1886, Letts und Blake 1897, Krogh and Haldane 1904, Benedict 1912, Lundegardh 1920, van Slyke 1929, Dürst and Kreutz 1934 alternatively 1940, Misra 1942 or Scholander 1946 with measuring instruments through which from 1857 (Pettenkofer) an accuracy of +/-0,0006 Vol% to under +/-0,0003 Vol% =~3 ppm (Lundegardh 1926) was achieved. These pioneers of chemistry, biology, botany, medicine and physiology constituted the modern knowledge of metabolism, nutrition science, biochemistry and ecology. Modern climatology ignored their work till today even though it is the basis of all textbooks of the mentioned faculties and was honoured with several Nobel prizes. In total over 90 000 measurements within nearly every year since 180 year gave the following results:

1. There is no constant exponential rising CO2-concentration since preindustrial times but a varying CO2-content of air following the climate. E.G. around 1940 there was a maximum of CO2 of at least 420 ppm, before 1875 there was also a maximum.

2. Historical air analysis by chemical means do not prove a preindustrial CO2-concentration of 285 ppm (IPCC),as modern climatology postulates. In contrast the average in the 19th century in northern hemisphere is 321 ppm and in the 20th century 338 ppm.

3. Todays CO2 value of. 380 ppm, which is considered as threatening has been known several times in the last 200 years, in the 20 th century around 1942 and before 1870 in the 19th century. The maximum CO2-concentration in the 20th century roses to over 420 pmm in 1942.

4. Accurate measurements of CO2 air gas contents had been done from 1857 by chemical methods with a systematical error of maximal 3%. These results were ignored reconstructing the CO2 concentration of air in modern warm period.

5. Callendar and Keeling were the most important founders of the modern greenhouse theory (IPCC) beside Arrhenius. Literature research confirmed that they ignored a big part of available technical papars and selected only a few values to get a validation of their hypothesis of fuel burning induced rise of CO2 in air. Furthermore these authors discussed and reproduced the few selected historic results by chemical methods in a faulty way and propagated an unfounded view of the quality of these methods, without having dealt with its chemical basis.

6. To reconstruct the modern CO2 concentration of air icecores from Antarctica had been used. The presented reconstructions are obviously not accurate enough to show the several variations of carbon dioxide in northern hemisphere.

http://www.warwickhughes.com/agri/BeckCO2short.pdf

CroppedGraphPic.jpg


It is easily seen that

1. atmospheric carbon dioxide fluctuates through 19th and 20th century contradicting the icecore reconstructions.

2. In 20th century we notice one big maximum around 1942 with more than 420 ppm and several little maxima in 1915 and 1905; in 19th century a big maximum occurred before 1870 and perhaps a big maximum in 1820 out of precise measurement area. Little maxima appeared around 1876, 1880 and 1890.

3. CO2 concentrations rises from approx. 1880 to 1930 by some 20 ppm as Callendar speculated in 1938.

4. Big maximas with an amplitude of 100 ppm like the one in the 40s should be easily reproduced with chemical methods (3%). This is not mentioned in modern literature.


Departureintemp.jpg



Notice how on this graph the rise in CO2 concentration, beginning around 1920 and peaking around 1942 at 440 ppm, lags behind the rise in temperature which begins around 1910. It should be the other way round according to the proponents of the bogus AGW hypothesis.
 
So who are this guy's friends, then?

Warwick Hughes said:
Road Toll

Association of British Drivers Excellent comprehensive web site on all issues where drivers are under attack. Their pages on the way environmental issues are twisted to denigrate cars appeals to me. Good links page too incl. Australian and Intnl. links.
http://www .abd.org.uk/

Safe Speed UK site promoting intelligent road safety
http://www .safespeed.org.uk

All information confirming the strong suspicion that these, too, are covert fronts for the ex-RCP sect gratefully received.
 
There's a documentry on UK TV this Thursday from the skeptical point of view. Think it's probably on C4. Have to check.

e2a

Sorry, yep. It's the one referred to above.

