Public Enemy - Crap/Not Crap?

[XerxesVargas]

-Shut em Down was a big tune.... but I think that was on some other sillilly named album about an apocalypse or summink

Great tune and the albums not too bad - Apocalypse 91 The Enemy Stick Black. It has "By the Time I get to Arizona" on it - which is a great tune.

Greatest Misses has the version of "Shut Em Down" performed on the Word - oincluding as it does a nice little bit of Flav freestyling whislt Chuck waited for the monitors to be turned on.

 

[*factotum*]

used to love p.e. and also saw them at reading '92.

was the whole prof. griff thing and the groups flirtation with anti-semitism thing ever properly addressed though? i know griff got short-shrifted, but was that because of the questionable crap he was spouting, or did chuck d realised that that whole thing was getting too heavy even though he agreed with such dodgy politics?

 

[Shippou-Sensei]

'Fear Of A Black Planet' = the greatest hip hop album of all time.

End of.

it even made a futurama episode title (unless they both parady some other one)

but yes PE is most definatly NOT crap

 

[kained&able]

i remember suggesting the S1W's had a certain Village People charm to someone before and nearly got punched. but they're camp as hell

you do kinda think they are about to start vogueing any second don't you.


dave

 

[boohoo]

you do kinda think they are about to start vogueing any second don't you.


dave

That would be cool. Perhaps, they should have a reunion, with Flavour Fav and his new chums from the Farm - Keith Harris and Orville. A green duck does 'Bring the Noise'. In fact, fuck it, get rid of Flavour and replace him with Orville.

 

[_pH_]

used to love p.e. and also saw them at reading '92.

was the whole prof. griff thing and the groups flirtation with anti-semitism thing ever properly addressed though? i know griff got short-shrifted, but was that because of the questionable crap he was spouting, or did chuck d realised that that whole thing was getting too heavy even though he agreed with such dodgy politics?

I used to love PE (and I still listen to them occasionally) but, yeah, the anti-semitism thing put me off, that and the homophobia ('Meet The G That Killed Me').

 

[_pH_]

That would be cool. Perhaps, they should have a reunion, with Flavour Fav and his new chums from the Farm - Keith Harris and Orville. A green duck does 'Bring the Noise'. In fact, fuck it, get rid of Flavour and replace him with Orville.

LMAO!

 

[nosos]

Fucking amazing at their best, tedious & kinda offensive at their worst.

 

[888]

IT kicks ass!

He does, but he's a bit of a tin foil hat rapper at times.

 

[stavros]

OK if they weren't so absurdly overrated. They seem very much in rockist's mind for hip hop. In terms of turn of the 90s rap crews they were majorly outranked by NWA, Run DMC and the Wu-Tang Clan. The Bomb Squad were nowhere near Dre or the RZA for me.

 

[ska invita]

Greatest Misses has the version of "Shut Em Down" performed on the Word - oincluding as it does a nice little bit of Flav freestyling whislt Chuck waited for the monitors to be turned on.

I've heard the "Greates Misses" record, and its bizarre: all the PE tunes that just weren't good enough (for a variety of reasons) to be released - if your a fan, check it out: its like the soft underbelly of an aligator.

In terms of turn of the 90s rap crews they were majorly outranked by NWA, Run DMC and the Wu-Tang Clan. The Bomb Squad were nowhere near Dre or the RZA for me.

outranked by Run DMC? dont think so.
NWA may have been brasher, but you cant say they come close on musical or lyrical content to PE.
Dre knows how to make a hit, and RZA is kinda quirky, I think, in his productions, but just for bare instrumentals "NAtion of millions..." and "Fear of a Black Planet..." wins over any Dre or RZA albums I have heard...

I used to love PE (and I still listen to them occasionally) but, yeah, the anti-semitism thing put me off, that and the homophobia ('Meet The G That Killed Me').

Chuck has distanced himself wholeheartedly from the Nation of Islam, having gravitated to them after reading black-radical-60's-history and trying to emulate that time. They were more tense and extreme times (LA riots), but thankfully Black America is a little more confident of itself now (because of Hype Williams? *shudder*)

As far as I know the only anti-semitic comments made were by Proffesor Griff (subsequently booted out) and i think the only homophobic comment in "meet the G..." is "Man to man/I don't know if they can/From what I know/The parts don't fit" - hardly BoomByeBye. - I think Chucks offensiveness is overstated.

