Parking Ticket By CCTV

[zoltan]

Don't bank on it. Although I've only heard of the numberplate thing in connection with Sainsbury so far, ECP do for a good number of stores & centre owners.

We had bother with them here at a centre with them ticketing student cars, despite it also being the parking for a nearby college. Council (then owners) & just about everybody else involved more or less disowned ECP & their methods.

I wote on this a while ago - they tried to get me at Lidl twice and I did a bit of research - its 99.99999999999999999999999% unenforceable & even if it did go to county court, they could only possibly get loss repaid -i.e the cost of you being in a paid space overlong - which isnt an issue at Sainsbos with free parking - there is no provision under a civil action for a punitive award ( a fine)

they are just the latest morph of the clampers of old, but use vaguely official looking letters that mimik a formal PCO to spook people into paying - even their letters - invoices disguised as penalties are probabaly sufficient enough for any county court to not get involved

I know people who have paid up sadly- what a fearful nation we have become

PS -I am not one of those anothetr tax on the motorist lot either- If I gert caught on the street and im in the wrong, I hold my hands up and pay.

 

[ymu]

Once they're there, they don't seem to go away again, though. We have two disabled bays in our street. Though the residents who requested them have long since departed (one lived in the house next to ours until about 12 years ago).

I really do know all my neighbours, it's not that long a road, and nobody qualifies for a disabled badge.

They do come and go on our road - there's a couple of spots where they've burnt out the old lines and, currently, one recently painted spot. If they're not needed by a resident and they're not intended for disabled visitors, get onto the council about it.

 

[Spymaster]

From parking advice website:

TICKETS ISSUED BY CAMERA

Unfortunately, there are now an increasingly large number of tickets being issued through a network of "Enforcement Cameras". The government have issued strict guidelines that "these cameras are to be sighted where enforcement is difficult or sensitive and CEO enforcement is not practical". The transport secretary gave an example of this "where there are no footpaths, i.e on a dual carriageway". We know of several of these camera's in Earls Court, operated by Tfl, which issue tickets unceremoniously and there are plenty of footpaths for the faithful CEO's to use!! So, on reflection, the cameras seem to be sighted where they will make the most money. Another example of this is the camera conveniently situated right outside Paddington Station on London Street!! If you wish to appeal against any camera issued PCN's or FPN's we suggest you include the following in your appeal, to help you ascertain that the charge has been issued correctly:

Under the provisions of the Data Protection Act 1998 & Freedom of Information Act 2000 I will require the following information from you:

1. The amount of frames per second that this camera operates at?

2. The Camera operators ID?

3. Proof and certification that the operator is qualified to use this type of equipment?

4. Confirmation that the recording was made in accordance with the Code of Practice for the operation of CCTV Enforcement Cameras?

5. Confirmation that this recorded material is strictly in compliance with the current code of practice and data protection legislation?

6. A copy of the alleged contravention on VHS tape sent to me.

7. Confirmation that there are signs in this area warning of the use of cameras and proof of these signs existence and location?

8. Confirmation that these signs comply with the TSRGD or that they have special authorisation from the Dft?

9. Your confirmation that the sighting of this particular camera is at a sight where enforcement is difficult or sensitive and CEO enforcement is not practical?

Could be useful for anyone getting hit like this in the future.

#7 seems to be the one most likely to get the ticket binned.

 

[pogofish]

I wote on this a while ago - they tried to get me at Lidl twice and I did a bit of research - its 99.99999999999999999999999% unenforceable & even if it did go to county court, they could only possibly get loss repaid -i.e the cost of you being in a paid space overlong - which isnt an issue at Sainsbos with free parking - there is no provision under a civil action for a punitive award ( a fine)

Yup, very unlikely & even if you were hit by the one or two firms who will take a known person to court, any award for "loss" must fairly represent that loss to the landowner/operator. Which is most certainly nothing like the so-called "fine".

 

[pogofish]

From parking advice website:

It does sound like it it laying things on a bit thick?

It also forgets to ask for a copy of the operator's contemperanious notes & I'd be surprised if they would issue CCTV evidence under the current regs - The Information commisioner's standards only requires them to make the footage available for inspection, which is usually at their offices. You would probably be looking at a final appeal to the Tribunal before you had the right to claim your own copy of any footage.

As for 7 & 8, you would be better to gather your own evidence there. The quality of parking operators "proof" has been found to be very poor recently.

 

[T & P]

Do you have a source for that 9 metre rule? I've not heard of it before.

No, I'm quoting what Lambeth told me was the rules (perhaps their own rules!?) regarding 'fair use' of bus lanes during overtaking.

They could have just made it up. I didn't look into it further and paid up.

 

[Spymaster]

No, I'm quoting what Lambeth told me was the rules (perhaps their own rules!?) regarding 'fair use' of bus lanes during overtaking.

On bus lanes:

Local Authorities and adjudicators do operate a "de minimus" policy, meaning that a vehicle driven less than 20 meters in a Bus Lane would be an acceptable tolerance.

You may have your appeal upheld if there were any specific reasons as to why you were in the Bus Lane, for example:

* You were "rounding" a broken down vehicle
* It was an emergency
* You were instructed to do so by a police constable
* You were taking in petrol, oil, water or air at the kerbside
* You had broken down

All Bus Lanes should have a sign, like the one above, informing you of the impending Bus lane prior to the lane beginning. The Bus Lane should also have a sign at the very beginning of the lane. If either signs are missing, unclear, pointing the wrong way or vandalised, your appeal should be upheld. Take photographs to support your appeal.

