Oyster card question

[ATOMIC SUPLEX]

especially when the price differential is so great between Oyster and the paper tickets.

They are only doing that to make you buy an Oyster so they can track customer movments for market research.
They have also not ruled out selling this yet and have hinted that it will be passed to advertisers.

 

[Maggot]

They are only doing that to make you buy an Oyster so they can track customer movments for market research.
They have also not ruled out selling this yet and have hinted that it will be passed to advertisers.

You have any evidence for this?

 

[ATOMIC SUPLEX]

You have any evidence for this?

I was told by them when I asked on an official matter. (you can do this too, just say you are form the press) Basicaly they said they were not going to use the information for anything other than internal use (which they suggested could be shown to potential advertisers) or sell it but they would not rule anything out, they pretty much said they would have to tell the cops.

 

[Allan]

Okay, first day's usage:

I got on a bus but the card reader wasn't working and thedriver was just waving people through. Good start.

Did a return tube journey from Brixton to NHGate and back again.

Got 2 buses to where I live.

2 tubes, 2 buses. Checked my balance online and from £10 I now have £6.50 - my fares today cost £3.50? Is that right? Unless the bus fares have yet to be added on? It's 5:15pm now and I last used it on a bus about an hour ago.

 

[beeboo]

I was told by them when I asked on an official matter. (you can do this too, just say you are form the press) Basicaly they said they were not going to use the information for anything other than internal use (which they suggested could be shown to potential advertisers) or sell it but they would not rule anything out, they pretty much said they would have to tell the cops.

Are you talking about aggregate data on movement patterns etc, or individual data? Big difference.

The data protection statement when you register online says the following

Transport for London, London Underground and, if you use National Rail, the relevant Train Operating Company, will use your registration data for the purposes of administration, customer services and research. We and/or our agents may contact you for these purposes.

We may also contact you to let you know about our other related products or services. Check this box if you do not wish to receive this information

Legally they can't use the data for any purposes other than those suggested, although admittedly they are quite broad. Doesn't say anything about selling data.

 

[detective-boy]

I read in the Grauniad the other week that there has been a huge increase in the police using it to track peoples journeys round the public transport system.

The article was all about reactive enquiries which I wouldn't have thought you'd have too much problem with - e.g.1 street robber gets nicked, Oyster card in pocket, police get hold of movements of Oyster card to establish where robber had been to see if it links in with any other offences; e.g.2 victim gets pocket picked, Oyster card amongst belongings, police track subsequent use of Oyster card and nick thief as a result, Oyster card of victim in pocket of thief provides useful evidence.

Although there is nothing to stop proactive use of the data to track suspects they would need appropriate authorisation under Data Protection Act and / or RIPA dependant on cisrcumstances and it would only be done for serious crime (for purely practical reasons). There really is no massive control room with a huge map of London and little flashing lights of where everyone is ... (except in the minds of some conspiraloons!!)

 

[detective-boy]

There's a WORLD of difference between that, and agencies being able to go on fishing expeditions through the data, as and when they please, with no proper oversight.

They can't. And they don't. And there is.

 

[pembrokestephen]

There's a WORLD of difference between that, and agencies being able to go on fishing expeditions through the data, as and when they please, with no proper oversight.

They can't. And they don't. And there is.

Good

 

[Termite Man]

If you get a travelcard on your Oyster, then that will be the default, and it would only deduct money from the pre-pay account if you go out of zone.

I have a bus pass on my oyster , can I use it as a pre-pay for the tube as well or will it take money from my pre-pay for bus journeys as well

 

[beeboo]

I have a bus pass on my oyster , can I use it as a pre-pay for the tube as well or will it take money from my pre-pay for bus journeys as well

Well I've never had a bus pass myself so I haven't tried it, but I would suppose that it wouldn't deduct any money from your pre-pay for bus journeys providing you had a valid bus pass.

I'd be highly surprised if this wasn't the case.

 

[matrix_22]

I have a bus pass on my oyster , can I use it as a pre-pay for the tube as well or will it take money from my pre-pay for bus journeys as well

I have a monthly bus pass on my Oyster I also keeped it topped up with 10 pounds pre pay just for my infrequent tube journey - it doesn't affect my bus pass, its like it comes from a seperate account. The only time you are on a bus and it will take from your pre pay 'account' is if your bus pass has expired.

