Proposal Mayday 2009

[The Black Hand]

Butchers shall we start the first organising meeting for this idea v. soon?

Hopefully this will kick off a series of wider planning and consultation meetings. We'll see eh Mr Apron.

 

[butchersapron]

I rather think you missed the sarcasm in my posts #57-58.

 

[The Black Hand]

I rather think you missed the sarcasm in my posts #57-58.

I didn't - I was just bein provocative as usual. I do think there is a lack of political education, national discussions and structure within the movement. Infact, I know so, this is NOT contraversial. And as I have said before, do you want it continue, or do you want to do something to change it and improve all our chances?

 

[TopCat]

The lack of discussion of a topic such as this shows that people do not seriously want to confront the problems the movement has. Instead, it's 'petty bitching business as usual', rather than serious politics.

Politics means real world discussion not a load of virtual shite, and it is in the real world that political progress will occur. Not online...

Perhaps if an action was called by someone with a rather better track record than yourself, you might get a better response.

 

[TopCat]

I didn't - I was just bein provocative as usual. I do think there is a lack of political education, national discussions and structure within the movement. Infact, I know so, this is NOT contraversial. And as I have said before, do you want it continue, or do you want to do something to change it and improve all our chances?

What fucking movement? Bowel movement?

 

[kabbes]

How does one "organise" a "class struggle"? Serious question. Surely class struggle is an ineffible concept, not a tangible event?

Anyway, is the plan for another load of nonsense like putting grass on statues' heads? It was quite amusing to watch on the news the first time round but it would be a bit dull if repeated.

 

[The Black Hand]

Perhaps if an action was called by someone with a rather better track record than yourself, you might get a better response.

My track record is fantastic

 

[The Black Hand]

How does one "organise" a "class struggle"? Serious question. Surely class struggle is an ineffible concept, not a tangible event?

Anyway, is the plan for another load of nonsense like putting grass on statues' heads? It was quite amusing to watch on the news the first time round but it would be a bit dull if repeated.

No. Its whatever is designed, it really is wide open.

 

[kabbes]

I've got an idea -- everybody goes and gets jobs, bunch of bloody hippies that they are.

 

[Steve Booth]

The anarchist Sealed Knot society?

Anyway, is the plan for another load of nonsense like putting grass on statues' heads? It was quite amusing to watch on the news the first time round but it would be a bit dull if repeated.

Fair enough comment and I agree that we shouldn't try to repeat events, or re-enact stuff. But the idea of having a conference like that held in 2000, or something like the talks and get togethers held every October with the London anarchist bookfair isn't a bad one is it?

The premise behind the thread is a good one. Some people believe they want more than just the once a year bookfair event. So, if we want to organise something else, say around Mayday, the question becomes what shape and form should this take?

There's going to be a bookfair in Bradford in the middle of May at the 1 in 12 (shameless plug), and other people mentioned local Mayday events, with people helping on bookstalls etc. So perhaps the answer is a regional get together....

 

[The Black Hand]

I think regional events should happen anyway and as well. What is sorely needed is a more than once a year event. Anarchists really do not put their ideas seriously to the test, it's a shame really that the standards are so low. The option is here and in front of us.

DO we want the pathetic state of affairs to continue OR do we start planning a way out of the very very deep rut everybody is in? Saying that, some peoples rut is deeper than others

 

[kabbes]

Since this thread doesn't seem to have much traffic, can I hijack it to ask some hopefully relevant questions?

1) What do you hope to get out of a big demonstration?
2) Do you think that the kind of demonstrations seen in the past are helpful to this goal?

I am guessing that there are two general answers question 1, along the lines of:

* To show people that the way that they live need not be accepted as inevitable and to get them thinking about this; and
* To persuade them that an "anarchist" (or other) lifestyle is preferable.

This then leads to MY answer to the second question:

* No, I don't think that, for example, the 2000 demonstration was remotely successful to these ends. In fact, I think it was actively harmful.

I think it constituted a Good Day Out for those involved and allowed the participants to enjoy the illusion that they were helping to "smash the state". However, I think that for those not involved, it came across as a bunch of petulant hippies with a big chip on their shoulder and who didn't really understand how the world works that just wanted to disrupt people. You think people are impressed that their office windows were put through or that their favourite shop was grafittied? Or do you think that this just put their backs up and turned them against the demonstrators?

Now don't get me wrong -- I don't think that those involved actually were a "bunch of petulant hippies (etc.)". But I think that is how it was perceived, because anybody not directly involved in the movement had the message entirely filtered through the mass media, and this is how it was interpreted for them. And this wasn't helped by the actions and events that were chosen as a demonstration.

If you want to win hearts and minds, this is not the way to do it.

 

[TopCat]

Yeah because Capitalism will just fall over of you appeal correctly to peoples hearts and minds.

 

[kabbes]

Yeah because Capitalism will just fall over of you appeal correctly to peoples hearts and minds.

Do you think this is an adequate answer? Do you think this attitude will help?

 

[brasicritique]

There's alway's your bowel movement to consider.

thats he second time you have used bowel movement theory still if there is one thing your many posts has demonstrated is that while wallowing in your own shit you now think you are an expert on bodiliy waste fluids wether this is becuase you have your head up your own anus is a mute point still if turtle head politics is where you think its at....

 

[brasicritique]

What a load of fucking rubbish, you want to get a life.

i hate to say it but.......

 

[The Black Hand]

Yeah because Capitalism will just fall over of you appeal correctly to peoples hearts and minds.

But meetings and conferences do play a part in a movement, or even the sort or type of happenings I think you have in mind TC. At the minute there is no movement cos we do not act like one. The sects stay in their sects and so it goes on, to be different we have to act differently, and then something may develop which deserves being called a movement... The 'sects as sects' behaviour has already gone on way too long...