Palm Foleo: "#1 Worst Gadget of 2007"

[editor]

Funnily enough, a 'first look' video of the Palm Foleo is showing as being new on vnunet today.

If only Palm hadn't lost their nerve and lowered the price...

http://www.vnunet.com/vnunet/video/2208993/first-look-palm-foleo

 

[Kid_Eternity]

Given the success of the Eee Palm were lucky they did bottle it; the Eee would've trounced the retarded Foleo I reckon (better specs, independent of a mobile device, cheaper)...

 

[editor]

Given the success of the Eee Palm were lucky they did bottle it; the Eee would've trounced the retarded Foleo I reckon (better specs, independent of a mobile device, cheaper)...

That's your opinion ("retarded" indeed ), but enough people have come forward since and said that they found the Foleo a very interesting concept, naybe even ahead of its time...

If the price had been kept under £275, I definitely would have bought a Foelo rather than an Eee. The screen was better and I would have liked the longer battery life, instant on and tight integration with the Treo.

It looks like the story isn't going away either:
Foleo-like Devices Bringing Back the Foleo Itch
http://www.treocentral.com/content/Stories/1580-1.htm

Palm Foleo: Not such a dumb concept after all?
http://www.news.com/8301-10784_3-9875451-7.html

Foleo Cancelled, A Curious Absence
http://www.wmexperts.com/articles/editorials/foleo_cancelled_a_curious_abse.html

 

[Kid_Eternity]

If the price had been kept under £275, I definitely would have bought a Foelo rather than an Eee.

It was 600 dollars in the US (yeah yeah yeah the rebate but you still had to shell out 600 upfront) which means there's no way in hell it'd been anything less than £300 over here and probably closer to £450. That's an idiotic price for a retarded laptop...Foleo = Epic Fail.

 

[editor]

It was 600 dollars in the US (yeah yeah yeah the rebate but you still had to shell out 600 upfront) which means there's no way in hell it'd been anything less than £300 over here and probably closer to £450. That's an idiotic price for a retarded laptop...Foleo = Epic Fail.

You keep on insisting you know best when it comes to Palm pricing, yet you look a bit silly considering the fact that the Palm Centro retails for more or less exactly the same price as it does in the US. In fact, it's actually currently cheaper in the UK! ($410 versus £179).

Please explain why you keep on insisting that the Foleo wouldn't have followed the same kind of pricing (which would have taken it down to around £250 after rebate) and why you're so sure that it would have retailed at £450 (the equivalent of a huge $900!!!).

Could you show me a single credible source that confirms this sky high figure for the UK?

Where are you getting these crazy figures from? Or are you just making them up off the top of your head to give you a piss-weak excuse to slag off Palm?

 

[editor]

Oh, and guess what? The Palm 500v is $500 unlocked in the US. And, once again, it's cheaper in the UK, being available for £230 from Expansys.
http://www.expansys.com/p.aspx?i=161307

So that's your pricing argument = Epic Fail. LOL!

 

[jæd]

Where are you getting these crazy figures from? Or are you just making them up off the top of your head to give you a piss-weak excuse to slag off Palm?

He's probably basing it off of past experience of US based companies when they transfer products to the UK. Personally, assuming $499 = £245, I'd expect the Foleo to retail at between £249 - £299. (KE's estimate is a bit of high side, but I highly doubt he's inflating to slag off Palm. I've been burnt in past by dubious exchange rates. cf Apple)

 

[johnnymarrsbars]

Palm's main problem is that with the convergence of the pda with the mobile phone, and the emergence of Windows Mobile and Symbian being the operating system of choice for many main manufacturers, they don't know who they are anymore. It's a big shame, as Palm was once a company of giants who produced many great products. They need a new killer product to relaunch themselves. Although quite intriguing, the Folio probably wasn't to be it.

