Philosophy and women (rant)
- Thread starter smmudge
- Start date
phildwyer said:
Why are there so few women represented in about every form of published work? Purely a matter of patriarchal history of societies or not?
I think it must be. Ibn Khaldun (founder of sociology) already wrote that a society which deprives half of its population from active participation is bound to degenerate into poverty (and he meant material and intellectual poverty both).
salaam.
Nikolai
Well-Known Member
Aldebaran said:
TRUE! The only reason there are and have been less female philosophers (not to mention practically all other professions as well) is due precisely to the patriachy. Women would a). have not been respected from the outset b). appeared only as a threat to the male dominated profession c). been hugely discouraged due to the fact that no other women were philosophers d). been too occupied and time deprieved with their obligatory home/child care role e). been oppressed even if they had tried f). been conditioned and tacitly ingrained with their so-called their roles in society and g). suffered from lower self-esteem due to their subordination
gorski
customised free radical
As I wrote earlier...
It's not just disrespect - it's the lack of any real opportunities, fair and fighting chances, lack of encouragement and so forth...
What can one expect... [from women or men in such positions] - what will be created by such persons, if one has no tools, no chances, no legal or any other recognised position, where one is perceived as anything except a Subject [in the Modern sense of the word, as in "the originator of action" etc., as opposed to the English meaning of the word, meaning "an object", as in "Her majesty's subjects" - ain't there so much of the stuff in England in general...
]...?
Thousands and thousands upon thousands of years of that [and much, much worse!!!] and...
However... Even so... Or in spite of all of that... Things are starting to change!!!
And so a certain Miss Luxemburg might have something so say about that... [no women in the profession]... Or Hannah Arendt or we can go to the sciences and mention various Marie Curies of this world (born Maria Skłodowska) or Mileva Einstein (Maric)...
These guys have put them together in a jolly manner: http://www.iwaswondering.org/index2.html?gclid=CJCQzZiI6JACFQJEMAodgyewOg
More here: http://bubl.ac.uk/LINK/w/womeninscience.htm
http://library.thinkquest.org/20117/
One can join: http://www.awis.org/
Etc. etc. etc.
It's not just disrespect - it's the lack of any real opportunities, fair and fighting chances, lack of encouragement and so forth...
What can one expect... [from women or men in such positions] - what will be created by such persons, if one has no tools, no chances, no legal or any other recognised position, where one is perceived as anything except a Subject [in the Modern sense of the word, as in "the originator of action" etc., as opposed to the English meaning of the word, meaning "an object", as in "Her majesty's subjects" - ain't there so much of the stuff in England in general...
]...?Thousands and thousands upon thousands of years of that [and much, much worse!!!] and...
However... Even so... Or in spite of all of that... Things are starting to change!!!
And so a certain Miss Luxemburg might have something so say about that... [no women in the profession]... Or Hannah Arendt or we can go to the sciences and mention various Marie Curies of this world (born Maria Skłodowska) or Mileva Einstein (Maric)...
These guys have put them together in a jolly manner: http://www.iwaswondering.org/index2.html?gclid=CJCQzZiI6JACFQJEMAodgyewOg
More here: http://bubl.ac.uk/LINK/w/womeninscience.htm
http://library.thinkquest.org/20117/
One can join: http://www.awis.org/
Etc. etc. etc.
frogwoman
Let them eat newts
Maybe it's because most women aren't into the kind of mental masturbation that a lot of philosophy seems to involve. Besides, we've never really had time to sit around and "meditate" like Kant or Descartes did, we were always expected to do the cooking, childcare, etc and run around after our husbands.
Anyone see that programme last week about the priest from Sussex who went off to find enlightment at the Shaolin temple in China?
He ended up at a Buddhist retreat in the mountains where the monks practised a form of meditation Kung-Fu exercises.
But the retreat was originally founded by Buddhist nuns who as far as we were shown didn't meditate but just got on with growing food, cooking and cleaning. The priest didn't ask their views on Buddhism or enlightenment, just a 'so how do you find it living with all these men and not having sex' question.
He ended up at a Buddhist retreat in the mountains where the monks practised a form of meditation Kung-Fu exercises.
But the retreat was originally founded by Buddhist nuns who as far as we were shown didn't meditate but just got on with growing food, cooking and cleaning. The priest didn't ask their views on Buddhism or enlightenment, just a 'so how do you find it living with all these men and not having sex' question.
smmudge said:
But if you can look pretty AND think, it's a winning combo! That goes for men too, although you might need to alter the word 'pretty' a wee bit.
As for the media and advertising world, it's a parallel world, one which is supposed to stop us from thinking.
If you want to gain greater understandings for why this situation occurs that you have put your finger on, try reading stuff from erich fromm, who's no philosopher, rather a psychoanalyst whose starting point is a synthesis between freud and marx. You see, and this is partly responsible for the less-than-hoped-for gains from feminism, it seems inherent in human nature to seek those who we can identify as lower in the pecking order than ourselves.
By way of example, i've often thought about how terrible racism is, yet the original victims of racism, blacks, no doubt had terrible attitudes from the men towards the women. So if i feel sorry for an asian or black man who cops ugly racism in britain, i can let my mind wonder and ask myself how he treats his fellow women.
It is a similar scenario to the one you paint and just shows the ugly side of humanity, where they can only measure their worth by being above others.
invisibleplanet
porter des cornes
A few female Greek Mathematicians and Philosophers for you!
Themistokleia, Theano of Thurii, Damo of Crotona, Arignote of Samos, Myria (Myia), Deino, Eloris of Samos, Melissa, Tymicha, Ptolemais of Cyrene, Cleobulina of Rhodes, Ekkelo of Luciania, Cheilonis, Kratesikleia, Lasthenieia of Arcadia/Mantinea, Aspasia of Miletus, Arria, Axiothea of Phlius, Habrotelieia, Echekrateeia of Philius, Tyrsenis of Sybaris, Ryndako, Peisirhode of Tarentum, Theadousa, Boio of Argos, Vavelyca of Argos, Kleaechma, Diotima, Vitale, Periktione, Lasthenia, Aesara of Lcania, Axiothea of Philesia, Nikarete of Corinthos, Hipparchia the Cynic, Arete of Crete, Pythais, Hypatia of Alexandria
Hypatia was murdered by Christians in 415 CE
Themistokleia, Theano of Thurii, Damo of Crotona, Arignote of Samos, Myria (Myia), Deino, Eloris of Samos, Melissa, Tymicha, Ptolemais of Cyrene, Cleobulina of Rhodes, Ekkelo of Luciania, Cheilonis, Kratesikleia, Lasthenieia of Arcadia/Mantinea, Aspasia of Miletus, Arria, Axiothea of Phlius, Habrotelieia, Echekrateeia of Philius, Tyrsenis of Sybaris, Ryndako, Peisirhode of Tarentum, Theadousa, Boio of Argos, Vavelyca of Argos, Kleaechma, Diotima, Vitale, Periktione, Lasthenia, Aesara of Lcania, Axiothea of Philesia, Nikarete of Corinthos, Hipparchia the Cynic, Arete of Crete, Pythais, Hypatia of Alexandria
Hypatia was murdered by Christians in 415 CE