One body of opinion amongst the skeptics seems to be. They concede the global temprature is rising but doubt whether man is responsible. However, even if you subscribe to that theory. We still have to deal with it. It infuriates me when peple argue against taking action on that basis. Like admitting the house is on fire, but you didn't start the fire, you only dropped a couple of matches and something else caused the main blaze.
 
xenon_2 said:
They concede the global temprature is rising but doubt whether man is responsible. However, even if you subscribe to that theory. We still have to deal with it. It infuriates me when peple argue against taking action on that basis.


New Scientist letters page said:
* Andrew Goldsworthy London, UK

I read with interest about what the IPCC "didn't tell us" about climate change (10 February, p 7). I was amazed by the illogicality of the sceptics who claim that a large part of global warming is due to changes in solar radiation. They seem to argue that if it were not entirely our fault, we wouldn't have to do very much about it.

Even if a large portion of warming is due to non-human causes, we will still be heading for disaster, and we are obliged to do whatever we can about it. Since we have no control over the sun's radiation, but can control our carbon dioxide emissions, we may still be able offset any change in the sun's radiation by reducing our atmospheric CO2 level. All it means is that we must reduce it even more if we have to compensate for the sun's extra radiation as well.

People hoping to justify minimising any reduction in their CO2 emissions by shifting some of the blame to the sun may have shot themselves in the foot. They have made things worse for themselves, because their argument implies even more stringent targets.

From issue 2592 of New Scientist magazine, 24 February 2007, page 22

more to [email protected] ...
 
^
Exactly. Humanity has to grow up and realise the inpermernence of the conditions that keep us here.

We're going to need technology, hard headed science, the will to change, all with a less greedy attitude to get out of this century retaining anything that resembles civilisation as we know it.
 
I read somewhere recently that the evidence regarding solar flares had largely been discounted now, with respect to 21st century predicted temprature rises. That is, discounted within the last few years. This is a fast moving field of research after all. On a different computer and don't have my bookmarks to show where I read that.

Personally I'm glad the phrase "Global Warming" has largely been dropped for Climate Change. It at least helps to shut up the peroquial winge of how come it's so cold today. Where's this global warming. :rolleyes:
 
xenon_2 said:
I read somewhere recently that the evidence regarding solar flares had largely been discounted now, with respect to 21st century predicted temprature rises...

(1) SOLAR SYSTEM WARMING?
Strata Sphere, 6 March 2007
http://strata-sphere.com/blog/index.php/archives/3434

(2) MIT RESEARCHER FINDS EVIDENCE OF GLOBAL WARMING ON NEPTUNE'S LARGEST MOON
MIT News Office, 24 June 1998
http://web.mit.edu/newsoffice/1998/triton.html

(3) NEW STORM ON JUPITER HINTS AT CLIMATE CHANGE
Sara Goudarzi, USA Today, 4 May 2006
http://www.usatoday.com/tech/science/space/2006-05-04-jupiter-jr-spot_x.htm?POE=TECISVA

(4) GLOBAL CLIMATE CHANGE ON JUPITER
Philip S. Marcus, Nature 428, 828-831 (22 April 2004)
http://www.nature.com/nature/journal/v428/n6985/abs/nature02470.html

(5) GLOBAL WARMING ON PLUTO PUZZLES SCIENTISTS
Robert Roy Britt, Space.com, 9 October 2002
http://www.space.com/scienceastronomy/pluto_warming_021009.html

(6) PLUTO THOUGHT TO BE WARMING UP
ABC News, 26 July 2006
http://www.abc.net.au/news/newsitems/200607/s1697309.htm

(7) 'MARS COMING OUT OF AN ICE AGE'
JPL/NASA, 8 December 2003
http://mars.jpl.nasa.gov/odyssey/newsroom/pressreleases/20031208a.html
 
Cosmoclimatology: a new theory emerges

Changes in the intensity of galactic cosmic rays alter the Earth's cloudiness. A recent experiment has shown how electrons liberated by cosmic rays assist in making aerosols, the building blocks of cloud condensation nuclei, while anomalous climatic trends in Antarctica confirm the role of clouds in helping to drive climate change. Variations in the cosmic-ray influx due to solar magnetic activity account well for climatic fluctuations on decadal, centennial and millennial timescales. Over longer intervals, the changing galactic environment of the solar system has had dramatic consequences, including Snowball Earth episodes. A new contribution to the faint young Sun paradox is also on offer.