 

[alef]

I forever associate PE with the Spike Lee film "Do the Right Thing". Besides being an absolutely brilliant film, it heavily promoted "Fight the Power" and was released at their zenith. Neither Spike Lee nor Public Enemy have done too well since then, but that happens....

 

[ska invita]

I forever associate PE with the Spike Lee film "Do the Right Thing". Besides being an absolutely brilliant film, it heavily promoted "Fight the Power" and was released at their zenith. Neither Spike Lee nor Public Enemy have done too well since then, but that happens....

-was thinking the other day how prophetic "do the right thing" was - preempitng the LA Riots by two years.
-Spike fell off: i think he fancies himself a bit too...

 

[DogNose]

Wow, all this talk about PE is giving me flashbacks! I liked them in the late 80s, mainly because most of the mainstream music at the time was dominated by mindless dance music and silly 'pretty boy' pop metal bands like Poison and Skid Row. I agree that PE hit their peak around 89, when 'Do the Right Thing' came out. Within a couple of years, the beat of rap had speeded up, and PE were 'out-funked' by groups like Naughty by Nature, the FU-Shnickens, and House of Pain. I also liked a lot of the early rap-metal cross-over bands like Biohazard. By the mid to late 90s rap started to degenerate into formulaic crap, and it still mostly sounds that way today. Once in a blue moon someone interesting comes along (like the Black Eyed Peas), but for the most part its just group after group 'going through the motions'.

I guess its basically the same old story....once a style becomes 'popular', its time for innovation has pretty much passed.

 

[ska invita]

I guess its basically the same old story....once a style becomes 'popular', its time for innovation has pretty much passed.

Some Truly Innovative rappers since PE:
Dr Octagon (aka Kool keith)
Mos Def + Talib Kweli
Common
Capital A, Quasimoto and Madlib (all with albums due out this year)
Immortal Technique
heard good things about El-P
...
how about Handsome Boy Modeling School

 

[upsidedownwalrus]

Does anyone dare knock the highly respected political beats though questionable fundy-islamic ties of Chuck D et al?

I'm very dubious about these alleged ties.

Didn't they get rid of Professor Griff early on because of his support for the NoI?

 

[liberty]

Not my bag really

 

[top_biller]

In terms of turn of the 90s rap crews they were majorly outranked by NWA, Run DMC and the Wu-Tang Clan. The Bomb Squad were nowhere near Dre or the RZA for me.

Yeh, Run DMC were at the top of their game in 1991...

I've got Return of the King on cassette if you want to buy it

 

[kakuma]

give me kid n play anyday

 

[Blagsta]

not crap

 

[Abjekt]

I guess its basically the same old story....once a style becomes 'popular', its time for innovation has pretty much passed.

True of the mainstream for sure, but the underground scene is evolving year after year. I am sure this will make me out to be an elitest [sp?] little so and so but there we have it.

 

[BadlyDrawnGirl]

OK if they weren't so absurdly overrated. They seem very much in rockist's mind for hip hop.

That's a theory that has come up here before. The reason that this may seem to be the case is simply because they crossed over and were powerful enough to grab white rock audiences by the balls. NWA crossed over to a certain extent, although their rhymes and samples weren't anything like as tight IMO.

In terms of turn of the 90s rap crews they were majorly outranked by NWA, Run DMC and the Wu-Tang Clan. The Bomb Squad were nowhere near Dre or the RZA for me.

The other crucial reason why PE were the greatest was (and I don't mean this to sound snobbish) their incredible intelligence and insight; they actually had stuff to say about life and political issues outside their own 'hood and were refreshingly unfixated with their own sexual prowess/gangsta credentials.

 

[stavros]

I'm too young to remember but was it not refreshing to hear "Straight Outta Compton"? I can't imagine hip hop that provocative had been done before. Likewise the semi-fictional characterised far-Eastern stories of the Wu. Public Enemy, at least nowadays, give the impression that they're preaching to the converted, unlike "....Compton" and "....36 Chambers" which alerted me to just how complex yet simplistic Dre and the RZA were/are with their beats.

 

[Iam]

Not crap. Well, not until later, anyway.

