Pavement cycling

[Donna Ferentes]

You're talking out of your arse, as usual. No-one has to rely on me in order to ensure their self-preservation. I have never hit or even come close to hitting a pedestrian while riding on the pavement. I thought I made that clear in the original post.There we go. Perhaps you should learn to read properly.

Perhaps you should learn to follow properly. You are deciding, here, that you are safe to be on the pavement. That makes you in charge of the situation, not the pedestrian, not the law. That means that they have to rely on you. That is a simple and straighforward point, albeit one apparently easily avoided.

 

[Crispy]

I hate that junction. Cycling to work, coming down Brixton Road, toward Kennington Road, I really, really dislike having to cut across lanes to get to the cycle path bit near the lights - you know near the bank and post office as you continue down Kennington Road towards Elephant...I haven't been that way for a while, but when I discovered this morning that due to road works, two lanes have gone down to one, and the cycle path bit has disappeared!

Horrible isn't it? That's one junction where I'd like to see cyclist priority green lights, just so I can get round to the next cyle lane before cars start trying to under and overtake me because they didn't get in lane. (I was talking about riding the pavement on the other side, btw - right by the park.)

Of course, I could take the back roads, but it takes twice as long - there's no space to get up to speed.

 

[5T3R30TYP3]

Perhaps you should learn to follow properly. You are deciding, here, that you are safe to be on the pavement. That makes you in charge of the situation, not the pedestrian, not the law. That means that they have to rely on you. That is a simple and straighforward point, albeit one apparently easily avoided.

Use your brain, child. This is the real world, not some fantasy land where bicycles are inherently dangerous no matter what speed they are travelling at.

If you honestly think that riding a bike at jogging pace is dangerous, then you are more of a moron than I thought. I don't go around in top gear with my eyes closed. I ride slowly with my fingers on the brakes while constantly looking out for people. That's why I've never hit anyone and would bet everything I own that I never will.

Like I say, if you ever get hit by a car at 50mph, or if it happens to one of your friends (if you have any) and have to watch them bleed and suffer like I had to, then perhaps you'll think differently about this magic law which you seem to think is a fix for everything.

 

[Crispy]

Perhaps you should learn to follow properly. You are deciding, here, that you are safe to be on the pavement. That makes you in charge of the situation, not the pedestrian, not the law. That means that they have to rely on you. That is a simple and straighforward point, albeit one apparently easily avoided.

But there's nothing inherently dangerous in slowly and safely riding a bicycle along a pavement. Your safety is always out of your hands - you never know what the person next to you is going to do. You could be running for a bus when the guy to your right sharply turns into you as he goes to the shops - you fall over and sprain your ankle - what's the solution, turning signals and lane discipline?

 

[tobyjug]

Like I say, if you ever get hit by a car at 50mph, or if it happens to one of your friends (if you have any) and have to watch them bleed and suffer like I had to, then perhaps you'll think differently about this magic law which you seem to think is a fix for everything.

Nothing will change my mind about lycra lout cyclists riding on the pavement.
I have zero tolerance for it.

 

[5T3R30TYP3]

That's your problem. Personally I'd rather not risk getting killed by a motor vehicle just because you don't like it.

 

[Yossarian]

Nothing will change my mind about lycra lout cyclists riding on the pavement.
I have zero tolerance for it.

Do they even *have* pavements where you live?

 

[toggle]

Nothing will change my mind about lycra lout cyclists riding on the pavement.
I have zero tolerance for it.

are all cyclists louts?

 

[dessiato]

As I seem to remember saying in previous debates on this subject, I shouldn't have to rely on whether you're a careful cyclist or not. I'm entitled to walk on pavement without worrying about being hit by bicycles, because they shouldn't be on the pavement.

It's an amazing thing, how people can't grasp that it's not up to them to decide whether the transport laws should be observed or not. Not speeding drivers, not pavement cyclists.

Hear hear

 

[Crispy]

Nothing will change my mind about lycra lout cyclists riding on the pavement.
I have zero tolerance for it.

Me too. What about nice old slow and safe and careful 5T3R30TYP3?

 

[Donna Ferentes]

I don't go around in top gear with my eyes closed. I ride slowly with my fingers on the brakes while constantly looking out for people. That's why I've never hit anyone and would bet everything I own that I never will.

But I wouldn't make such a bet, and should not be expected to, by you or by anybody else.

Like I say, if you ever get hit by a car at 50mph, or if it happens to one of your friends (if you have any) and have to watch them bleed and suffer like I had to, then perhaps you'll think differently about this magic law which you seem to think is a fix for everything.

If you find the roads unsafe then you have the right to do the same as I do, which is to use the pavement as a pedestrian. What you do not have the right to do is make up the rules to suit yourself ,which involves imposing your rules on other people. Basic civics, really.

 

[exosculate]

I'm in favour of strict adherence to traffic laws, yes. I'm in favour of people defying laws that are socially unjust provided they're prepared to face up to the possibility of punishment, too. Hard to see cycling on the pavement and being told that it's all right to do so in quite the same light.

So when you decide something is unjust its OK

 

[exosculate]

Do they even *have* pavements where you live?

I don't think they have roads

 

[Donna Ferentes]

But there's nothing inherently dangerous in slowly and safely riding a bicycle along a pavement.

