Oxford grad suing the university because he got a 2:1

[Sasaferrato]

if you're thinking of vorderman i was under the impression she got a third

I was, and posting from memory, on checking, it was indeed a third.

 

[Manter]

I got a 2:1 and I am not a top flight lawyer. Also, about three weeks ago I had trouble sleeping. <<phones lawyer>>

<<checks lawyer's qualifications>>

 

[Cid]

There is a lady who got a 2:2 in Agricultural Engineering, who went to a career on television, and a reputation as an arithmetical genius.

Yeah, but being good at arithmetic is er... Not that good. It's like being great at spelling bees.

 

[nastybobby]

Has anyone pointed out to him Mr Osborne, late of the government, did the same degree and got the same mark.

I understand he's doing fairly well for himself, fucked the poor for several years while high on ket.

Think all that probably proves is: 'it's not what you know, but who you know.' [plus, who your family is, which school you went to before university and what colour your skin is.]

 

[extra dry]

Quite right, I should be working in the Caribbean as the worlds leading Marine Biologist, however my high school biology teacher scuppered my plan to do A level Biology so I am stuck as a lowly English/esl teacher. I am owed millions.

 

[extra dry]

Think all that probably proves is: 'it's not what you know, but who you know.' [plus, who your family is, which school you went to before university and what colour your skin is.]

'it's not who you know, but who you blow'

 

[catinthehat]

Research aside the commodification of education is obvious. Funding is related to recruitment, retention and pass rates. There are armies of people involved in attempting to adjust around these in order to maximise how much cash comes in and minimise what goes out. When I first started teaching the balance between those directly teaching and those providing admin/support/management was about 75% teaching staff. The last place I worked it was about 40% teaching staff. Those 40% were doing around twice the amount of paper work than a decade or so ago. If you can keep up the stats that bring in the cash nothing else really matters. Quality of teaching can drop but be managed via the student experience nonsense where the ideal scenario is that students pass with the minimal amount of teaching input possible by the cheapest teacher possible. You may have a phd and 25 years track record but if the 'student experience manager' tells you students don't really like reading much and prefer 25 minute 'learning chunks' so change your curriculum/syllabus. Question their method of obtaining this information and off you go to Human Remains to be told not to display 'intellectual superiority' because after all the poor dear has no research experience so its not fair to question them............but its perfectly fair for their 'research' to impact on your teaching. Pile it high/flog it cheap. And if you have students who ask for books in the library or appear to be hanging around talking about what they are studying in an area where there is about to be a condom fayre or some such delight emanating from the 'student experience' drones then you are possibly running a cult.

 

[kabbes]

Research aside the commodification of education is obvious. Funding is related to recruitment, retention and pass rates. There are armies of people involved in attempting to adjust around these in order to maximise how much cash comes in and minimise what goes out. When I first started teaching the balance between those directly teaching and those providing admin/support/management was about 75% teaching staff. The last place I worked it was about 40% teaching staff. Those 40% were doing around twice the amount of paper work than a decade or so ago. If you can keep up the stats that bring in the cash nothing else really matters. Quality of teaching can drop but be managed via the student experience nonsense where the ideal scenario is that students pass with the minimal amount of teaching input possible by the cheapest teacher possible. You may have a phd and 25 years track record but if the 'student experience manager' tells you students don't really like reading much and prefer 25 minute 'learning chunks' so change your curriculum/syllabus. Question their method of obtaining this information and off you go to Human Remains to be told not to display 'intellectual superiority' because after all the poor dear has no research experience so its not fair to question them............but its perfectly fair for their 'research' to impact on your teaching. Pile it high/flog it cheap. And if you have students who ask for books in the library or appear to be hanging around talking about what they are studying in an area where there is about to be a condom fayre or some such delight emanating from the 'student experience' drones then you are possibly running a cult.

There's a lot of bollocks in this, including that there is somehow something wrong with concentrating on how people best actually learn things rather than persisting with inefficient methods because they are traditional.

I find that the quality of graduates I come across is better and better, so clearly something is working. They have much better higher level creative thinking than in the past, and it's this problem solving that is so crucial.

 

[flypanam]

There's a lot of bollocks in this, including that there is somehow something wrong with concentrating on how people best actually learn things rather than persisting with inefficient methods because they are traditional.