 

[Termite Man]

I have a monthly bus pass on my Oyster I also keeped it topped up with 10 pounds pre pay just for my infrequent tube journey - it doesn't affect my bus pass, its like it comes from a seperate account. The only time you are on a bus and it will take from your pre pay 'account' is if your bus pass has expired.

Cheers . I'll put some pre-pay on me bus pass then

 

[butterfly child]

All well and good. The police can go to TfL and say "we want to know details of the parties who boarded bus x between times y and z". They then work through the details of those, eliminate people from their enquiries, and hopefully end up with a list of suspects.

I was the only person on the bus at the time.. they can eliminate me from the oystercard machine records, and end up with the perps.

 

[marty21]

I can't use it on any of the trains I take and it's a huge pain in the arse living in Gipsy hill where there is no tube so all transport revolves around trains.

i have one, but can't really use them on the trains, and the nearest tube is manor house pr finsbury park,both a few miles away,luckily I don't need to travel by tube everyday, I can walk to work 3 days a week, so I just bung a tenner on there for bus journeys, they do work out cheaper, 80p a trip rather than £1.50

 

[maldwyn]

It’s worth remembering a pre-pay bus journey before 9.30am is £1.00

 

[detective-boy]

I was the only person on the bus at the time.. they can eliminate me from the oystercard machine records, and end up with the perps.

* Pops down to Ladbrokes and puts £10 on the Oystercards in question being either (a) stolen, (b) unregistered (it's voluntary for pre-pay) or (c) registered in false details *

 

[Mrs Magpie]

I have tried to register my Oystercard 5 times and each time I've been told the ticket bods are 'too busy' and to come back another time

 

[ATOMIC SUPLEX]

Are you talking about aggregate data on movement patterns etc, or individual data? Big difference.

The data protection statement when you register online says the following



Legally they can't use the data for any purposes other than those suggested, although admittedly they are quite broad. Doesn't say anything about selling data.

Yes but it seems their 'administration, customer services and espesulay their research' can cover quite a lot. This includes of research into people movements releating to advertising and 'research' into which companys would benifit most from which location.

 

[PacificOcean]

I was the only person on the bus at the time.. they can eliminate me from the oystercard machine records, and end up with the perps.

Why not just check the CCTV? What help is knowing what time they got on the bus when they have the time stamped CCTV anyway and the victim could tell the Old Bill what time it was anyway.

The Oyster reader on a bus doesn't tell the Police what stop they got on or off at.

 

[pembrokestephen]

* Pops down to Ladbrokes and puts £10 on the Oystercards in question being either (a) stolen, (b) unregistered (it's voluntary for pre-pay) or (c) registered in false details *

I guess it depends how smart these thugs were: if this were an opportunistic attack, and they weren't very bright, maybe it hadn't occurred to them that their cards might track them.

I wonder if it's possible to put a "watch" on an Oyster card, so that even if they were just prepay, a bus driver (and therefore hopefully the police) could be notified if the same card was used again subsequently?

 

[PacificOcean]

I wonder if it's possible to put a "watch" on an Oyster card, so that even if they were just prepay, a bus driver (and therefore hopefully the police) could be notified if the same card was used again subsequently?

I don't think the Oyster readers on buses are sophisitcated enough to do that.

 

[Allan]

Another drawback.

My card seems to have auto-updated sooner than I expected given the journeys I have made on it so far.

There doesn't seem to be a way of seeing a day-by-day statement of its usage so that I can check it.

 

[beeboo]

Yes but it seems their 'administration, customer services and espesulay their research' can cover quite a lot. This includes of research into people movements releating to advertising and 'research' into which companys would benifit most from which location.

Is it just me that doesn't have a problem with this? I wouldn't have a problem knowing that LU charge advertisers more for prime locations, or according to the demographic which uses the station, based on info on Oyster card usage. If they were selling my personal details, different matter altogether.

You never know, they might be able to invest any revenue from advertising in a better tube service.

The oyster data could perhaps also help on more practical level, to better understand passenger flows, demand, bottlenecks etc.

 

[discplayer]

There doesn't seem to be a way of seeing a day-by-day statement of its usage so that I can check it.

I just discovered, not having had an Oyster card long, that you can phone them and they'll send you an itemised report going back up to eight weeks.

 

[PacificOcean]

I just discovered, not having had an Oyster card long, that you can phone them and they'll send you an itemised report going back up to eight weeks.

Or if you put your card on the reader at the ticket machine in a tube station it lists times, dates and where you went.

It even tells you which bus routes you were on.