 

[BadlyDrawnGirl]

I'm too young to remember but was it not refreshing to hear "Straight Outta Compton"? I can't imagine hip hop that provocative had been done before. Likewise the semi-fictional characterised far-Eastern stories of the Wu. Public Enemy, at least nowadays, give the impression that they're preaching to the converted, unlike "....Compton" and "....36 Chambers" which alerted me to just how complex yet simplistic Dre and the RZA were/are with their beats.

Yeah, 'SOC' and '36 Chambers' were great records, but I never felt they were quite as original, dangerous, politically inflammable or just fundamentally exciting as 'Yo! Bum Rush The Show' when that came out - a bit like comparing 'Another Music In A Different Kitchen' with 'The Clash' from the punk era I suppose. In '87 hip hop in the UK charts was nearly all entertainment-driven Adidas-hop, and Run DMC and Kurtis Blow aside, acts tended to be either short-lived or of the hip pop novelty variety. PE were a bomb in the sportswear shop, and IMO where the genre got serious - and angry.

 

[BadlyDrawnGirl]

Not crap. Well, not until later, anyway.

Sadly, that's the other side of the PE coin...they burned so brightly that they comparatively fizzled out later on. I'll still listen to anything they do, but I feel that 'Fear...' was the last great album (almost more of a news bulletin and political manifesto set to beats than an album) and that 'Apocalypse '91' was the last really good one...

 

[Skate]

Not crap.

I love their old albums, but one of my favourite albums of theirs, lyrically and musically, is more recent: There's A Poison Going On.

Haven't heard Revolverlution yet though, got all of them apart from that one

 

[stavros]

Yeah, 'SOC' and '36 Chambers' were great records, but I never felt they were quite as original, dangerous, politically inflammable or just fundamentally exciting as 'Yo! Bum Rush The Show' when that came out

Did "YBRTS" cause governmental alerts in the way "SOC" did? I doubt it. For me NWA launched the whole gangsta-bling segment of the genre which continues to be so vibrant today with the likes of crunk, whereas like I said PE seemed to be preaching to the converted and I can't see them having had anywhere near the influence. The Wu are/were unique and as such it's difficult to see any successors to them beyond their solo escapades. Yes PE get a lot of non-obvious fans into hip hop but for me they remain merely the entry door for stuff that goes way beyond them.

 

[BadlyDrawnGirl]

Did "YBRTS" cause governmental alerts in the way "SOC" did? I doubt it. For me NWA launched the whole gangsta-bling segment of the genre which continues to be so vibrant today with the likes of crunk, whereas like I said PE seemed to be preaching to the converted and I can't see them having had anywhere near the influence. The Wu are/were unique and as such it's difficult to see any successors to them beyond their solo escapades. Yes PE get a lot of non-obvious fans into hip hop but for me they remain merely the entry door for stuff that goes way beyond them.

But there was no political hip hop before 'YBRTS' at all. Hip hop was seen as a novelty. As for 'SOC', I agree it was an important record, but as for introducing the whole gangsta-bling segment, frankly I wish they hadn't bothered 'cause that's been the genre's achilles heel ever since. I'd much rather hear what Chuck D has to say about weapons of the first world, or why 911 is a joke, or 'Black Steel...' than a load of empty macho threats and commentary on the size of 50 Cent's cock. If PE were The Beatles of hip hop, NWA were Pink Floyd.

 

[ouchmonkey]

Did "YBRTS" cause governmental alerts in the way "SOC" did? I doubt it. For me NWA launched the whole gangsta-bling segment of the genre which continues to be so vibrant today with the likes of crunk, whereas like I said PE seemed to be preaching to the converted and I can't see them having had anywhere near the influence.

With respect - that's just arse.
PE weren't even having proper hits at that point but there were riots at the shows - the fact they were coming to town was local news to people who had no idea who they were. The media viewpoint was that they were coming over from Def Jam - who'd already sent the Beastie Boys who had caused national outrage and that this lot weren't just pushing drunken idiocy and nicking badges off VW's they were preaching black power and revolution.
The reaction to NWA was the same but with added "oh it's this again..."
the audience they came to claim was the one PE built for them and SOC just doesn't stand up to Nation of Millions. Eazy E in particular is just so weak.