They are going the exact same way Psion did. Who, incidentally, also tried to launch a subnotebook/pda hybrid in a last ditch attempt to remain a top player in the market. They need to look at Psion as a case study and decide where they really want to be. Their indecisiveness and current business plan of placing a little finger in a lot of pies isn't working. I hope they manage to turn things around. The trio range, as good as they are, are really being squeezed by the dominance of RIM/Nokia/Motorola. A relaunch is needed to position their products in a slightly 'sexier' way would probably help. The sad fact remains though that Palm probably don't have the finance available to fund it.

 

[editor]

He's probably basing it off of past experience of US based companies when they transfer products to the UK. Personally, assuming $499 = £245, I'd expect the Foleo to retail at between £249 - £299. (KE's estimate is a bit of high side, but I highly doubt he's inflating to slag off Palm. I've been burnt in past by dubious exchange rates. cf Apple)

Nah, it's bollocks, no matter how your try and spin it.

All of Palm's recent phones - the Treo 750, Treo 500 and Centro have sold for less in the UK, yet he's still insisting that the Foleo would have sold for the equivalent of $900 over here - a wild, massively inflated figure he can't produce a single reference or justification for.

So why do you think he's still clinging to his ridiculously high figure?

I can only assume it's because he's using it as a stick to beat Palm ("Foleo = Epic Fail."), because there's absolutely no logic to his claims at all (in fact,come to think of it, I think the Treo 650 was cheaper in the UK years ago too).

 

[editor]

A relaunch is needed to position their products in a slightly 'sexier' way would probably help. The sad fact remains though that Palm probably don't have the finance available to fund it.

That's exactly what they're doing with their new OS release early next year.

It may well be too little too late though, especially since Google's Android has stepped into the fray and captured the attention of developers.

I'm resigned to the fact that my Centro may well be my last Palm OS device if the Android gets anywhere near the Palm's ease of use and functionality (their work with Googlemaps suggest they may well).

As for the Foleo, I still think they pulled it too early. It was a new kind of device, and although tech bloggers were quick to sneer, there's no shortage of Foleo-like devices lining up to market.

If the device had worked like it was suggested, then it could have found a strong niche and perhaps even something of a cult following.

 

[johnnymarrsbars]

That's exactly what they're doing with their new OS release early next year.

It may well be too little too late though, especially since Google's Android has stepped into the fray and captured the attention of developers.

I'm resigned to the fact that my Centro may well be my last Palm OS device if the Android gets anywhere near the Palm's ease of use and functionality (their work with Googlemaps suggest they may well).

As for the Foleo, I still think they pulled it too early. It was a new kind of device, and although tech bloggers were quick to sneer, there's no shortage of Foleo-like devices lining up to market.

If the device had worked like it was suggested, then it could have found a strong niche and perhaps even something of a cult following.

thats the point. huge competition in one of the most hostile markets. Palm can't afford the compete. it is a big shame because as i've said, i was a fan of palm products. i was a fan of psion gear too. I have a 3a and a 5series in a cupboard somewhere. great little things they are. last forever on one set of batteries and never need their software updating/restarting.

Palm simply buried their head under the sand when the convergence of cellular phone and pda technologies was on the horizon, and hoped that somehow they'd get through. buying up handspring was a desperate move. they wern't the right sort of company for the acquisition over innovation model to work.

big shame. another once great innovative company is going to be resigned to the history books unless they think of something fast. happened to psion (okay, they now make software for jcb diggers or whatever...but effectively they're dead) and nearly happened to Apple in '96-'97.

 

[editor]

Palm simply buried their head under the sand when the convergence of cellular phone and pda technologies was on the horizon, and hoped that somehow they'd get through. buying up handspring was a desperate move. they wern't the right sort of company for the acquisition over innovation model to work.

I think you're taking a bit of a Euro-centric view here.

In the States, the Treo 600/650 were both massive successes, and the Centro has proved a big hit too.