I find that the quality of graduates I come across is better and better, so clearly something is working. They have much better higher level creative thinking than in the past, and it's this problem solving that is so crucial.

I get what you are saying, Reflective learning and SOLO kind of teaching is very good at producing people for working in STEM areas. However, it's not so good at producing Arts/Humanities graduates, for whom the thinking is the main purpose. SOLO and Reflective learning allows courses to be taught by Adjunct Professors without any basic working rights. It's a cheap way to delivering education.

I'll give you one example, where I work, students are no longer expected or considered able to read whole texts, and they are no longer expected to write anything over 5,000 words in the elective essays. The course is designed by a module co-ordinator who picks out bits of texts that can excite, and jettisons the rest. The actual teaching is done by temp staff with no variation from the course outline. No place for a diverging into context or other interesting stuff. This has meant that the Academic staff have to cope with year in year out course alterations, hence we have a teaching staff whose moral is rock bottom.

Of the graduates you've come across, what is their written communication like? Can they write a simple business letter and the like? I only ask because my FiL who does quite a did of hiring for his engineering firm bemoans the state of graduate communication.

 

[Pickman's model]

There's a lot of bollocks in this, including that there is somehow something wrong with concentrating on how people best actually learn things rather than persisting with inefficient methods because they are traditional.

I find that the quality of graduates I come across is better and better, so clearly something is working. They have much better higher level creative thinking than in the past, and it's this problem solving that is so crucial.

yeh. but a surprisingly large proportion of them can't use a library catalogue or compose more than the most unsophisticated google searches.

 

[flypanam]

yeh. but a surprisingly large proportion of them can't use a library catalogue or compose more than the most unsophisticated google searches.

So fucking true. I've become quite militant about the library catalogue, insisting that every student use it. I've made a lot of students unhappy when I've pointed out to them if you search using the Author field that's where the authors name goes not the title or subject.

 

[Pickman's model]

So fucking true. I've become quite militant about the library catalogue, insisting that every student use it. I've made a lot of students unhappy when I've pointed out to them if you search using the Author field that's where the authors name goes not the title or subject.

so they may be able to think beautiful thoughts but they're damned if they can locate any evidence to support their arguments and on which to base their conclusions

 

[catinthehat]

There's a lot of bollocks in this, including that there is somehow something wrong with concentrating on how people best actually learn things rather than persisting with inefficient methods because they are traditional.

I might be misreading what you are saying here but I certainly do not think there is something wrong with concentrating on how best people actually learn things or there is any point in persisting with inefficient methods because they are traditional. The former is what my job consists of now - researching exactly that and giving training to EU teachers around those very things. One of our biggest obstacles is the pointless traditional obedience and conformity styles and the myriad snake oils. Its our mission to get more critical thinking around those very issues. The teachers we train totally get it, the students that learn that way totally get it. Management, politicians, policy makers and the power holders and influencers do not.

 

[equationgirl]

yeh. but a surprisingly large proportion of them can't use a library catalogue or compose more than the most unsophisticated google searches.

Bless them, some of mine prefer an overabundance of apostrophes in their writings. But at least they tend to know how to use the spellchecker.

Google searching now, that's a whole other topic of conversation.

Someone yesterday told me I wouldn't be able to find their thesis online. One quick search of a few keywords from the title in the relevant university catalogue later and I had it.

 

[equationgirl]

One of the problems with universities is that for the most part, one person is expected to be an excellent teacher, an excellent researcher and an excellent administrator. Even those hired on short term teaching assistant or research contracts are expected to do more than is reasonable for one person unless they work ridiculous hours under the constant pressure of a contract coming to an end.

 

[Cheesypoof]

At school kids like that are big fish in a small pond, the golden hope of the school, given every support and encouragement imaginable. And then you arrive at your college to be just another minnow, with no extensive support mechanism.

brilliantly written!

 

[William of Walworth]

I acquired a 2:1 in 1985. Not from any Oxford college.

I've endured a thoroughly boring and mediocre career most of the time since then, and I've moaned about the dullness of it all in pubs (at times ) ever since, but without any thought of taking legal action against anyone.

Call me a loser or whatever