Then if you think so, I propose you lobby for a change in the law. That's reasonable. What's not reasonable in cyclists deciding for themselves - and consequently, for everybody else, who of course they have not asked - what the rules should be.

 

[Callie]

Parks are good for it (of course, you've got to get there first!) Battersea park is particularly nice - big wide road all the way round it with plenty to see and do along the way...

The problem is cycling in a park is not quite the same as cycling on the road...so how do you get from being able to cycle in a park with no double decker buses whizzing past you and only a dog or two to worry about to being able to cope with cycling on the road with other vehicles? There doesnt seem to be any in between area, not in the area that I live anyway. Why arent there more cycle lanes?

 

[tom k&e]

Anyone who's scared to cycle on the roads because of the risk of death or serious injury is a fucking pansy.

As for the idea that you can't seriously injure someone on a bike - tell that to the guy I hospitalised when offroading some years back. That taught the cunt not to walk his dog on a firetrail ever again

 

[5T3R30TYP3]

But I wouldn't make such a bet, and should not be expected to, by you or by anybody else.

If you find the roads unsafe then you have the right to do the same as I do, which is to use the pavement as a pedestrian. What you do not have the right to do is make up the rules to suit yourself ,which involves imposing your rules on other people. Basic civics, really.

Well, I don't much fancy walking six to ten miles, and I can't afford the bus. I don't see why I should give up riding my bike if I'm not hurting anyone else.

 

[LJo]

My old route took me along the North Circular. I had no problem riding on the pavement there. There are no pedestrians as the North Circular is built to accomodate cars, only cars. Not people. Or bikes.

Plenty of police cars went past me, I was never stopped. If I had been I would have politely argued that riding on a pavement with no pedestrians along an eight-lane road is not a huge threat to society but I would have accepted punishment for breaking the law, had anyone ever challenged me. Nobody ever did, possibly because I was doing no harm to anyone and nobody gave a toss.

I would never, ever ride on a pavement where there are pedestrians. I do not go through red lights. I stop at zebra crossings. I try to foster a good image of cyclists.

It would be nice if pedestrians paid me the equal courtesy of not stepping into the road without looking, not stagggering along kerbs wearing completely black clothes when pissed, not leaping into the road when the lights are green and dodging cars as well as me, and staying out of cycle lanes...but luckily I have always managed to skid out of their way in time.

My husband got shouted at by a pedestrian the other day because 'Your cycle lights are too bright!'

Silly me, there I was, thinking that was the point of having lights on your bike.

 

[Donna Ferentes]

Well, I don't much fancy walking six to ten miles, and I can't afford the bus. I don't see why I should give up riding my bike if I'm not hurting anyone else.

Because the rules are made for everybody, not just you.

 

[Crispy]

The problem is cycling in a park is not quite the same as cycling on the road...so how do you get from being able to cycle in a park with no double decker buses whizzing past you and only a dog or two to worry about to being able to cope with cycling on the road with other vehicles? There doesnt seem to be any in between area, not in the area that I live anyway. Why arent there more cycle lanes?

Cos cyclists are in a minority and don't have voting power

 

[exosculate]

Then if you think so, I propose you lobby for a change in the law.

You sound like a Daily Mail columnist on question time.

 

[5T3R30TYP3]

Anyone who's scared to cycle on the roads because of the risk of death or serious injury is a fucking pansy.

have you ever seen someone come close to death after being hit by a speeding driver?

As for the idea that you can't seriously injure someone on a bike - tell that to the guy I hospitalised when offroading some years back. That taught the cunt not to walk his dog on a firetrail ever again

How you can compare this to off-road riding is beyong me...

 

[exosculate]

Because the rules are made for everybody, not just you.

Oh yes I forgot all rules are made clearly for everybody.

 

[5T3R30TYP3]

Because the rules are made for everybody, not just you.

And your point is?

 

[Donna Ferentes]

You sound like a Daily Mail columnist on question time.

Well, not really. I sound like somebody who doesn't much like people who think they're above the rules. One reason for this is that people like that are the very last people who can be trusted to put other people first.

 

[tobyjug]

Do they even *have* pavements where you live?

In the immediate vicinity yes, and street lights.

 

[tobyjug]

are all cyclists louts?

Only the bastards who ride on pavements, and the ones who ride at night with no lights. (Both kinds appear to be in the majority locally.)

 

[exosculate]

Well, not really. I sound like somebody who doesn't much like people who think they're above the rules. One reason for this is that people like that are the very last people who can be trusted to put other people first.

No you have already admitted you would breach the law when you think its unjust, which intrinsically imples you are putting yourself above the law (rules) when you see fit.

 

[exosculate]

In the immediate vicinity yes, and street lights.

Cycle paths?

 

[5T3R30TYP3]

Actually Miss Ferentes you've completely changed my perspective on this. Obviously every driver on the road obeys the rules, so that means I should too. I mean, drivers never go too fast, always look before pulling out of junctions, and always stop at red lights. They never talk on mobile phones while driving and they always check their mirrors! How could I be stupid enought not to realise this? And I'm putting so many people in danger by riding on the pavement. What an inconsiderate person I've been all these years. And anyway, the all-important rules are more important than the safety of my own life. Thank you, thank you so much for opening my eyes!