But all that fucking about with Palmsource and faffing about with rebranding hurt the company badly.

Even though Palm Windows devices have taken a fair chunk of the US WM market, there's not been enough innovation and if it wasn't for the fact that (a) Palm hads such a head start on their rivals and (b) most Windows phones are really shit, the company would have sunk a long time ago.

I hope they pull it off, but I fear that it's all uphill now.

 

[jæd]

All of Palm's recent phones - the Treo 750, Treo 500 and Centro have sold for less in the UK, yet he's still insisting that the Foleo would have sold for the equivalent of $900 over here - a wild, massively inflated figure he can't produce a single reference or justification for.

He's just giving a guess/estimate of new type of product. Perhaps he doesn't have your obs^h^h^experience of Palm pricing...

I can only assume it's because he's using it as a stick to beat Palm ("Foleo = Epic Fail."), because there's absolutely no logic to his claims at all (in fact,come to think of it, I think the Treo 650 was cheaper in the UK years ago too).

Just because people don't agree with you doesn't mean they're automatically slagging the subject off...

 

[jæd]

thats the point. huge competition in one of the most hostile markets. Palm can't afford the compete. it is a big shame because as i've said, i was a fan of palm products. i was a fan of psion gear too. I have a 3a and a 5series in a cupboard somewhere. great little things they are. last forever on one set of batteries and never need their software updating/restarting.

Palm simply buried their head under the sand when the convergence of cellular phone and pda technologies was on the horizon, and hoped that somehow they'd get through. buying up handspring was a desperate move. they wern't the right sort of company for the acquisition over innovation model to work.

big shame. another once great innovative company is going to be resigned to the history books unless they think of something fast. happened to psion (okay, they now make software for jcb diggers or whatever...but effectively they're dead) and nearly happened to Apple in '96-'97.

IMO I think Palm haven't internally innovated since the introduction of the Pilot. All the rest seems to have been relying on outside companies (even those they divested from) to provide it... Bad idea : You can't outsource innovation...

The Foleo would've been good last year, but its niche is rapidly closing. Palm could release the Foleo II this year and make it work. But releasing it any later than Q4 would put it competition with the updated Eee. Once that gets a decent size screen the Foleo II would be dead in the water...

 

[jæd]

IMO I think Palm haven't internally innovated since the introduction of the Pilot. All the rest seems to have been relying on outside companies (even those they divested from) to provide it... Bad idea : You can't outsource innovation...

The Foleo would've been good last year, but its niche is rapidly closing. Palm could release the Foleo II this year and make it work. But releasing it any later than Q4 would put it competition with the updated Eee. Once that gets a decent size screen the Foleo II would be dead in the water...

http://www.urban75.net/vbulletin/showpost.php?p=7256948&postcount=74

 

[editor]

The thing that surprises me is why Palm pre-announced it back in May 2007...

I imagine they 'pre-announced' the Foleo because they desperately needed to encourage developers to write compelling programs for their new platform.

Here's a video of the Foleo knock off in action: http://blogs.zdnet.com/mobile-gadgeteer/?p=951

The reviewer seems quite impressed with the Foleo-like functionality.

Edit: these Foleo promos sure look a lot slicker: http://www.slashphone.com/118/7412.html

 

[editor]

Compared to the video near the bottom of this page http://www.brighthand.com/default.asp?newsID=13139 the Foleo was very nippy indeed.

*still wants

 

[jæd]

Yeah well that'd be the sane response to my post, cheers. There's a reason the uk is called rip off Britain and currency conversions being inflated is one of them. We pay more for all kinds of things...

I wonder how much the RedFly will be in the UK... Then we could try to make informed guess, taking into account Palm's pricing history...

I imagine they 'pre-announced' the Foleo because they desperately needed to encourage developers to write compelling programs for their new platform.

Well... From my reading the other day it was mentioned that the main Palm software producers had SDK's from before the annoucement... It would be interesting to know how many people signed up for the SDK after the announcement... I certainly did...