If you approach a Bus Lane from an adjoining road, again, there should be a warning sign informing you of the Bus lane and its times of operation.

You should always request photographs (video prints) of the allegation. Call the number on the PCN or write to the Local Authority. You should receive a minimum of two photographs, one of the vehicle in the bus lane and one of the Vehicle Registration Mark (number plate) magnified for identification purposes. If you are not provided with the two photographs, for whatever reasons, your appeal will be upheld.

If you prefer, owners can ask for an appointment to view the recording. Some Local Authorities normally enclose a viewing request form which can be used to book an appointment. There is no charge for viewing the video recording.

If you do nothing, the Local Authority will send you an Enforcement Notice, 28 days after the PCN was issued.

 

[jimadore]

Westminster is that the place someone, put a parking ticket on a horse?

 

[Paul Russell]

I thought I read on another website that a poster got a parking fine in London and they gave her an interweb link where she could watch the offence being committed. She found it all a bit creepy. Is that right, or did I get completely the wrong end of the stick?

 

[Giles]

Once they're there, they don't seem to go away again, though. We have two disabled bays in our street.

We've got one of these "ghost" disabled bays nearly outside my house.

It is reserved for one specific disabled driver, not just for disabled drivers in general.

And no-one has parked in it for 3 years or more, apart from people not realising and parking there illegally.

The old chap for whom it was created has long gone to the great residents parking zone in the sky, according to one of the traffic wardens.

He died 3 years back, but the council leave this now wasted space there. They still ticket people for parking in it, though.

Giles..

 

[Epona]

My dad once had his car clamped parking in residents parking by my flat for which he had displayed my visitor's permit correctly. Apparently the council had changed the parking zones with no notice to residents, and no change to the signs. If he'd parked across the other side of the road (which ironically was further away from my flat) he would have been OK. The council were no help whatsoever, apparently I should have known (by psychic abilities I suppose) that the zones had changed, even though there was absolutely sod all way of knowing.

 

[cybertect]

On bus lanes:

Interesting.

I had a fruitless series of phone calls and email correspondence with TfL a year or two ago asking exactly those questions, which they refused to answer, suggesting that I put them to an appeals tribunal. But I was trying to obtain advice on what I should do before I got a ticket for moving into a bus lane in the hope of avoiding that.

This bit tickles me somewhat

Local Authorities and adjudicators do operate a "de minimus" policy, meaning that a vehicle driven less than 20 meters in a Bus Lane would be an acceptable tolerance.

When this bus lane was introduced in Sutton four years or so ago there was a huge row in the local papers. The bus lane itself is about 30m long, but people who merely clipped the end of it (reportedly by a matter of inches in some cases) to turn left into the adjacent B&Q store were receiving fines.

 

[Jayen4]

I sold a Suzuki Vitara to a Polish fella,from London a while back. Within 2 weeks I got a parking ticket for it. Came with a shitty letter and a photo still from a cctv camera. In the pic was the very guy that I had sold the car to....he was parked on the pavement and on double yellows (he was leaning on the back of the car,talking to someone).
Needlees to say,I fired off a shitty letter of my own to Lambeth council,informing them that I no longer owned that vehicle,enclosing my bill of sale,as proof. I never heard anymore from them,so.....

 

[pk]

Not CCTV related, but certainly fuckwit related.
It takes a special kind of cunt to be a parking ticket nazi.

Parked in Hove about 3 years ago, bought a ticket valid for 24 hours, yet 8 hours later some jobsworth cunt slaps a Penalty Charge on our car.

Here is the letter I composed and sent.

-----------------------------------
Brighton and Hove City Council
PO BOX No.6
Brighton,
BNI 4BQ

24th July 2005

Dear Sir/Madam,

I am writing in regard to the Penalty Charge notice that was affixed to our car on the 8th July 2005, in Hove Street South, which was PCN/Notice No. BH0-------A.

It appears that in spite of clearly displaying a ticket on the front windscreen from the ticket machine two feet away from our car, registration --------, which was valid up until 14:59 on the 9th of July, which was in fact the following afternoon, your parking attendant (number 458) saw fit to believe that we were parked after the expiry of paid for time.

We enclose a photocopy of the ticket – not the original – because we believe if your parking attendants are unable to read properly then it is just as likely the original ticket may be “accidentally” mislaid by one of your clearly incompetent employees, in order to continue your determined quest to illegally extort £60 from us.

However I am certain that not all of your staff are as criminally negligent as Parking Attendant No. 458, so I trust this will be the end of the matter.

Should you wish to continue this futile request for money from us, we are of course prepared to take the case as far as need be to highlight the gross stupidity of your Parking Services employees, however, in light of the circumstances, it may be more appropriate if instead of pursuing this matter futher you donate the inevitable court costs to a charitable organisation.

May I suggest the Royal National Institute of the Blind, or perhaps you could use the public money towards purchasing some contact lens equipment or spectacles for Parking Attendant 458, as we feel sure he would benefit from it, if he cannot distinguish a number 9 from a number 8 on the date of a parking ticket, hundreds of which he must be checking on a daily basis, which I’m sure in light of this incident is a worrying prospect for your undoubtedly otherwise faultless and efficient service.

I look forward to your reply, as in these somewhat troubled days - we all need a good laugh.

Yours in abject incredulity,

pk