Data on cloud cover from satellites, compared with counts of galactic cosmic rays from a ground station, suggested that an increase in cosmic rays makes the world cloudier. This empirical finding introduced a novel connection between astronomical and terrestrial events, making weather on Earth subject to the cosmic-ray accelerators of supernova remnants in the Milky Way. The result was announced in 1996 at the COSPAR space science meeting in Birmingham and published as "Variation of cosmic-ray flux and global cloud coverage – a missing link in solar-climate relationships" (Svensmark and Friis-Christensen 1997).

The title reflected a topical puzzle, that of how to reconcile abundant indications of the Sun's influence on climate (e.g. Herschel 1801, Eddy 1976, Friis-Christensen and Lassen 1991), with the small 0.1% variations in the solar irradiance over a solar cycle measured by satellites. Clouds exert (on average) a strong cooling effect, and cosmic-ray counts vary with the strength of the solar magnetic field, which repels much of the influx of relativistic particles from the galaxy. The connection offers a mechanism for solar-driven climate change much more powerful than changes in solar irradiance.

During the past 10 years, considerations of the galactic and solar influence on climate have progressed so far, and have found such widespread applications, that one can begin to speak of a new paradigm of climate change. I call it cosmoclimatology and in this article I suggest that it is already at least as secure, scientifically speaking, as the prevailing paradigm of forcing by variable greenhouse gases. It has withstood many attempts to refute it and now has a grounding in experimental evidence for a mechanism by which cosmic rays can affect cloud cover.

Cosmoclimatology already interacts creatively with current issues in solar–terrestrial physics and astrophysics and even with astrobiology, in questions about the origin and survival of life in a high-energy universe. All these themes are pursued in a forthcoming book (Svensmark and Calder 2007).
http://www.blackwell-synergy.com/doi/full/10.1111/j.1468-4004.2007.48118.x
 
Bigfish, why do you keep copying and pasting this minority-opinion shit up?

Are you so desperate not to take responsability for things that you're willing to trawl the web for hours and hours finding stuff that agrees with you, filtering out and ignoring anything that doesn't?
 
Global warming: the bogus religion of our age

nick1181 said:
Bigfish, why do you keep copying and pasting this minority-opinion shit up?

Are you so desperate not to take responsability for things that you're willing to trawl the web for hours and hours finding stuff that agrees with you, filtering out and ignoring anything that doesn't?


Like a religion, environmentalism is suffused with hatred for the material world and again, like religion, it requires devotion rather than intellectual rigour from its adherents.

It is intolerant of dissent; those who question the message of doom are regarded as heretics, or 'climate change deniers', to use green parlance.

And, just as in many religions, the route to personal salvation lies in the performance of superstitious rituals, such as changing a lightbulb or arranging for a tree to be planted after every plane journey.

What is so tragic is the way that this dubious ideology has achieved such dominance in our public life.

Politicians love the green agenda, of course, because it means more control, more regulation, more taxes, more summits, and more opportunities for displays of self-important zeal.


Richard Lindzen is Professor of Meteorology at the Massachusetts Institute of Technology.

http://www.dailymail.co.uk/pages/li...ogy.html?in_article_id=440869&in_page_id=1965
 
As I said, why are you copying ands pasting this minority opinion shit up?

So you've found trawled the web and found the opinion of someone who's clearly an idiot (a quote from the daily mail no less) and ignored all the rest.

Why do this?

Why believe the idiots and not the vast majority of (peer-reviewed) people? Why have you decided to be on the side of the fuckwits?
 
that programme on channel 4 last night, mentioned above, was rather interesting. I liked the bit where they blamed margaret thatcher:D
 
In a 1995 article in Harper's Magazine, Ross Gelbspan asserted that Lindzen "charges oil and coal interests $2,500 a day for his consulting services; [and] his 1991 trip to testify before a Senate committee was paid for by Western Fuels and a speech he wrote, entitled 'Global Warming: the Origin and Nature of Alleged Scientific Consensus,' was underwritten by OPEC." source
 
So what do you say to that then Bigfish?

This person who's opinions you've been slavishly repeating has actually been paid to have those opinions by Big Oil....

and you (presumeably) are paid nothing... and meantime your planet's being fucked, and you're arguing vociferously for the wrong side.

Do you feel like a bit of a ninny?
 
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