(If it ran a Linux Kernel, I wonder if they would've produced a Linux based simulator...? )

 

[editor]

Well, there's a not entirely convincing rumour that Foleo 2 may be in the wings here:
http://www.reghardware.co.uk/2008/04/22/ft_palm_foleo_first_eee/

If Palm had made the Foleo a bit cheaper and not bottled it, it makes you wonder how they'd be doing now. Despite the 'experts' being quick to criticise the concept, low powered cheap laptops have now become one of the hottest growth areas in the PC market.



(Note: in the interests of global peace and goodwill to all men and women, I've removed several bunfight posts from this thread).

 

[Crispy]

They just misjudged the concept a bit. It required a smartphone to pair with, and cost about 3x what it should. People didn't see it and think 'ooh dinky laptop!' they thought 'oh. expensive addon to a phone I don't have'

That Foleo2 rumour has little weight. Apparently, the foleo design team split up and left the company after it was cancelled. (http://www.reghardware.co.uk/2008/04/22/ft_palm_foleo_first_eee/comments/)

 

[jæd]

They just misjudged the concept a bit. It required a smartphone to pair with, and cost about 3x what it should. People didn't see it and think 'ooh dinky laptop!' they thought 'oh. expensive addon to a phone I don't have'

That Foleo2 rumour has little weight. Apparently, the foleo design team split up and left the company after it was cancelled. (http://www.reghardware.co.uk/2008/04/22/ft_palm_foleo_first_eee/comments/)

The price could be lower, but the main problem is they listened to the tech pundits. Bad idea. If they'd launched and dropped the price after a month it would've been a success. It might've foced the Eee to launch at an even lower price...

 

[editor]

The price could be lower, but the main problem is they listened to the tech pundits. Bad idea. If they'd launched and dropped the price after a month it would've been a success. It might've foced the Eee to launch at an even lower price...

That's what I think too. And if they'd got it to work with enough smartphones, that would have given it a real advantage too - I'd love to have an instant-on laptop with a good battery life, big screen and decent keyboard capable of being able to instantly access emails/documents etc off my phone, as well as working as a standalone wi-fi enabled machine.

The would have needed to have tweaked the thing around a bit though.

 

[editor]

And still the Foleo picks up awards!

The Top 15 Vaporware Products of All Time

Palm Computing's founder, Jeff Hawkins, is a lucky guy. What few people have done once--define a product category--he has done twice, first with the original PalmPilot PDA and later with Handspring's Treo smart phone. (Both categories existed before Hawkins' inventions, but Palm's products made them accessible enough for nontechnophiles to latch on to.)

On May 30, 2007, Hawkins went for the hat trick when he announced the Palm Foleo, a $499 Linux-based subnotebook designed to synchronize with a smart phone so that business travelers could, among other things, work on documents and e-mail without cramping their thumbs.

Even such notable features as its 2.5-pound weight and its instant-on feature failed to muster more than a collective "Why?" from the digerati. Stuck somewhere between a PDA and a notebook in power and size, it seemed to be only an extra device to carry around, with too much feature overlap.

Our own Editor in Chief Harry McCracken was part of the vocal minority who thought that the Foleo was being hastily prejudged, and hands-on reviews alternated between positive and negative. Barely three months after Hawkins presented the Foleo, Palm pulled the plug on it, citing a need to "get our core platform and smartphones done first." McCracken agreed, writing that the "Foleo was likely to be a distraction at a time when Palm couldn't afford to be distracted--and probably a LifeDrive-like flop, too."

Some people might argue that Hawkins could yet be vindicated, as low-cost, lightweight laptops such as the Asus Eee PC seem to be catching on despite being underpowered--good enough for some tasks, but not as feature-packed as a full-featured notebook.
http://www.pcworld.com/article/id,145351-page,4-c,technology/article.html