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No tubes on NYE.......

scott_forester

probably talking shite
Oxpecker said:
Even if we accept their assurance that there will be no job losses (although they acknowledge elsewhere that they are losing 200 ticket office staff) the existing 5,000 staff are each getting an extra 10 days holiday a year. So over the course of the year an extra 50,000 staff-days need to be covered with no extra staff. It doesn't add up, does it?
I wonder if the RMT raised the issue that their members extra holidays would cause safty issues when they asked for it?
 

Oxpecker

gwaharddedig canolwr cont
scott_forester said:
I wonder if the RMT raised the issue that their members extra holidays would cause safty issues when they asked for it?
Bizarrely enough, there was a belief that more staff would be employed to cover the shortfall. I suppose past experience should have warned us that LUL don't always act logically (or safely), but any other employer would almost certainly have the sense to realise that more staff would be needed.
 

scott_forester

probably talking shite
butchersapron said:
Nice 'undecided' question there scott.
What I struggle with here is the idea that Ken Livingstone is trying to screw over tube workers or put Londoners in danger. He's always seemed rather credible to me on the Underground. From what he says is that he wants to move ticket staff out of ticket offices because they are selling less tickets. The very fact he hasn't suggested redundancies as a result of efficiencies makes him seem even more credible.
 

Dan U

Boompty
this from TFL website for anyone who is interested in travelling tonight

ALL LINES- RMT STRIKE ON 31 DECEMBER 2005 AND 1 JANUARY 2006: Strike action on London Underground by some RMT station staff is taking place. Services are operating on all lines, however, the following stations are currently closed:BARBICAN; BOROUGH; BOUNDS GREEN; CANNON STREET; CLAPHAM NORTH; CLAPHAM SOUTH; COVENT GARDEN; EDGWARE ROAD (BAKERLOO); ELM PARK; GOODGE STREET; HAMPSTEAD; HOLLOWAY ROAD; KILBURN; KILBURN PARK;KING'S CROSS (Northern and Victoria line only); LAMBETH NORTH; MANOR HOUSE; RUSSELL SQUARE; SHEPHERDS BUSH (CENTRAL); SOUTHGATE; ST.JOHN'S WOOD; TUFNELL PARK

Message received 4:37pm

link
 

JTG

Angry about not being able to be an astronaut.
Of course if you want to use a service operated by scabs and management who aren't used to the hands on running of the Tube that's your look out.

Buses or nothing for me tonight.
 

Oxpecker

gwaharddedig canolwr cont
At the moment Bond Street is being kept open with the minimum number of staff - 7 - but two of those are unfamiliar with the station and untrained on the safety equipment. Her Majesty's Railway Inspectorate are failing to answer their phones :rolleyes:
 

trashpony

Ovaries and tings
Pickman's model said:
staying in?
Nope - I will be getting the Thameslink to Loughborough Junction and then catching a bus to Unsound :cool:

*Nothing's gonna stop me now *

Go on then - join in on the chorus ;)
 

JTG

Angry about not being able to be an astronaut.
Oxpecker said:
At the moment Bond Street is being kept open with the minimum number of staff - 7 - but two of those are unfamiliar with the station and untrained on the safety equipment. Her Majesty's Railway Inspectorate are failing to answer their phones :rolleyes:
See that people? Don't use the Tube tonight, it isn't safe.
 

shandy

shit band, no fans
After solid strike, RMT re-issues peace call to avert second Tube strike

publication date: 1 January 2006

LONDON UNDERGROUND’S biggest union today paid tribute to the united and determined stand of 4,000 striking station staff and called on Tube bosses to accept RMT’s compromise offer to avert a second stoppage scheduled to begin at 18:30 on January 8.

However, the union also warned that Tube drivers and signal workers may now be balloted for action short of strike after blatant safety breaches by LUL during the New Year’s Eve strike.

The present strike, over the imposition of new rosters the union believes will leave stations dangerously understaffed, will wind down from noon today. Affected stations will re-open and services return to normal during the afternoon.

“Our members have resisted lies, aggressive intimidation and blatant bribery by Tube management and openly hostile media coverage to show their determination to defend their own and the travelling public’s safety,” RMT general secretary Bob Crow said today.

“LUL have thrown huge sums of money at managers and office staff brought in to undertake our members’ duties. The company has underlined its cavalier attitude to safety not only by keeping open stations with staff insufficient to cope with an emergency, but by using managers and office staff without appropriate training.

“We will now consider balloting train drivers and signal workers for action short of strike in the light of these blatant safety breaches.

“Our members will be especially angered that the huge sums wasted by LUL on trying to undermine a strike the company could easily have avoided is money that should have been spent on maintaining safe staffing levels throughout the year.

“We take no pleasure in the fact that dozens of stations across the network are nonetheless closed as a result of LUL’s refusal to accept our compromise offer to suspend action in exchange for the suspension of the new rosters to allow talks to take place.

“The serious safety issues at the heart of this dispute remain to be resolved, and that must inevitably be by negotiation. Our compromise offer remains on the table, and we hope that LUL will now recognise our members’ genuine concerns and meet us half way,” Bob Crow said.
 

scott_forester

probably talking shite
shandy said:
“Our members have resisted lies, aggressive intimidation and blatant bribery by Tube management and openly hostile media coverage to show their determination to defend their own and the travelling public’s safety,” RMT general secretary Bob Crow said today.
Aggressive intimidation? Isn't the tube run by Ken Livingstone, are they suggesting he's putting the boot to the workers? I think the main thrust of hostility about the strike from the press is them having fun with Bob Crow for being on holiday in Egypt.

