NUT and ATL to merge?

[J Ed]

My vote was decided (in favour of merger)the other day whilst at an event sat with s bunch of NUT members -who were set on voting against,partly out of affinity with the NUT "brand" but partly because they were worried that the merged union would not be restricted to "qualified teachers".

I want a Union that all my colleagues can join, not just those with a certificate.

I had no idea that the NUT didn't allow unqualified teachers, seems like a massive own goal to me.

 

[chilango]

I had no idea that the NUT didn't allow unqualified teachers, seems like a massive own goal to me.

Yep.

 

[redsquirrel]

I had no idea that the NUT didn't allow unqualified teachers, seems like a massive own goal to me.

Totally.

 

[tedsplitter]

It is stupid that TAs can't join the same union as teachers in the same classroom. Although I think there should be one big union for all jobs - teachers, cleaners, catering workers, caretakers, professors etc - in the education sector from nursery to university.

 

[redsquirrel]

It is stupid that TAs can't join the same union as teachers in the same classroom. Although I think there should be one big union for all jobs - teachers, cleaners, catering workers, caretakers, professors etc - in the education sector from nursery to university.

I certainly agree with you about all workers in the same workplace belonging to the same union.

I'm less convinced about the need, or advantages, for vertical integration. What's the advantage of HE staff being in the same union as PE/SE staff?

 

[tedsplitter]

Power. Also why's it vertical? I'd have said headteachers and teachers being in the same union, or university senior management being in the same union as faculty and professional services staff, would be vertical. FE, HE, PE, and SE workers are all in the same sector.

 

[redsquirrel]

I meant vertically through the education sector.

How does having one single education union increase the power of the workers? Having all the staff in a workforce increase their power as it increases the industrial might so I think there's a very strong argument that academic and non-academic staff in the HE sector should belong to a single union (as is the case here in Australia).

I don't see how that applies to HE and PE/SE, there's no legal action that those in the PE/SE sector can take that will help their colleagues in HE directly in a dispute and vice versa. If you're talking about more indirect stuff like a day of strikes throughout the education sector, well unions can already coordinate anyway.

I don't see the benefits for the members of the UCU merging with ATL/NUT, the first thing to happen will be for the resulting union to 'rationalise' the staff. I suppose you can argue efficiencies of scale will result in benefits for the members, but personally I see that as the same type of crap management comes out with. And the resulting union would have a bigger voice at the TUC, but again so what?

 

[Dom Traynor]

I agree big reformist unions are no more likely to empower their members than smaller ones really. However given that the ATL already compete with UCU and Unison in FE, and their shenanigans in Northern Island the current merger is going to be complicated indeed.

 

[redsquirrel]

Yes FE is a different matter to HE. Incidentally here in Aus there's currently tension between the NTEU (the union I'm a member of) and the AEU (the union which represents teachers) in the FE sector.

Like in the UK the FE sector here has really been hollowed out over the last decade or so and the NTEU has been picking up membership from staff teaching into HE unimpressed by the support the AEU has provided them with. Recently the AEU actually legally disputed the fact that the NTEU could represent staff in TAFE colleges (which rather ending backfiring on them as it was found that they couldn't legally represent the staff we were covering but that the NTEU could represent any TAFE staff).

 

[SpackleFrog]

I had no idea that the NUT didn't allow unqualified teachers, seems like a massive own goal to me.

A hangover from before when unqualified teachers weren't allowed to teach I suspect - I think it's understandable but needs to change as more unqualifieds are working in the sector obviously.

 

[spanglechick]

It's a central policy of all the teaching unions that unqualified teachers shouldn't exist - that only qualified teachers should have teaching responsibility. However, if we broadened our membership to include LSAs etc, I think there would be less of an issue.

 

[chilango]

It's a central policy of all the teaching unions that unqualified teachers shouldn't exist - that only qualified teachers should have teaching responsibility. However, if we broadened our membership to include LSAs etc, I think there would be less of an issue.

Yeah, and I guess my own preference is for a union based on industry rather than profession, which I guess isn't traditional here...

 

[Shechemite]

It is stupid that TAs can't join the same union as teachers in the same classroom. Although I think there should be one big union for all jobs - teachers, cleaners, catering workers, caretakers, professors etc - in the education sector from nursery to university.

Nice to see nursery practitioners regarded as part of the education sector, not merely babysitters

 

[chilango]

Result is "yes" to the merger from both Unions.

Teachers' unions merge to make super-union - BBC News

(I voted "yes" btw)

 

[Hocus Eye.]

Good: now it just needs the NASUWT to come knocking.

 

[chilango]

*Bump*

The National Education Union (as it is now) is live.

Any thoughts so far?