ymu
Niall Ferguson's deep-cover sock-puppet
How the fuck do pharmaceutical companies make money out of surgery? Fuck's sake fela - engage brain first.
Pfizer - biggest criminal fine in US history ($2.3bn)
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Exactly. But in britain what gets me is that they do have a real third option at election time, but never go for it... and that's an interesting thing to mull over too.
In a democracy we get the leaders we deserve. If we reelect a lying murdering criminal i'm afraid it leaves us complicit as a people as a whole. But this unpalatable truth is not a place many people wish to venture, far better to point fingers and blame the leaders or the dreadful media that keeps on getting bought.
It's not as if we have much choice though. Other than the choice not to vote, which an increasing number of people are exercising. One wonders how low voter turnout will have to get before the system is exposed as a farce?
Wolveryeti
Detty Pig
I sometimes think prosecutions against inviduals would work better than fines in cases like these. The end users are probably going to foot the bill for this fine and the cunts responsible will likely have covered their ass.
Johnny Canuck3
Well-Known Member
Don't do (legal) drugs kids
This is why people get para about vaccines and whatnot....might be misguided occasionally, but big business ain't one for nurturing public trust is it really? They couldn't give a fuck.
But everythings like that, isn't it? It's like the chinese putting an antifreeze ingredient into toothpaste, or the melamine in baby formula.
ymu
Niall Ferguson's deep-cover sock-puppet
Surgery is often an alternative to a lifetime of drug treatment. Medical devices, like replacement hips or pacemakers, aren't manufactured by pharmaceutical companies. Anaesthetic is cheap.
If you had an actual example in mind, explain it because your original comment makes no sense.
I see two valid choices for britain at least. Voting back in the liberals after decades out of power. This will send even the media (and of course the politicians) the message that the system according to labour and tories is spent, the public is rejecting both because of the system.
Or for 70, 80% of the vote, whatever the figure, to vote by writing 'nobody to vote for'. That is, instead of just not voting, go to the voting station and actively register one's inability to vote for anybody since none of them represent their interests.
Until that happens, nothing's going to change. Meanwhile plenty of people are going to be made ill from the drugs they're prescribed by doctors. Some will die.
You're writing here with a distinctly more approachable voice. I'm not sure much surgery comes alone, i'd think that nearly all of it requires pills before to prepare the body, and pills after to settle the body.
Heart surgery for example, and there's heaps of that in the US, not sure about the UK. I can't say for sure, but i find it most unlikely the recipients will suddenly not need pills after the op.
Anyhow, it does seem fair to say that surgery may dent the profits of big pharma, which i thought when you replied to me. But i'm not inclined to debate properly when you speak the way you did before.
Not everything no. But even if we go with your premise, does it mean you accept this state of affairs? Because you write with an air of resignation that nothing can be done about this gambling with our lives.
Friend had a heart attack & procedure a while back. Tons of pills afterward & the doc said they put them on the highest doses they can stand & for the long term. It's CYA for the docs I think.
London_Calling
Pleasant and unpatronising
And, from another pov, that which 7/7, 21/7 and this weeks plane bombers represent.
an example that ymu requested.
I have always thought that procedures do not negate the need for pills.
What's CYA?
Sorry mate, but can you translate this for a non-UK resident?! I think i know what you mean by 7/7, but it sheds no light on the rest of it which makes me question even this understanding of mine.
ymu
Niall Ferguson's deep-cover sock-puppet
Surgery doesn't necessarily negate the need for any pills at all, and you would not expect it to. But, if there is a choice between surgical and medical management to achieve the same result, surgical management rarely requires more pills than medical management, as you might expect.
Heart disease, as it happens, is one of the most obvious examples where surgery often competes with a lifetime of pills. Not a good example, for your purposes.
There is an important point to be made about unnecessary treatment offered for financial gain or clinical vanity - whether it's surgery or something else - but it's not all driven by the pharmaceutical industry. The fraudulent trials of high-dose chemotherapy for breast cancer were conducted by a doctor looking to make a name for himself, for example. Academics and bog-standard quacks are just as capable of dishonesty. Fancy that.
Heart disease, as it happens, is one of the most obvious examples where surgery often competes with a lifetime of pills. Not a good example, for your purposes.
There is an important point to be made about unnecessary treatment offered for financial gain or clinical vanity - whether it's surgery or something else - but it's not all driven by the pharmaceutical industry. The fraudulent trials of high-dose chemotherapy for breast cancer were conducted by a doctor looking to make a name for himself, for example. Academics and bog-standard quacks are just as capable of dishonesty. Fancy that.
Cover Your Ass. They pack em full of drugs to prevent another heart attack even though the drugs can have bad side effects. But if they don't pack em full of drugs & there is another attack, they're afraid they'll be blamed.
You're beginning to sound like a rep for a big pharma company.... (just tongue in cheek!).
The whole industry is riddled with unnecessary pills, treatment, surgery, procedures. How could it be otherwise when cancer rates and heart disease can be substantially reduced amongst wealthy populations with the knowledge that is out there, yet instead the medical industry prefers to continue dealing with the symptoms and the status quo does its very best to continue this fatal state of affairs.
Your example is just the tip of the iceberg, and the outcome is people riddled with unnecessary bad health, being kept alive by better procedures but with what quality of life?
Here we are, one of the biggest companies getting a world record fine, and it's already, one week later, completely out of the news. The status quo has done an excellent job in keeping people confused over what is best for their health. And that status quo definitely includes many doctors.
Sad.
The wealthiest nation on earth. The biggest empire in history. The nation with arguably the greatest talent in most fields.
And the country with the most obese people, the most-fucked up health of any developed nation, and a system that seems oblivious to change because of fear and status quo.
The encouraging aspect of all this is that it does appear that finally enough people are making enough of an impression to improve things with regard to the health of the nation. But it's very slow!
Meanwhile, the rest of the world are now incorporating the american diet and approach to food, and in parallel are acquiring the same disease patterns as the US has had for at least half a century.
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