Shame none of the negotiations for these things are made public so people have a chance to see through the spin form both sides.
 

shandy

shit band, no fans
scott_forester said:
Aggressive intimidation? Isn't the tube run by Ken Livingstone, are they suggesting he's putting the boot to the workers? I think the main thrust of hostility about the strike from the press is them having fun with Bob Crow for being on holiday in Egypt.

Shame none of the negotiations for these things are made public so people have a chance to see through the spin form both sides.

Yes I think they are suggesting Ken is putting the boot in.
 

Isambard

Dab of Rioja, Kitten? :D
Oxpecker said:
Her Majesty's Railway Inspectorate are failing to answer their phones :rolleyes:
One alway though they were "above politics" if you like. But passenger and staff safety aren't. As we saw at Hatfield, at Southall, at a station near you soon.....
 

pk

drink flounce rinse repeat
Isn't Bob Crow actually sunning himself up on the shores of the Red Sea at the moment??

Funny.

Also funny is the huge wave of support for this strike from people who don't even live in London.

I'm on the side of the staff, fuck the greedy management, but I don't think much of Bob Crow.

I'd sooner see a week long strike starting the 3rd Jan rather than the NYE tube system fall down, but then that's just me, I'd sooner see businessmen screwed over than partygoers and people who can't afford to get out much.
 

scott_forester

probably talking shite
pk said:
I'm on the side of the staff, fuck the greedy management, but I don't think much of Bob Crow.
This is where my confusion lies I'm not sure the management are 'greedy' from what TfL are saying they were able to offer staff a a pay rise and reduced hours because they are all running a more effective railway with things like Oyster Cards etc. In normal industrial relations wouldn't the atypical management team just make lots of people redundant?

Here they seemed to want to make sure people keep their jobs, get better pay and shorter hours. The argument seems to be how to do that. However as both sides are basically politicians it's difficult to tell with the furious spinning that seems to be going on.
 

Isambard

Dab of Rioja, Kitten? :D
pk said:
Also funny is the huge wave of support for this strike from people who don't even live in London.

Wondered when that fucking little argument was due to appear on here.
Really thought the anti-tube worker brigade would have floated it out earlier but anyway.

I don't live in Iraq but I've got an opinion on that.
I don't live in South Africa but I was against Apartheid

etc etc

When I am in London which is fairly often I use public transport and I want the system to be safe and well run and I put my faith more in tube workers rather than privateers to do it thanks.
 

rennie

m'enfin!
LD Rudeboy said:
Why is it the tube drivers weren't striking in support of their fellow tube workers? :confused:

I wondered that as well. was the strike successful? I used the tube on NYE n it got me to my destination!
 

Oxpecker

gwaharddedig canolwr cont
LD Rudeboy said:
Why is it the tube drivers weren't striking in support of their fellow tube workers? :confused:
Very good question :(

Essentially it would have been deemed illegal because we already have a 35 hour week so weren't included in the ballot. A small number of drivers on some lines refused to take trains through the pipe on the grounds of safety (insufficient numbers of qualified staff on duty) but the instruction from RMT HQ was that drivers report for duty as usual.

If the strike goes ahead later this month I suspect (I hope :mad: ) the organisation will be a lot better and a large number of drivers will support the action. Without wishing to be critical of our leaders, the strike on NYE was a bit shambolic.
 

shandy

shit band, no fans
LD Rudeboy said:
Why is it the tube drivers weren't striking in support of their fellow tube workers? :confused:
I would guess that it's because the dispute was about the rostering of station staff and not tube drivers. The (anti) trade union laws in this country only allow you to strike in very limited circumstances in furtherance of your trade dispute.

As the drivers weren't officially directly affected it may have been possible for LU to take out an injunction against the union to stop the drivers striking, or even to get the whole thing called off.

I'm sure Oxpecker will be able to explain it all.


Edit: Beaten by Oxpecker's punctuality.
 

shandy

shit band, no fans
Oxpecker said:
V A small number of drivers on some lines refused to take trains through the pipe on the grounds of safety (insufficient numbers of qualified staff on duty) but the instruction from RMT HQ was that drivers report for duty as usual.

Will there be any comeback against the few drivers who refused to take trains out on H&S grounds?
 

LDR

kiwitanga
Oxpecker said:
If the strike goes ahead later this month I suspect (I hope :mad: ) the organisation will be a lot better and a large number of drivers will support the action. Without wishing to be critical of our leaders, the strike on NYE was a bit shambolic.
Yeah, here's hoping the next one achieves the desired results.
 

BarryB

New Member
scott_forester said:
If they aren't even going to leave the office they may as well just be CCTV staff then. Not sure I could watch a women being abused by a pissed begger.
Depends on the circumstances. If you thought that the beggar might have a knive would you intervene?

BarryB
 

JTG

Angry about not being able to be an astronaut.
Fail to see the reevance of Bob Crow's whereabouts tbh, is he not allowed a holiday then?
 

scott_forester

probably talking shite
JTG said:
Fail to see the reevance of Bob Crow's whereabouts tbh, is he not allowed a holiday then?
I don't think it matters either, although he can't really moan about the press highlighting it.He must have known some journalists would point out to him that public services are prohibited by law to strike and Trade Unionists have been jailed there.
 
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